I purchased a 32 inch box alfredii, it looked amazing for 3 months and now it looks perfect for Halloween. Its scary.

I have decided to do what many Floridian members did and just put it out of its misery.

Im considering replacing it with some tender cunninghamianas.

I figure of they die it wont cost me $1000 and it wont be a pain to remove. What do you guys think? I’ve heard alexander is better in full sun. This area gets blasted all day in full sun.

I'd choose A. alexandrae over cunninghamiana if Californian heat and UV is anything like where I am. Alexandrae handles it much better especially when young.

Plant a Bismarckia there, if you insist on archontophoenix, a nice triple planting of Alexander’s would look good! A nice baroni black petiole would seal the deal for me. And give the street a wow factor.

2 hours ago, Jayce said:

I'd choose A. alexandrae over cunninghamiana if Californian heat and UV is anything like where I am. Alexandrae handles it much better especially when young.

It’s definitely 10-11 uv index all summer. Its usually low to high 90s with the occasional heat wave where we see 100-103 multiple days.

2 hours ago, happypalms said:

Plant a Bismarckia there, if you insist on archontophoenix, a nice triple planting of Alexander’s would look good! A nice baroni black petiole would seal the deal for me. And give the street a wow factor.

The Australian palms are my favorite aesthetic wise. My wife does not like the blue in the bismarkia. It certainly looks interesting and there’s a cheap one at Home Depot. I live too far from the coast otherwise id get a few kentias and call it a day.

In your experience, Alexanders do better in full sun?

38 minutes ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

The Australian palms are my favorite aesthetic wise. My wife does not like the blue in the bismarkia. It certainly looks interesting and there’s a cheap one at Home Depot. I live too far from the coast otherwise id get a few kentias and call it a day.

In your experience, Alexanders do better in full sun?

Alexander are the better of the two for lots of sun, bangalows tend to yellow a bit in full sun. I have seen bangalows in full sun but that is after they have broken through the canopy and that’s with all of there habitat surrounding them in the microclimate. If you’re up for Australian palms ptychosperma elegans triple planted, Normanbya Normanbyi, I won’t dare say the foxtail palm.

Howea grow quite well inland away from the coast, although iam unfamiliar with your climate zone for them, but a Howea bellmooreana would look pretty neat there, again a triple planting of fosteriana would look good.

1 hour ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

It’s definitely 10-11 uv index all summer. Its usually low to high 90s with the occasional heat wave where we see 100-103 multiple days.

Alex will take that fine. Where I am we get up to 43c / 109f for a few days at a time, keep the water up and mulch over the roots then you wouldn't have issues.

44 minutes ago, happypalms said:

Alexander are the better of the two for lots of sun, bangalows tend to yellow a bit in full sun. I have seen bangalows in full sun but that is after they have broken through the canopy and that’s with all of there habitat surrounding them in the microclimate. If you’re up for Australian palms ptychosperma elegans triple planted, Normanbya Normanbyi, I won’t dare say the foxtail palm.

Howea grow quite well inland away from the coast, although iam unfamiliar with your climate zone for them, but a Howea bellmooreana would look pretty neat there, again a triple planting of fosteriana would look good.

Agreed, I've found atleast till the bangalows are trunking they just get burnt.
I have two Ptychosperma elegans planted both do okay in the sun, cold winter winds here make them a bit straggly. Normanbya I only had very young ones and they got fried even in dappled shade.
Kentia bit like the alex and bangalows, keep water up and they can take it but definitely do better once they trunk and emerge from shade also.

1 hour ago, happypalms said:

Alexander are the better of the two for lots of sun, bangalows tend to yellow a bit in full sun. I have seen bangalows in full sun but that is after they have broken through the canopy and that’s with all of there habitat surrounding them in the microclimate. If you’re up for Australian palms ptychosperma elegans triple planted, Normanbya Normanbyi, I won’t dare say the foxtail palm.

Howea grow quite well inland away from the coast, although iam unfamiliar with your climate zone for them, but a Howea bellmooreana would look pretty neat there, again a triple planting of fosteriana would look good.

