Parajubaea Torallyi Var Torallyi Dying

[Clare]

Hello friends, this is my first post.  I came here to seek help for a dying or possibly already dead Parajubaea Torallyi var Torallyi.  I planted this palm in my back yard in 2010 when it was fairly small.  It's been doing great every year here in Southern California where the temps don't get much below 40 or above 80 most of the time.  It has produced flowers and fruit many times.  I live in Camarillo and grow a number of different palms, cycads, bananas, fruit trees, and plumerias.  I had some one-gallon pots on the ground next to it for a while until I found that the palm's roots were finding their way into the pots through the drainage holes.  I covered up the roots at the base of the trunk with rubber mats after that so that my pots could still live there, but I am wondering now whether that caused the tree not to get enough water.  Earlier this year, I saw that the new leaves being pushed out of the top were brown.  If the root system stretches out well beyond the trunk, then it for sure gets enough water because I water in the area quite frequently, but I can see that it probably doesn't get much water directly at the base of the trunk.  Please let me know if you think that this palm can be saved.  The other leaves are now also turning brown.  That probably means it's a goner.  The first picture, with the ladder in the background, is the way it looked in June of 2020.  The other pictures were taken today.  You can see a lot of surface roots by the trunk -- not sure if that is normal or not.  I didn't think it was possible to lose a palm this size.  Thank you, in advance, for your help.

[Tom in Tucson]

I'm sorry to see the demise of such an impressive palm. As I'm sure you're aware if you've dona any searching on this site, the death of this genus of healthy palms in what seems like ideal conditions, is AFAIK still a total mystery. If any plant pathologist has diagnosed the cause, I haven't seen the evidence. At this point there are no remedies, so you might as well plan to have it removed. As to whether the soil is safe, that too is a mystery so far.

Hi 98˚, Lo 66˚

[Clare]

Okay.  Thanks, Tom.  I am fairly devastated as it was one of my favorite palms.  I am going to wait to have it removed in case there is a miraculous recovery:-)  Thanks for the info and response.

[pogobob]

I think it’s possible that the mass of exposed roots to the might have allowed a fungus to spread into the palm. Just a thought. 

[Clare]

Thanks, Robert.  The roots actually weren't exposed until after I saw it declining, but I did previously cover them up with rubber and plastic mats because they were entering my one-gallon pots that I had resting below the palms.  I thought maybe, by covering them up, I caused a situation where it wasn't getting enough water, but perhaps, by covering them up, it allowed a fungus to spread.  It's a mystery, I guess, a sad one.  

[pogobob]

I think it’s worth a try to cover the whole exposed area with some mulch and water. You never know. It’s possible that the palm is just water deprived 

[Clare]

Thank you so much for this advice.  I will go do that now.  Fingers crossed...

[Palmfarmer]

Root rot? 

[Clare]

Hi Palmfarmer, I don't think so.  They look pretty plump and alive to me -- at least the ones that I can see that are close to the surface.  I don't see any fungus or anything abnormal on them, but perhaps whatever fungus or disease it might have isn't showing.  I've covered up the roots now with mulch and watered again.  I will update this thread if it miraculously comes back to life.  Thank you, everybody, for your help with this problem.  I have many different types of palms, but this one was my favorite for its low maintenance and graceful arching leaves.

[DoomsDave]

@Clare Welcome aboard and nice to meet you!

You certainly have the plant fixation, like so many of the rest of us.

FWIW, I've found P. tor tors to be one of those tempermental palms that does great for a while, then gets rot and dies. They're extremely prone to Phytoptera infection, which blocks the conductive tissue that carries water from the roots to the leaves. Hate to say it, but it's possible your plant might have that, since the organism doesn't hurt the roots; it blocks fluid transfer. I suppose roughly analagous to a heart attack in people - fluid can't get where and when it's needed, so death results.

The big symptom is leaves, especially the older ones, dying for lack of water; it's hard to tell from your pictures whether that's happening. A healthy senescing leaf will gradually turn brown, then golden. A leaf lacking moisture will often turn kind of a funky purplish or lavender color (chop off some green leaves and leave them to dry out; they'll do that too). When the new leaves in the center turn brown, that's because the growth bud is dying, too. Alas, the end of the road.

Could you take a picture with the light coming over your shoulder onto the palm? The glare from what looks like back-lighting makes it hard to get the details needed.

[Clare]

Hi Dave, thank you for the welcome.  That's very sad about a possible Phytoptera infection.  Do you know if it affects other trees in the same area as well?  There isn't much soil movement on my part, but I have a foxtail nearby as well as several plumerias and an apple tree in the vicinity.  I will do some research on this as well, but it sounds like not much, if anything, can be done about it.  My first warning were the new leaves being pushed out that were a solid brown.  They did still come out though most of the way.  I don't think I noticed the dying of the existing leaves until just last week, but I wasn't looking carefully enough perhaps.  I don't see the funky purplish or lavender color, but I do see brown and golden color.  Here are the pictures that you requested.  I will wait to see what you think.  Thank you for your help.

