I was looking at some rainforest in north qld the other day and spotted these palms. Lots of purple on these ones.

The seedlings from these plants lacked any white under the leaves or the little whiskers on the midrib that cunninghamiana has. Any thoughts.

Another one

Those are fine examples! Didn’t folks used to refer to this palm as Mt. Lewis or something? The Sullivans here have a beauty , unfortunately too tall to see the crownshaft. Harry

This has been there a super long time.

I believe the palm on the left is the Archontophoenix. The garden is very old. Not sure what the large one on the right is. These were taken a while ago when I was gathering seeds.

1 hour ago, Harry’s Palms said:

Those are fine examples! Didn’t folks used to refer to this palm as Mt. Lewis or something? The Sullivans here have a beauty , unfortunately too tall to see the crownshaft. Harry

This has been there a super long time.

I believe the palm on the left is the Archontophoenix. The garden is very old. Not sure what the large one on the right is. These were taken a while ago when I was gathering seeds.

This can’t be Archontophoenix purpurea, what was called Archontophoenix sp Mt Lewis. Archontophoenix purpurea is white under the leaves with those little whiskers under the middle vein. These palms have neither.

This area is around 900km (540 miles) further south than Mt Lewis. It’s Mt Dalrymple at about 1000m altitude.

Archontophoenix purpurea has large fruit. These guys have small fruit like alexandrae. Lots of rotten seed on the ground. It’s a bit early for ripe fruit on these. Lots of pink flowers and immature fruit.

Very interesting and beautiful palms, thanks for sharing. Mt Dalrymple is close to Eungella which is known as the northernmost population of A. cunninghamiana. Bangalows also would be more likely to have this coloration than alexandrae, I think. I wonder if they might be hybrids. I would love to see more in depth study of the genus, clearly there is a lot of variability within especially A. cunninghamiana.

As you are aware of this is the colouration of the southern population of bangalows. Iam leaning on purperea that was my first thought. And as discussed with you iam sure if it was a different species they would be onto it. Keep looking you just never know what you will find.

Trucking around the country side, be calling you the Leyland brothers next or is that Malcom Douglas.

1 hour ago, Tyrone said:

This can’t be Archontophoenix purpurea, what was called Archontophoenix sp Mt Lewis. Archontophoenix purpurea is white under the leaves with those little whiskers under the middle vein. These palms have neither.

This area is around 900km (540 miles) further south than Mt Lewis. It’s Mt Dalrymple at about 1000m altitude.

Archontophoenix purpurea has large fruit. These guys have small fruit like alexandrae. Lots of rotten seed on the ground. It’s a bit early for ripe fruit on these. Lots of pink flowers and immature fruit.

I’m pretty sure that the Sullivans had this palm labeled correctly . Only one is Archontophoenix and the fronds and crown shaft are not visible in the photo . The fronds that are visible are not Archontophoenix but something else. The collection was started sometime in the 1950’s Pauline and her husband have both passed on but the son and , now grandson , are maintaining the properties that have the collections . The rotted fruit could be from something else , there are a lot of palms there and I’m not sure the Archie is fruiting , it is very old and super tall. It isn’t as tall as the Ceroxilyn but close! Unfortunately I couldn’t get a pic of the fronds or the Purple Crown , the trunk seems to disappear into the sky! Small city lot with lots of mature palms. I have Purple crown Archontophoenix juveniles from my friends palm and yes they have silver undersides like Maxima and Alexandrae . Harry

2 hours ago, Harry’s Palms said:

I’m pretty sure that the Sullivans had this palm labeled correctly . Only one is Archontophoenix and the fronds and crown shaft are not visible in the photo . The fronds that are visible are not Archontophoenix but something else. The collection was started sometime in the 1950’s Pauline and her husband have both passed on but the son and , now grandson , are maintaining the properties that have the collections . The rotted fruit could be from something else , there are a lot of palms there and I’m not sure the Archie is fruiting , it is very old and super tall. It isn’t as tall as the Ceroxilyn but close! Unfortunately I couldn’t get a pic of the fronds or the Purple Crown , the trunk seems to disappear into the sky! Small city lot with lots of mature palms. I have Purple crown Archontophoenix juveniles from my friends palm and yes they have silver undersides like Maxima and Alexandrae . Harry

I’m sorry I probably didn’t word it right. I don’t doubt that the palm you posted in Pauleen Sullivans garden is correctly labeled and really is Archontophoenix purpurea. What I meant was the palm I posted up can’t be Archontophoenix purpurea because it’s 900km south of the Mt Lewis area. The purple palm I posted has no white under the leaflets, or whiskers under the mid rib. All Archontophoenix purpurea are white underneath and have those whiskers. Seed size is vastly different between the two as well as first leaf size of seedlings. Archontophoenix purpurea has large bifid leaves for ages. These ones are small from the beginning.