I agree the alexanders are a lot better in florida sun than bangalows and they are ok with continually wet roots. The OP has a spot there that would not work for a bismarckia anyway, it doesn't drain and the Alfredii -which has the same soil drainage requirements as bismarckia- rotted the roots. Ive never seen an Alfredii die that fast, very few have died in 9b+. Alexanders are a lot less cold hardy(5-6 deegrees F?) than either bismarckia or BA, but they don't mind wet roots as they grow surface roots not the deep roots of the others. The alexanders may get burned when small, but he could always put a net over them for a year while they develop roots. Here is my alfredii triple 6-7 years ago back when I could still get a pic of the whole triple. These were 8+ years in the ground from a 1 gallon. They will; grow a bit faster and will get a bigger root system and canopy if you space them out little like this triple. For scale, the fence is 7'.

1 hour ago, sonoranfans said:

I agree the alexanders are a lot better in florida sun than bangalows and they are ok with continually wet roots. The OP has a spot there that would not work for a bismarckia anyway, it doesn't drain and the Alfredii -which has the same soil drainage requirements as bismarckia- rotted the roots. Ive never seen an Alfredii die that fast, very few have died in 9b+. Alexanders are a lot less cold hardy(5-6 deegrees F?) than either bismarckia or BA, but they don't mind wet roots as they grow surface roots not the deep roots of the others. The alexanders may get burned when small, but he could always put a net over them for a year while they develop roots. Here is my alfredii triple 6-7 years ago back when I could still get a pic of the whole triple. These were 8+ years in the ground from a 1 gallon. They will; grow a bit faster and will get a bigger root system and canopy if you space them out little like this triple. For scale, the fence is 7'.

Once I remove the Alfredii i'm gonna have the drainage issue fixed. I'm not going to make the same mistake twice. Unfortunately, I'm no longer willing to spend a $1,000+ on a palm tree. I can buy a 25 gallon king palm for $250 bucks in nearby San Fernando Valley. I know this may sound high for Floridians, but its reasonable in California. How cold hardy are these? I believe the lowest temp recorded in the last 20 years has been 28f, but the area has considerably warmed up in the last 10 years, it rarely falls below freezing. Its much more of a solid 10a climate that previous decades.

3 hours ago, happypalms said:

Alexander are the better of the two for lots of sun, bangalows tend to yellow a bit in full sun. I have seen bangalows in full sun but that is after they have broken through the canopy and that’s with all of there habitat surrounding them in the microclimate. If you’re up for Australian palms ptychosperma elegans triple planted, Normanbya Normanbyi, I won’t dare say the foxtail palm.

Howea grow quite well inland away from the coast, although iam unfamiliar with your climate zone for them, but a Howea bellmooreana would look pretty neat there, again a triple planting of fosteriana would look good.

I could be wrong but I don't think the ptychosperma survive in my climate. Thats much more of a Florida palm. I'm in a dry Mediterranean climate, we have diurnal shifts in humidity and temparture. We can be at 38 degrees Celsius and 30% humidity and by early am be at 20 degrees celsius at 65% humidity.

Howea Forsteriana for me are one of the most beautiful palms in the world. I can grow them but they need to be in full shade. The sun is simply too strong and will burn the fronds. You have to live no more than 15 miles from the coast to plant them in full sun. I am not sure about the bellmoreana you would know better than me, but it would definitely be more of a specialty palm. Most nurseries don't carry it here.

I will concur with others. My A. Alexandrae was planted out at a 10” size , in full sun. It stabilized much faster than the Cunninghamiana . Both species do well here but I have a bit more coastal influence . These heat waves will come and go and only the oldest fronds show any damage . It has been here over 25 years , seen triple digit temps many times , cold into the low 40’s , and seems to love it here. The swollen base gives it a bit of interest as it ages . The silver underside to the leaves and dark green uppers would give a nice look to that area. Look for sun grown examples to plant . Harry

This was a few years ago.

