Planting a beccariophoenix alfredii how cold tolerant are they

[Phoenikakias]

10 minutes ago, Than said:

My hands would be shaking adding fertilizer to such a small seedling.. I've got the Osmocote one but I was planning to use it only for bigger palms in the ground.

What is its duration?

[Than]

On 12/28/2025 at 4:45 PM, Phoenikakias said:

What is its duration?

I've just seen this. I got the Osmocote Pro 5-6M don't laugh, for orchids! It is 19-9-10 so perhaps not a good idea for palms? It was the only one I found on skroutz back then. However, I can find also Osmocote mini 15-9-11. 

Is there another Osmocote that's better and I can buy easily?

Btw @dimitriskedikogloy are you ready for tonight and tomorrow? Meteomatics says the lowest will be 0 C in Gerakini, which is not too bad.. the highest tomorrow though is only 4C! 

[Phoenikakias]

5 months is way too short if you do not utilize reverse osmosis to obtain irrigation water! 5 months work as reference at 25 C. With over 30 degree  duration drops unpredictably and periculously.  Also phosphorus seems to high, in another recent topic Australian growers mention phosphorus in the fertilizer not only needless but also detrimental!

[Than]

21 minutes ago, Phoenikakias said:

5 months is way too short if you do not utilize reverse osmosis to obtain irrigation water! 5 months work as reference at 25 C. With over 30 degree  duration drops unpredictably and periculously.  Also phosphorus seems to high, in another recent topic Australian growers mention phosphorus in the fertilizer not only needless but also detrimental!

Which one do you use?

[dimitriskedikogloy]

43 minutes ago, Than said:

I've just seen this. I got the Osmocote Pro 5-6M don't laugh, for orchids! It is 19-9-10 so perhaps not a good idea for palms? It was the only one I found on skroutz back then. However, I can find also Osmocote mini 15-9-11. 

Is there another Osmocote that's better and I can buy easily?

Btw @dimitriskedikogloy are you ready for tonight and tomorrow? Meteomatics says the lowest will be 0 C in Gerakini, which is not too bad.. the highest tomorrow though is only 4C! 

Well I’m not at my beach house in yerakini currently and don’t have anything planted there yet. I’m at my main residence in panorama Thessaloniki where I have a queen outside and the rest of my palms I keep indoors but yeah it’s way colder than yerakini here temps will drop to -3 as it did a week ago but surprisingly saw no damage to my queen although I have it next to the patio and cover it with frost cloth the frost doesn’t seem to come down to my garden since the building blocks northern winds

[Than]

20 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

Well I’m not at my beach house in yerakini currently and don’t have anything planted there yet. I’m at my main residence in panorama Thessaloniki where I have a queen outside and the rest of my palms I keep indoors but yeah it’s way colder than yerakini here temps will drop to -3 as it did a week ago but surprisingly saw no damage to my queen although I have it next to the patio and cover it with frost cloth the frost doesn’t seem to come down to my garden since the building blocks northern winds

Keep us updated about that Syagrus. Mine was under light frost last week. It seems fine so far. I hope yours makes it. I see that tomorrow the temperature in Panorama will be at or below 0 the whole day!

[Phoenikakias]

On 12/27/2025 at 3:02 PM, gyuseppe said:

 

Konstantinos has been growing palm trees for a long time, listen to him, don't be like me, who at the beginning tried everything, even if people older than me said that this species is not good for my climate, I didn't listen to them, and I lost many species uselessly, also time and money

I grow successfully 3 in the ground, all raised from seed. It is a shame I had lost all pictures of the transplant process together with my old smart phone! May you will be able to find the related topic in EPS, even there the search engine has changed making recovery of old threads extremely difficult.

[dimitriskedikogloy]

18 minutes ago, Than said:

Keep us updated about that Syagrus. Mine was under light frost last week. It seems fine so far. I hope yours makes it. I see that tomorrow the temperature in Panorama will be at or below 0 the whole day!