[DoomsDave]

2 hours ago, Clare said:

Hi Dave, thank you for the welcome.  That's very sad about a possible Phytoptera infection.  Do you know if it affects other trees in the same area as well?  There isn't much soil movement on my part, but I have a foxtail nearby as well as several plumerias and an apple tree in the vicinity.  I will do some research on this as well, but it sounds like not much, if anything, can be done about it.  My first warning were the new leaves being pushed out that were a solid brown.  They did still come out though most of the way.  I don't think I noticed the dying of the existing leaves until just last week, but I wasn't looking carefully enough perhaps.  I don't see the funky purplish or lavender color, but I do see brown and golden color.  Here are the pictures that you requested.  I will wait to see what you think.  Thank you for your help.

Thanks for the rapid response and the pictures.

I think your palm's far gone with something.   Still hard to tell the exact color of the oldest dead leaves, though.

I know too well, as I had one, too, the infamous "800 pound gorilla" not as tall but even fatter that just died a few years ago from the Big P. Stump's still there.

Parajube sunkha seems to like California a lot better; I've got a tall one a few yards from where the 800 pound gorilla was, and it's looking good, if in need of some grooming.

 

Here's the 800 pound gorilla death threads . . .

 

[Clare]

Hello Palm friends, it was almost two months ago that I posted my sorrow about what looked like a dead palm, but I'm happy to report that it is alive!  I've been watering it on occasion just in case it was a water issue, and today I noticed what appears to be a brand new leader/head.  I'm going to get up there today and cut away some of the older fronds that may be restricting the emergence of this new head.  I am so thrilled.  I am crossing my fingers that the new head actually means a continued existence for this palm.  My husband and I were trying to figure out what happened.  There were a few periods of very high heat this past summer, and perhaps it just didn't get enough water for its size.  The other possibility is that we have a water softener that uses sodium, and we are not sure where the excess is expelled underground, but we think it might be near this palm.  Thankfully, we are currently switching to a different water softening system.  The water here is extremely hard, like off-the-charts hard.  Anyway, I couldn't wait to share this with you today.  I hope it gives someone hope that it is possible for this to come back from the brink of death.

[Tom in Tucson]

As I stated earlier in your post. AFAIK, there are no remedies known to fix the malady which should probably receive some sort of name that other palm diseases have gotten such as "lethal yellowing".

Even though I only grow P. sunkha here in AZ now, I still remember vividly how all the P. cocoides I've ever tried in CA, died looking like "death warmed over" prior to croaking altogether.

Now that I've put a very Scrooge like spin on this topic on Christmas eve, let me conclude on a more cheerful note:

The good news is the tip I got from the palm hybrid guru Patric(k) Shaffer has proven to help keep this genus alive here; to paraphrase: "Treat these like desert palms", has proven to be true. Also important to know, a grower in south Texas, and I have discovered that P. sunkha goes into a sort of palm 'coma' during the Summer, but will recover in the Fall. TRY NOT TO WATER WHEN HOT!

Also worth mentioning, is the fact that all of the hybrids of this genus done by the aforementioned guru, are easy to grow in AZ and CA!

Hi 55°, Lo 46° Dec 23 .05"

[Palmfarmer]

7 hours ago, Tom in Tucson said:

As I stated earlier in your post. AFAIK, there are no remedies known to fix the malady which should probably receive some sort of name that other palm diseases have gotten such as "lethal yellowing".

Even though I only grow P. sunkha here in AZ now, I still remember vividly how all the P. cocoides I've ever tried in CA, died looking like "death warmed over" prior to croaking altogether.

Now that I've put a very Scrooge like spin on this topic on Christmas eve, let me conclude on a more cheerful note:

The good news is the tip I got from the palm hybrid guru Patric(k) Shaffer has proven to help keep this genus alive here; to paraphrase: "Treat these like desert palms", has proven to be true. Also important to know, a grower in south Texas, and I have discovered that P. sunkha goes into a sort of palm 'coma' during the Summer, but will recover in the Fall. TRY NOT TO WATER WHEN HOT!

Also worth mentioning, is the fact that all of the hybrids of this genus done by the aforementioned guru, are easy to grow in AZ and CA!

Hi 55°, Lo 46° Dec 23 .05"

So clay soil should be ammended before planting? 

Maybe planting a bit high is good too. 

Worried the monsun can potentially kill this palm. 

[Clare]

Hi Palmfarmer, my soil is very sandy here.  Yes, I would amend clay soil to improve drainage before planting anything;-)  I think palms and many tropicals in general dislike sitting in wet soil, and clay soil doesn't drain well.  There are many things that you can add to improve drainage.  This palm in particular seems to have massive roots that do come to the surface -- at least mine does.  I don't know how it would feel about a monsoon though.  Maybe someone else here can answer that.  I'm just thrilled that mine still lives for the moment.