20 minutes ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

Once I remove the Alfredii i'm gonna have the drainage issue fixed. I'm not going to make the same mistake twice. Unfortunately, I'm no longer willing to spend a $1,000+ on a palm tree. I can buy a 25 gallon king palm for $250 bucks in nearby San Fernando Valley. I know this may sound high for Floridians, but its reasonable in California. How cold hardy are these? I believe the lowest temp recorded in the last 20 years has been 28f, but the area has considerably warmed up in the last 10 years, it rarely falls below freezing. Its much more of a solid 10a climate that previous decades.

I can relate, I killed my first big container palm, $600, by handling it by the trunk. It was too heavy for me to plant gently without a bobcat and it had sensitive roots. We live and learn, and I do understand that palms in california are a lot more expensive than here, I lived there for 7 years. 54" rain a year will make them cheaper to grow here to a good box size. Most of us on palmtalk started out wanting that immediate impact. It is very rarely worth it for the faster growing species. With your heat you should be able to grow things quickly given enough water and some fertilizer. Remember that those Alexandre will need a lot more water out in the open like that compared with a bismarckia or alfredii. Wind dries things out much faster and if the roots can't take up enough water, you get brown leaves generally oldest first. When you plant a palm from a container it has small roots that have a limit for how much water they can take up. I would wait to plant those alexandre till it doesnt hit 85F any more. Over the winter it has a chance to grow roots before the hot weather tests those roots for how much water they can supply. At some point, watering more doesn't solve the problem of a small root system. For Alexandre, make the soil pretty rich in organics and perlite with y our clay. The perlite hold water and will prevent soil compaction which is often a cause of poor drainage. Deeper drainage gives deeper roots and they may give a much healthier tree in the inland heat.

59 minutes ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

I could be wrong but I don't think the ptychosperma survive in my climate. Thats much more of a Florida palm. I'm in a dry Mediterranean climate, we have diurnal shifts in humidity and temparture. We can be at 38 degrees Celsius and 30% humidity and by early am be at 20 degrees celsius at 65% humidity.

Howea Forsteriana for me are one of the most beautiful palms in the world. I can grow them but they need to be in full shade. The sun is simply too strong and will burn the fronds. You have to live no more than 15 miles from the coast to plant them in full sun. I am not sure about the bellmoreana you would know better than me, but it would definitely be more of a specialty palm. Most nurseries don't carry it here.

I just planted my first Ptychosperma. I had the same opinion as you , I thought it was much too tropical for my environment. Then I went down to @DoomsDave place in La Habra , very similar climate to mine , even closer to your climate. He had a beauty down there . I was so excited to learn I could grow them , if I get the right species . I came home with a juvenile Ptychosperma Sandereanum and planted it in our courtyard. It gets warm afternoon sun from about 12:30pm -about4pm depending on time of year. It is planted not far from the A. Alexandrae. It has been in the ground a couple of weeks and already opened a new frond. Harry

I have hope this will be a great grower in my warm inland climate. The one Dave has is superb . Maybe partial shade out there where you are. If you go to Dave’s in La Habra , he has a great selection of palms that may work in warmer climates. He has mature specimens in the ground so you can see what they will look like , also a great knowledge of what will work for you.

Edit- I will say , we water A LOT! I have fast draining soil and a sunny south facing lot.

58 minutes ago, Harry’s Palms said:

I just planted my first Ptychosperma. I had the same opinion as you , I thought it was much too tropical for my environment. Then I went down to @DoomsDave place in La Habra , very similar climate to mine , even closer to your climate. He had a beauty down there . I was so excited to learn I could grow them , if I get the right species . I came home with a juvenile Ptychosperma Sandereanum and planted it in our courtyard. It gets warm afternoon sun from about 12:30pm -about4pm depending on time of year. It is planted not far from the A. Alexandrae. It has been in the ground a couple of weeks and already opened a new frond. Harry

I have hope this will be a great grower in my warm inland climate. The one Dave has is superb . Maybe partial shade out there where you are. If you go to Dave’s in La Habra , he has a great selection of palms that may work in warmer climates. He has mature specimens in the ground so you can see what they will look like , also a great knowledge of what will work for you.