I will, it’s already lightly snowing. Well good news is we had a -3 night last week and my queen had almost 0 damage here is a photo of how the newest frond looks like (the other two where already stress damaged). But overall I believe my garden has a decent microclimate as temperatures on my thermometers are always 2-4 degrees higher than the radar 

[Phoenikakias]

On 12/27/2025 at 3:02 PM, gyuseppe said:

 

Konstantinos has been growing palm trees for a long time, listen to him, don't be like me, who at the beginning tried everything, even if people older than me said that this species is not good for my climate, I didn't listen to them, and I lost many species uselessly, also time and money

This topic:

https://www.palmsociety.org.uk/post/1/9039/148650

And this one number 4 and 6:

https://www.palmsociety.org.uk/post/1/6568/112956

[gyuseppe]

2 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

This topic:

https://www.palmsociety.org.uk/post/1/9039/148650

And this one number 4 and 6:

https://www.palmsociety.org.uk/post/1/6568/112956

yes Konstantinos I saw

[dimitriskedikogloy]

On 1/11/2026 at 2:42 PM, Than said:

Keep us updated about that Syagrus. Mine was under light frost last week. It seems fine so far. I hope yours makes it. I see that tomorrow the temperature in Panorama will be at or below 0 the whole day!

Update.

Everything looks fine I can’t notice any damage to the palm and I checked another house that is even more elevated than me and his potted queens looked just as fine so I think due to the fact that it was -3 but dry and windy the frost couldn’t build up or even sit properly on the palm so that’s my theory as to why they do just fine 

[Than]

12 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

Update.

Everything looks fine I can’t notice any damage to the palm and I checked another house that is even more elevated than me and his potted queens looked just as fine so I think due to the fact that it was -3 but dry and windy the frost couldn’t build up or even sit properly on the palm so that’s my theory as to why they do just fine 

It's too early to look for damage but yes, if frost did not form on the plant that's a good reason to be optimistic. I think it will be fine. 

[dimitriskedikogloy]

1 hour ago, Than said:

It's too early to look for damage but yes, if frost did not form on the plant that's a good reason to be optimistic. I think it will be fine. 

True but to be honest we have had the same temperatures a few weeks ago and it doesn’t start to even show any damage and tue queens in the area have been through these temperatures for a few years they don’t look in perfect condition obviously but not in a bad one either 

[Than]

40 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

True but to be honest we have had the same temperatures a few weeks ago and it doesn’t start to even show any damage and tue queens in the area have been through these temperatures for a few years they don’t look in perfect condition obviously but not in a bad one either 

I also believe that -3C without frost should be fine. As Pietro says: In its favour, as a matter of fact, it has a fast growth, the ease of transplant also for adult specimens, and a fairly good resistance to the low temperatures, up to -5 °C.

[Phoenikakias]

2 hours ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

True but to be honest we have had the same temperatures a few weeks ago and it doesn’t start to even show any damage and tue queens in the area have been through these temperatures for a few years they don’t look in perfect condition obviously but not in a bad one either 

the strain from Parana tableland would probably fit to your climate perfectly!

[Phoenikakias]

The story of my triple from pot to ground .

[sonoranfans]

On 1/11/2026 at 6:35 AM, Than said:

I've just seen this. I got the Osmocote Pro 5-6M don't laugh, for orchids! It is 19-9-10 so perhaps not a good idea for palms? It was the only one I found on skroutz back then. However, I can find also Osmocote mini 15-9-11. 

Is there another Osmocote that's better and I can buy easily?

Btw @dimitriskedikogloy are you ready for tonight and tomorrow? Meteomatics says the lowest will be 0 C in Gerakini, which is not too bad.. the highest tomorrow though is only 4C! 

many fertilizers dont have the Mg, Mn, Fe necessary for palms.  And yes as Konstantinos said the phos is too high.  Phospohates are not easily rinsed from the soil like Nitrogen and especially potassium.  This means that over time the phosphorus concentration rises and at some point it will interfere with uptake of several other nutrients needed to keep palms healthy.  You can make this much worse by trying to limit the cost of watering.  Drenching regularly will slow the accumulation of phosphorus a bit, failure to do so will aggravate the issue.  Get a good list of micronutrient contents.  I have used this fertilizer since 2011 and have had great growth including a 30 foot plus Beccariophoenix Alfredii in full sun and two others over 22 feet in part shade.

https://bigearthsupply.com/product/fertilizer-flo-8-2-12-palm-citrus-6mo-50lb-40/#:~:text=Florikan 8-2-12 180,!) or a hand spreader.