Misunderstanding , sorry!

That is curious . The palm in your pic sure is purple , I didn’t even look at the fronds for further ID . Lovely palm though . Maybe the cooler mountain temps at play ? Harry

Some more pictures. Some details of a fallen leaf and seedlings.

A very tall one that the leaf fell off in the earlier picture

Hey Tyrone. I've seen mention that A. Cunninghamiana growing in the Eungella national park display the purple crownshaft quite like A. Purpurea.
Are you out that way perhaps?

A bit off topic, does the backside of the leaves of A purpurea combine ramenta with whitish wax?

4 minutes ago, Phoenikakias said:

A bit off topic, does the backside of the leaves of A purpurea combine ramenta with whitish wax?

That is correct. Silver/Grey abaxial with ramenta.

1 hour ago, Jayce said:

Hey Tyrone. I've seen mention that A. Cunninghamiana growing in the Eungella national park display the purple crownshaft quite like A. Purpurea.
Are you out that way perhaps?

I was out that way Jayce. That’s where these pics came from. I wasn’t expecting to see the purple crown shafts I was just looking to see if we could find any bangalows and we found these purple ones quite unlike any Bangalow I’d seen before.

Hey Tyrone, nice find!

I've got a couple of Bangalows from seed that I collected at Peases Lookout, at about 900m, not far from Mt Dalrymple. Still just young plants in pots, so don't know whether they'll have much colour or not yet, but I do recall the mature palms in the area looked quite distinct from their southern cousins, which is why I grabbed a few seeds.

I don't remember seeing anything like the ones you posted though...wild! Hopefully you found a few seeds?

Jonathan, it was your comments from 14 years ago on Palmtalk that made me go to Peases Lookout for Bangalows because the two times before that I visited Eungella I went the other way near the sky window and Broken River and I found mainly alexandrae. I didn’t know there was anything up Dalrymple road. All the palms at Peases Lookout appear to be this purple Bangalow. I was really stumped when I saw the ones at Peases Lookout and ventured further up Dalrymple Rd to find stunning rainforest and a place loaded with purple Bangalows. The next day we drove the entire length and started walking an overgrown track to Mt Dalrymple but only went 300-400m because the track was so overgrown and the sign said you need a topographic map, a gps, and good first aid because you’re on your own up there. We weren’t prepared, but I’d love to one day do that entire walk.

After Peases Lookout as you go higher the alexandrae are very hard to find if not no longer there. What was interesting is that the Calamus stop as well up the Dalrymple road.

So if you are growing the ones from Peases Lookout you have the purple version.

Once my eyes had been opened to the purple Bangalow I went down to Broken river and found a few of these purple ones there and found some seedlings which matched the ones at Peases Lookout and further up but that forest was dominated by alexandrae ( a beautiful version too). I found seedlings that matched the purple seedlings at Broken River ( green underneath and no ramenta). I even found a juvenile Bangalow that was the traditional full green with small ramenta. So maybe there are 3 types of Archontophoenix growing up there. It pays to look at the details.

So Jonathan, it was thanks to you that I found these. Your ones are the purple form.

Any pictures? What do the leaf undersides look like.

I’m not a botanist, just a humble horticulturist, but if this version of purple Bangalow was named, I reckon Archontophoenix cunninghamiana var dalrymplensis would be a good one for the purple picabeen.

Naming things is purely academic though. The real fun is in the growing.

1 hour ago, Tyrone said:

Jonathan, it was your comments from 14 years ago on Palmtalk that made me go to Peases Lookout for Bangalows because the two times before that I visited Eungella I went the other way near the sky window and Broken River and I found mainly alexandrae. I didn’t know there was anything up Dalrymple road. All the palms at Peases Lookout appear to be this purple Bangalow. I was really stumped when I saw the ones at Peases Lookout and ventured further up Dalrymple Rd to find stunning rainforest and a place loaded with purple Bangalows. The next day we drove the entire length and started walking an overgrown track to Mt Dalrymple but only went 300-400m because the track was so overgrown and the sign said you need a topographic map, a gps, and good first aid because you’re on your own up there. We weren’t prepared, but I’d love to one day do that entire walk.

After Peases Lookout as you go higher the alexandrae are very hard to find if not no longer there. What was interesting is that the Calamus stop as well up the Dalrymple road.

So if you are growing the ones from Peases Lookout you have the purple version.