Edit- I will say , we water A LOT! I have fast draining soil and a sunny south facing lot.

What a beauty. Do you know where I can find good alexander kings in your area? Id rather drive down the 126 then the 405 lol

13 hours ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

I purchased a 32 inch box alfredii, it looked amazing for 3 months and now it looks perfect for Halloween. Its scary.

I have decided to do what many Floridian members did and just put it out of its misery.

Im considering replacing it with some tender cunninghamianas.

I figure of they die it wont cost me $1000 and it wont be a pain to remove. What do you guys think? I’ve heard alexander is better in full sun. This area gets blasted all day in full sun.

Looks like you lost that palm because you didn’t drip irrigate the root ball and it dried out. What happens to these large boxed up palm specimens is that they repel water wants the root ball is dry and the water just goes into the surrounding wet soil. I’ve lost plants that way here in Hilo where it rains a ton. Once the rootball dries out the only thing that I can bring it back is to actually put a drip directly onto the root ball so the water can slowly penetrate into the tree.

Florida gets such sporadic rainfall that you really gotta watch out for that drying effect especially in those Sandy soils.

I would second the recommendation to stick with Alexander Palms because the regular king palm is not suited for the tropics.

I have a lot of Alfredo palms in the ground and they all look ratty. My biggest regret in that regards is to not have chosen the fenestralis species of Madagascar, coconut palms. That one looks so much better and grows so much better in the tropics. I think the Alfredii likes cooler Highland conditions.

I think you'll be fine with almost all the archontophoenix maybe except purpurea. Our climates are similar and I have Purpurea, maxima, tuckeri, myolensis, Alexandra and cunninghamiana. all grow great except the parpurea which always looks a bit anemic and never colors up great for me. they do like lots of water. My one bit of advice no matter which one you pick would to buy one that has not started trunking yet. The trunks in pots are stunted and will be permanently deformed and you will have to cover up the ugly part of the trunk with air plants and orchids......not that im speaking form experience.... They are super fast so they will form a trunk in no time and it will look way nicer. I do like the idea of a big fat blue Bizzy too though if you're open to a fan palm.

1 hour ago, Mauna Kea Cloudforest said:

Looks like you lost that palm because you didn’t drip irrigate the root ball and it dried out. What happens to these large boxed up palm specimens is that they repel water wants the root ball is dry and the water just goes into the surrounding wet soil. I’ve lost plants that way here in Hilo where it rains a ton. Once the rootball dries out the only thing that I can bring it back is to actually put a drip directly onto the root ball so the water can slowly penetrate into the tree.

Florida gets such sporadic rainfall that you really gotta watch out for that drying effect especially in those Sandy soils.

I would second the recommendation to stick with Alexander Palms because the regular king palm is not suited for the tropics.

I have a lot of Alfredo palms in the ground and they all look ratty. My biggest regret in that regards is to not have chosen the fenestralis species of Madagascar, coconut palms. That one looks so much better and grows so much better in the tropics. I think the Alfredii likes cooler Highland conditions.

I genuinely don't know. I think I made a big mistake buying a large palm. The 15 gallon palms I bought have done well. I think I may have drowned the palm by watering it so much. I have heavy clay and potentially a drainage issue.

1 hour ago, Mauna Kea Cloudforest said:

Looks like you lost that palm because you didn’t drip irrigate the root ball and it dried out. What happens to these large boxed up palm specimens is that they repel water wants the root ball is dry and the water just goes into the surrounding wet soil. I’ve lost plants that way here in Hilo where it rains a ton. Once the rootball dries out the only thing that I can bring it back is to actually put a drip directly onto the root ball so the water can slowly penetrate into the tree.

Florida gets such sporadic rainfall that you really gotta watch out for that drying effect especially in those Sandy soils.

I would second the recommendation to stick with Alexander Palms because the regular king palm is not suited for the tropics.