 

Florikan far outperformed osmocote over rated time.  FLorikan uses prills containing different nutrients and the release rate is contro.led by nutrient specific membrane permeability.  Smaller holes int he membrane limit the highly soluble materials like K, larger holes are used on the less soluble ones.  Its patented and it means osmocote is working at a big technical deficit to match the consistent timed release of florikan.

If you cant find any palm focused fertilizer look at citrus fertilizer its fairly similar in formulation.  DO not use orchid fertilizer, you are asking for trouble as its focused to dump lots of phosphates into the medium for prolific flowering and ignores the needed palm specific micros.

[Than]

7 minutes ago, sonoranfans said:

many fertilizers dont have the Mg, Mn, Fe necessary for palms.  And yes as Konstantinos said the phos is too high.  Phospohates are not easily rinsed from the soil like Nitrogen and especially potassium.  This means that over time the phosphorus concentration rises and at some point it will interfere with uptake of several other nutrients needed to keep palms healthy.  You can make this much worse by trying to limit the cost of watering.  Drenching regularly will slow the accumulation of phosphorus a bit, failure to do so will aggravate the issue.  Get a good list of micronutrient contents.  I have used this fertilizer since 2011 and have had great growth including a 30 foot plus Beccariophoenix Alfredii in full sun and two others over 22 feet in part shade.

https://bigearthsupply.com/product/fertilizer-flo-8-2-12-palm-citrus-6mo-50lb-40/#:~:text=Florikan 8-2-12 180,!) or a hand spreader.

Thank you so much. Indeed 8-2-12 sounds very good ratio for palms. I'll have to search for something similar in the local market here. I have found a 16-7-15 one, which the seller advertises as perfect for palms. 

[sonoranfans]

37 minutes ago, Than said:

Thank you so much. Indeed 8-2-12 sounds very good ratio for palms. I'll have to search for something similar in the local market here. I have found a 16-7-15 one, which the seller advertises as perfect for palms. 

dont focus too much on the '2% P', that is a "high phos soils" formulation for Florida.  Lower phos yes but look at Fe, Mg, Mn, S, Cu etc from that label.   Now if you know you have high phos soils, stay close to the '2'.   Some areas of Greece have high phos soils and some are calcareous, which is something you must know as high Ca can be a big issue in nutrient availability/pH.  Highly calcareous soils will limit what you can do to modify the soil and thus what you can grow.

[Than]

17 minutes ago, sonoranfans said:

dont focus too much on the '2% P', that is a "high phos soils" formulation for Florida.  Lower phos yes but look at Fe, Mg, Mn, S, Cu etc from that label.   Now if you know you have high phos soils, stay close to the '2'.   Some areas of Greece have high phos soils and some are calcareous, which is something you must know as high Ca can be a big issue in nutrient availability/pH.  Highly calcareous soils will limit what you can do to modify the soil and thus what you can grow.

I have done a soil test and yes my soil is full of Ca. Ph is 8.2! All nutrients are low except for Phosphorus and Magnesium which are only slightly low!

Perhaps this one is good. It is NPK 22-7-14 and also has trace elements. It says it should be applied once a year..

[sonoranfans]

3 hours ago, Than said:

I have done a soil test and yes my soil is full of Ca. Ph is 8.2! All nutrients are low except for Phosphorus and Magnesium which are only slightly low!

Perhaps this one is good. It is NPK 22-7-14 and also has trace elements. It says it should be applied once a year..

very high calcium soil cannot be ammended to solve pH issues which will be a problem for many palms.  I dont know about Alfredii there, I guess you will be the first one to grow in such an alaline soil.  I would try adding elemental sulfur, and plenty of it to see if the pH can be changed.  It will take a couple years to find out.  pH 8.2 is not extremely high but5 its an issue.  Here is a chart, the red pH zones are a no for most plants.

 https://planetpermaculture.wordpress.com/2013/07/25/ph-chart-showing-nutrient-availability/

looks like B, Fe, Cu, Zn, and N will be a problem.  Get the sulfur pellets, they are small pellets but big enough that the wind wont blow them away like a granular sulfur.  You will need to address the pH issue at and around the planting sites.   You have to put this stuff down liberally, 4-5 lbs per planting site per year for 3-4 years.  THe soil microbes break down the sulfur to acid in small amounts so no burn.  I dont recommend using a quick soil pH adjustor, there is a high risk of killing plants as it rinses down.  you might just be able to change that soil at pH 8.2 but it will take time an lots of sulfur.  In the mean time get some humic acid as it chelates some of the micro nutrients and improves availability in alkaline soil.

