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Did you mean $14.95? You wrote $104.95.

Keith (Zeeth) - A very Happy Birthday . wishes to you! Enjoy your youth, it does not last very long.

Many thanks to those who ruined and caused by post on palm fossils to be driven offtropic and closed. I really appreciate it and love to see my topic hijacked.

Eric, I was gardening yesterday so missed the computer posting and viewing. It got me to read the thread though --- I will try to post on it contructively and further, I salute Dean for all the efforts on our behalfs Best wishes, Ed (Ed - I had to remove your first comment in this post. Definitely offensive to some forum members - bgl)

Hi Keith, I would use Milorganite, a slow release organic fertilizer with 4% iron. I have used this with pelletized lime to treat my windowpane which is now starting to turn green. Chlorosis can be caused by any one of iron, magnesium deficiencies or soil pH. Our soils tend to be too acid, and also have little mineral content. A little lime adds magnesium and pushes pH towards neutral, and adding milorganite adds the iron. a soil pH that is too acid leads to poor magnesium bioavailability. Here is a link with the pH/bioavailability of various micro/macro nutrients. http://www.avocadosource.com/tools/FertCalc_files/pH.htm Tom

Add me to the list of classic blue users. I guess old dogs just don't like having to learn new tricks . gmp

Don't forget to make the jelly! (syrup, too!) Jackie

Please understand that we do not and cannot read every single post within minutes of when it is posted. We do eat and sleep, and manage to get a little gardening in here and there. If you would like to see more threads saved from those who choose to insert personal political, religious, or sexually oriented subject matter, I would like to encourage the membership to take advantage of the "Report" feature. When you read a post that opens the door to discussions about religion, politics, sexual content, etc. "Report" it. That will get a notice to me immediately via email. Then I will see it whenever I check email, which is several times a day. That will prevent the fast-fire back and forth comments that inevitable ensue when the door to controversy is opened. It is this fast moving back and forth that makes it very time consuming to surgically repair all of the individual posts, and to keep things so that the thread flows coherently. In addition, every time a post was "quoted" needs to be found and corrected as well. Of course the solution is to stay away from controversial discussions unless they are about palms In other words, the members can police and save threads better than we can. As soon as someone challenges Darwinism with claims about the Bible and creationism, or Al Gore is mentioned in connection with the politics of Global Warming, "Report" it. We will have much more of a chance to save worthwhile threads the earlier troublesome posts are seen.

I sprouted mine in March; some have 3 leaves and some have 7, and the rest are in between. All have received the same care, same water, same soil, same size pots, same sunlight, so I think it's genetic.

Thanks! I will repost the topic. I have been interesred in prehistoric plants especially during the Cretaceous Period when "modern" angiosperms began appearing and mixing with more ancient conifers, ferns, etc. I'm not sure which came first palmate or pinnate but from what I have read the Sabalites, Phoenicites, Nypa were amongst the oldest of palms similar to those of today. And then there is whatever the ancestor was that palms and pandans split from and this similarity is still evident in the inflorescence of Nypa, which is very similar to Pandanus.

Thanks Kris. Butias here in Augusta will bear seed when they are pretty small. I have B. odorata, paraguayensis, capitata, purpurescens, eriospatha, yatay, catarinensis and Butia x Jubaea. Some of these may just be varieties of capitata. The taxonomy of Butia seems to be up in the air; at least, I don't understand the breakdown of the genus. Maybe somebody can tell me what is a legitimate species and what is a varietal type of capitata.

Eric, I'm very sorry we had to remove your thread. At this point it would require too much editing to clean it up and revive it, but there's a simple solution. Start a new thread with your initial photo and comment and invite discussion. And this time we'll be more vigilant and any post that strays will be deleted quickly. Bo-Göran

Yes it was a very good topic, imagine what Darwin must have endured in his age. You are in good company Eric. It is a shame the administrators dont have facility to delete individual posts and ban the troublemakers to prevent them reappearing. Maybe this could be a future feature ?

It is good you brought this up Eric. Just a few hours back, before you wrote this, I messaged Bo to say that it was regrettable that the discussion - which could otherwise have been very enlightening, was cut short. I am very keen to understand early evolution of palms and the intermediate forms between palms of today and ancient monocots.

Jeff- I am going to get them before you do if it is the last thing I do.

I was using the classic blue. For one thing the text was little larger and easier to read. But since the "fix", I already was not able to search posts and topics by me or others. I switched to the new thing version and can do what I used to at least.

I have been out for a few hours, but thank you Dean, for closing this thread. And since this thread is now closed there definitely won't be any discussion about what science is. We can all have different opinions about lots of things, including politics and religion to name two hot topics that won't be disccussed here on PalmTalk, but I have a strong hunch that the majority will understand what science is. And Ben, since it was your original post that caused this thread to veer away from what could have been an interesting discussion, let me just add that using a word like "Biblical" automatically adds a religious connotation. Like it or not. And I have never met a scientist who was under the impression that the earth is only "thousands of years old". Then again, we probably move in different circles!

This thread is not going in a productive direction. I am closing it. Since Bo has already commented and gave a warning, he may choose to respond and/or reopen it. But until then I am stopping its downhill trajectory.

We will stick to science here on PalmTalk, whether it's appreciated or not. That's after all how palms are described and given genus and species names. Opinions based on religion will not be tolerated, and any further religious propaganda WILL get deleted.

Yup, I didn't think it would take long before someone commented on what I had to say, because, after all, I'm going against the current of the times. Right? First of all, it appears to me, that you're the one that's getting personal by saying I'm headed for 'disaster', when I thought all along this forum was created for all to give their opinions... no matter how different it may be. No Amigo? The truth is, you could have, as you say, ignored what I had to say, and continued with the topic above me, if you simply did not believe my point of view... or, (more likely) I hit a nerve and you couldn't control your temper flare. Again, I'm just expressing the fact, as few of us that there are (including the late Johnny Cash), that not everybody believes in the 'million of years old' theory of this created earth. Sure, I'm happy that you're happy to continue to share this forum, so let's continue to agree to disagree, and not isolate a certain person, as 'wierd' as it may seem to you, that he's the odd-ball headed for 'disaster'. Also, be open-minded to the fact that, yup, even today, it is possible to be wrong. Also, currents can be deceiving in a rip-current of a post-modern, post-Christian, American culture. You're advising someone else to be open-minded are you? Did you actually read your own reply as you typed it? I think you need to take your own advice mate.

I know I'm going to regret stating this here, but I think based on the current body of scientific knowledge, the idea that the earth is merely thousands of years old just does not make sense. That said, the pictured fossil is amazing! It does look very much like the leaves of some fan palm species alive today. -Michael

Looks like it got beaten with an ugly stick and then misted weekly with round-up. Kill it before it has children!

Last weekend I was helping teach a naturalist class and someone asked if all palms really want to be pinnate instead of palmate. We were looking at young Sabal palmettos that have costapalmate leaves which eventually turn into palmate leaves. Any thoughts or scientific evidence of this? Are the older species palmate and the younger species pinnate?