I have a lot of Alfredo palms in the ground and they all look ratty. My biggest regret in that regards is to not have chosen the fenestralis species of Madagascar, coconut palms. That one looks so much better and grows so much better in the tropics. I think the Alfredii likes cooler Highland conditions.

I think the madagascar highlands are seasonally dry and wet compared with one of the wettest areas in Hilo. Do bismarckia do well there? They are just 1500 feet above alfredii . Might be rocky soil is that is the site. I have seen bismarckia in miami in rocky limestone soil and they hated it. Thin trunks about half the typical diameter here. Alfredii are just about 2 decades in cultivation, they might do better on the west side of the big island.

1 hour ago, Stevetoad said:

I think you'll be fine with almost all the archontophoenix maybe except purpurea. Our climates are similar and I have Purpurea, maxima, tuckeri, myolensis, Alexandra and cunninghamiana. all grow great except the parpurea which always looks a bit anemic and never colors up great for me. they do like lots of water. My one bit of advice no matter which one you pick would to buy one that has not started trunking yet. The trunks in pots are stunted and will be permanently deformed and you will have to cover up the ugly part of the trunk with air plants and orchids......not that im speaking form experience.... They are super fast so they will form a trunk in no time and it will look way nicer. I do like the idea of a big fat blue Bizzy too though if you're open to a fan palm.

My wife does not like the blue, she likes the Mediterranean fan palms, but i'm not a fan. I think you're right. Getting large palms in boxes was a dumb idea. I wanted immediate results and paid the price. I ended up losing money and still ending up with nothing in the front.

19 minutes ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

My wife does not like the blue, she likes the Mediterranean fan palms, but i'm not a fan. I think you're right. Getting large palms in boxes was a dumb idea. I wanted immediate results and paid the price. I ended up losing money and still ending up with nothing in the front.

I wouldn’t say it’s dumb idea. We all want fast results. As far as the Bismarck I would show her a few in person (assuming you haven’t). Maybe she’s thinking of a brahea and doesn’t like those. But a massive, silver self cleaning Bismarck is a nice center piece. A sabal mauritiiformis would be a unique look too. Maybe don’t over think it. You’ll eventually end up like the rest of us and have a jungle anyway 🤣

Hmm , not sure who has any Alexandrae. You might check with Green Thumb in Ventura , call first. Perhaps put a post on the sub forum of Palm Talk classifieds . I’m not sure if @DoomsDave would know of where they could be found , but he is pretty knowledgeable about who has what. It would be worth a drive to get one , especially from one of our private growers . Harry

5 hours ago, SCVpalmenthusiast said:

Once I remove the Alfredii i'm gonna have the drainage issue fixed. I'm not going to make the same mistake twice. Unfortunately, I'm no longer willing to spend a $1,000+ on a palm tree. I can buy a 25 gallon king palm for $250 bucks in nearby San Fernando Valley. I know this may sound high for Floridians, but its reasonable in California. How cold hardy are these? I believe the lowest temp recorded in the last 20 years has been 28f, but the area has considerably warmed up in the last 10 years, it rarely falls below freezing. Its much more of a solid 10a climate that previous decades.

No need to fix drainage problem if you plant Archotophoenix in that spot. They LOVE wet feet. They will grow happily even in stagnant water. I know since some of the fifty Archontophoenix growing in my yard have submerged roots year round.

1 hour ago, Jim in Los Altos said:

No need to fix drainage problem if you plant Archotophoenix in that spot. They LOVE wet feet. They will grow happily even in stagnant water. I know since some of the fifty Archontophoenix growing in my yard have submerged roots year round.

I would have thought that was the case for the Alfredii but it croaked. Now I have a scare crow on the lawn. Luckily, spooky season is upon us. I absolutely LOVE the look of king palms. They make for an amazing skyline.

I noticed Mercedez Benz of Valencia has what appears to be an alexander king palm or maxima in full sun. You experts know better than me, the petioles don't look like cunninghamiana. It doesn't look bad. Its the first business I have seen with a king palm in the front.