[Than]

7 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

very high calcium soil cannot be ammended to solve pH issues which will be a problem for many palms.  I dont know about Alfredii there, I guess you will be the first one to grow in such an alaline soil.  I would try adding elemental sulfur, and plenty of it to see if the pH can be changed.  It will take a couple years to find out.  pH 8.2 is not extremely high but5 its an issue.  Here is a chart, the red pH zones are a no for most plants.

 https://planetpermaculture.wordpress.com/2013/07/25/ph-chart-showing-nutrient-availability/

looks like B, Fe, Cu, Zn, and N will be a problem.  Get the sulfur pellets, they are small pellets but big enough that the wind wont blow them away like a granular sulfur.  You will need to address the pH issue at and around the planting sites.   You have to put this stuff down liberally, 4-5 lbs per planting site per year for 3-4 years.  THe soil microbes break down the sulfur to acid in small amounts so no burn.  I dont recommend using a quick soil pH adjustor, there is a high risk of killing plants as it rinses down.  you might just be able to change that soil at pH 8.2 but it will take time an lots of sulfur.  In the mean time get some humic acid as it chelates some of the micro nutrients and improves availability in alkaline soil.

Thank you. I have already done these things. I bought a couple of truck loads of very acidic sandy soil (pH 3,8) and mixed it. I think this is the reason my ptychosperma is doing well so far. I also add sulfur pellets twice a year. I give Fe EDDHA to those plants that show iron deficiency but for some reason, some of them respond well and some don't. I also use pine needles as mulch,

For acid-loving plants and palms I am going to use raised beds filled with acidic compost and a sulfur barrier between it and the local soil. 

What do you think of that fertilizer I found? NPK 22-7-4 + trace elements.

[Phoenikakias]

1 hour ago, Than said:

Thank you. I have already done these things. I bought a couple of truck loads of very acidic sandy soil (pH 3,8) and mixed it. I think this is the reason my ptychosperma is doing well so far. I also add sulfur pellets twice a year. I give Fe EDDHA to those plants that show iron deficiency but for some reason, some of them respond well and some don't. I also use pine needles as mulch,

For acid-loving plants and palms I am going to use raised beds filled with acidic compost and a sulfur barrier between it and the local soil. 

What do you think of that fertilizer I found? NPK 22-7-4 + trace elements.

It is extremely difficult to find an acidic compost (compost not peat based potting soil!). The only one I have ever found with acidic pH is based on coir (from Antemisaris) but I do not trust it much! FYI I had used another potting soil based also on coir (available in Praktiker), in order to plant out my triple Wodyetia, nonetheless I had applied in the end all available, non radical acidity enhancers! (radical is imo the use of acid in the irrigation water).

[Than]

3 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

It is extremely difficult to find an acidic compost (compost not peat based potting soil!). The only one I have ever found with acidic pH is based on coir (from Antemisaris) but I do not trust it much! FYI I had used another potting soil based also on coir (available in Praktiker), in order to plant out my triple Wodyetia, nonetheless I had applied in the end all available, non radical acidity enhancers! (radical is imo the use of acid in the irrigation water).

I'm also making my own compost with lots of coffee grounds, orange peels and pine needles

[Than]

5 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

It is extremely difficult to find an acidic compost (compost not peat based potting soil!). The only one I have ever found with acidic pH is based on coir (from Antemisaris) but I do not trust it much! FYI I had used another potting soil based also on coir (available in Praktiker), in order to plant out my triple Wodyetia, nonetheless I had applied in the end all available, non radical acidity enhancers! (radical is imo the use of acid in the irrigation water).