Once my eyes had been opened to the purple Bangalow I went down to Broken river and found a few of these purple ones there and found some seedlings which matched the ones at Peases Lookout and further up but that forest was dominated by alexandrae ( a beautiful version too). I found seedlings that matched the purple seedlings at Broken River ( green underneath and no ramenta). I even found a juvenile Bangalow that was the traditional full green with small ramenta. So maybe there are 3 types of Archontophoenix growing up there. It pays to look at the details.

So Jonathan, it was thanks to you that I found these. Your ones are the purple form.

Any pictures? What do the leaf undersides look like.

Great stuff Tyrone, I'll meet you up there in a few years for the full Dalrymple Expedition, although it sounds like we might need some guys with machetes to walk in front! We drove a bit past Peases Lookout but turned back before the forest that you found, regrettably.

A cunninghamiana var dalrymplensis sounds good to me...the Eungella Bangalow, quite a mouthful. I'll take some pics of mine this morning and post them shortly.

Here we go, A cunninghamiana var dalrymplensis!

These were abandoned in small tubes for many years in a deep dark corner of the greenhouse, as I'd given up on planting anything at South Arm that needed water. When we bought our new place a few years ago, with it's abundance of water I banged them into these big pots without any expectations, but they've rebounded nicely and are ready to go in the ground.

Not sure how different they look from any other Bangalow at this stage but time will tell.

Sorry, the close up pics aren't great. The ramenta extends up the petiole on the newer leaves but is almost absent on the rachis. There is no ramenta at all on the petioles of the older, smaller leaves, as per the seedlings you saw.

I just checked and there are several purple crownshaft Archontophoenix visible on the lower section of Dalrymple Rd on google maps (the only section with streetview) mixed in with a multitude of what looks like A alexandrae. Beautiful palms, would love to visit that area someday.

@Tyrone Consider adding the ones you found as observations to inaturalist, there is very little data on Archontophoenix from that area and it would be a good start for someone in the future to come along and study this population.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/D3Y34p55U8h1dZdV6

https://maps.app.goo.gl/x2kRFuYU9bqrmrcg9

Jonathan, we need better images of the dog.

11 hours ago, Jonathan said:

Here we go, A cunninghamiana var dalrymplensis!

These were abandoned in small tubes for many years in a deep dark corner of the greenhouse, as I'd given up on planting anything at South Arm that needed water. When we bought our new place a few years ago, with it's abundance of water I banged them into these big pots without any expectations, but they've rebounded nicely and are ready to go in the ground.

Not sure how different they look from any other Bangalow at this stage but time will tell.

Hey Jonathan. They are beautiful healthy specimens. I think an Archontophoenix purpurea at that stage would be green still, so I reckon they will colour up in time, maybe when they are just about to start trunking which is when purpurea does it in my experience. I bet you can’t wait to get em into the ground at your new place. Does your new place have that brown gravelly volcanic stuff they have in QLD. I’m envious of that soil. You really see it when they clear the sugar cane and leave that dark brown soil behind.

Some locals stopped near the top of the Dalrymple road and we chatted for a bit. At the higher elevation where they are the annual rainfall is about 3500mm per year but Eungella is about half that and Broken River less again. All Archontophoenix love there water but these guys really must do as well. I reckon fortnightly seasol and fish emulsion with a tray of water underneath would supercharge these guys.

My Archontophoenix purpurea I leave in a tray of water even through winter in Albany and they seem to love it.

Thanks for posting the pics of your ones. They’re way special.

10 hours ago, aabell said:

I just checked and there are several purple crownshaft Archontophoenix visible on the lower section of Dalrymple Rd on google maps (the only section with streetview) mixed in with a multitude of what looks like A alexandrae. Beautiful palms, would love to visit that area someday.

@Tyrone Consider adding the ones you found as observations to inaturalist, there is very little data on Archontophoenix from that area and it would be a good start for someone in the future to come along and study this population.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/D3Y34p55U8h1dZdV6

https://maps.app.goo.gl/x2kRFuYU9bqrmrcg9

That is really cool. I didn’t think to try that myself. The purple shows up really well. Good idea about inaturalist.

11 hours ago, Darold Petty said:

Jonathan, we need better images of the dog.

By popular demand: Asta

11 months old, world class clown, spoilt little princess!

52 minutes ago, Tyrone said:

Does your new place have that brown gravelly volcanic stuff they have in QLD

Haha, no unfortunately, but at least it has soil...unlike South Arm, which has bottomless dune sand!

The new place has sandy loam over clay, with a natural hardpan in between, which we've deep ripped for drainage. Holds water very well, and most palms I've put in are doing well, including some Bangalows from NSW. Looking forward to planting these guys out and a forest of maxima's down the track!

This thread has reignited my interest in these palms...would be awesome if they show the purple one day, fingers crossed 🤞