Have you ever tried to buy compost and add sulfur?

[Phoenikakias]

6 minutes ago, Than said:

Have you ever tried to buy compost and add sulfur?

ALWAYS! Especially to Butia and Syagrus.

[dimitriskedikogloy]

Idk if you guys have already seen this store but there is one in athens that sells large beccariophoenixes i mean im kind of left speechless we dont have other more common palms and we have large beccarios but they are so damn expensive @Than @Phoenikakias

[Than]

9 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

Idk if you guys have already seen this store but there is one in athens that sells large beccariophoenixes i mean im kind of left speechless we dont have other more common palms and we have large beccarios but they are so damn expensive @Than @Phoenikakias

I don't know what annoys me more about this website. The prices or the cringe, random names they have chosen for plants. Yucca has become yuga and beccariophoenix "coconut palm"... The worst is the "φυτό olive tree"! This is what they used to call it in their village...

[dimitriskedikogloy]

11 minutes ago, Than said:

I don't know what annoys me more about this website. The prices or the cringe, random names they have chosen for plants. Yucca has become yuga and beccariophoenix "coconut palm"... The worst is the "φυτό olive tree"! This is what they used to call it in their village...

my question is where the h*ll did they find these in europe at such size

[Than]

2 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

my question is where the h*ll did they find these in europe at such size

Dunno about this company specifically, but there are big nurseries in Attica that grow exotic and unusual plants. I used to live near some of them in Marathonas area.

[dimitriskedikogloy]

10 minutes ago, Than said:

Dunno about this company specifically, but there are big nurseries in Attica that grow exotic and unusual plants. I used to live near some of them in Marathonas area.

oh i didnt know that could you provide me the name of a few if you know them

[Than]

17 minutes ago, dimitriskedikogloy said:

oh i didnt know that could you provide me the name of a few if you know them

Gryllis for instance; he prefers to sell wholesale but I did purchase individual plants from him too, for instance a black colocasia and some gingers.. You should def go visit if you go to the area. 

[Phoenikakias]

Gryllis the grizly...

[Than]

On 1/18/2026 at 10:17 AM, Phoenikakias said:

FYI I had used another potting soil based also on coir (available in Praktiker), in order to plant out my triple Wodyetia

How much soil do you buy for one palm in the garden? I wanna make a raised bed for a new Syagrus.

[Phoenikakias]

1 hour ago, Than said:

How much soil do you buy for one palm in the garden? I wanna make a raised bed for a new Syagrus.

Impossible for me to make an assessment. I just remember that small bags!I buy by the tens, large bags definitely more than one 

[Than]

On 1/19/2026 at 8:57 PM, Phoenikakias said:

Gryllis the grizly...

I've just seen this. Not sure what you mean but it sounds funny 😅

[Than]

59 minutes ago, Phoenikakias said:

Impossible for me to make an assessment. I just remember that small bags!I buy by the tens, large bags definitely more than one 

AI tells me that for a Syagrus I need a bed of about 50cm depth and 2.5m wide. That's a lot of soil!! And that's only one tree; I am planning to plant 6 trees this spring. Not only Syagrus but all of them want acidic soil!

[Phoenikakias]

1 hour ago, Than said:

AI tells me that for a Syagrus I need a bed of about 50cm depth and 2.5m wide. That's a lot of soil!! And that's only one tree; I am planning to plant 6 trees this spring. Not only Syagrus but all of them want acidic soil!

Better mix good soil with native one. It helps the plant to adapt to local soil easier and faster. You won't be spared from the task to amend soil after transplanting, no matter what you are contemplating! 

[Than]

9 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

Better mix good soil with native one. It helps the plant to adapt to local soil easier and faster. You won't be spared from the task to amend soil after transplanting, no matter what you are contemplating! 

I guess I'm buying another truck load of acidic sand soil then. I think it is the reason why my Ptychosperma has survived so far.

[happypalms]

3 hours ago, Than said:

I guess I'm buying another truck load of acidic sand soil then. I think it is the reason why my Ptychosperma has survived so far.

Happypalms tip. If you want your palms to grow faster raised beds backfilled with the best soil you can get