I think I figured out why my Trachys did worse than my Sabal Birminghams and Sabal Palmettos after last winter :

[WSimpson]

It finally dawned on me  when I thought back about something Gary Holler posted several years ago ,  and that was that palms get more damage after a cold snap when the weather has been mild previous to the cold event . Last December there hadn't been a lot of cold to " harden off " the palms before a Low of 11F the morning of the 24th and Hight of 28F that day , with a  Low of 6F the morning of the 25th , and 2 other mornings of 17F and 15F . That shouldn't damage  a Trachy , but that 6F came after  relatively mild weather up to that point  . 

My theory is that Trachys are more susceptible to damage after a mild period before a severe cold snap  than are Birminghams and Palmettos , who took way less damage . I could be wrong and feel free to discuss any theories you have that might explain the worse damage taken by my  Trachys .

Another factor might be that Birminghams and Palmettos can take more cold wind than Trachys ? it was windy during the coldest part of that cold snap . 

Will

The Taylor form on the left was more affected by the cold than the stiffer fronded ecotype . 

 

 

That severely damaged Taylor Form more closely :

 

 

The less damaged Birmingham :

 

 

And the least damaged of those palms was  the Palmettos :

 

 

 

Thanks for looking .

Will

Edited April 28, 2023 by Will Simpson

[ChicagoPalma]

Its not that in general birmingham and palmettos are more cold hardier, but I think that they probably were more dormant because they were less hardier than the trachies and that causes them to go dormant is temps that trachys find manageable. It could also just be the palms genes might have it more hardier than others. Palm dna/genes also are a contributor in palm cold hardiness.

[jwitt]

Sabals require more heat to grow than trachies so growth had slowed down moreso than the trachies come December. 

I think this factor(active growth) played into the Texas palmageddon of 2021. 

I have personally killed palms in the past using fertilizer. They grew into winter and melted when when the cold came.

Will, I think your assessment is spot on.

Ant those are some bitchin specimens!

Edited April 29, 2023 by jwitt

[BeyondTheGarden]

Kinda looks like the stuff lower and closer to the ground did better.  Some palms lose hardiness as they get taller.  How windy does it get there?

[westfork]

We have been dealing with this a lot lately with single digit (F) temperatures in mid October the last two years with summer temperatures immediately before and after.    Hardening off makes a major difference in damage.  But provenance means almost as much in some species.  We found (within the same species of various plants-not palms) that the ones originating closer to the Great Plains endure swings in temperature, moisture, and humidity far better than their eastern cousins.  They evolved having to deal with this  and the ones that couldn't take the sudden changes just didn't make it.
I would think that sabals from interior regions probably had to deal with greater temperature swings than the more alpine trachycarpus - But just speculating.

[Allen]

On 4/28/2023 at 12:09 PM, Will Simpson said:

The Taylor form on the left was more affected by the cold than the stiffer fronded ecotype . 

 

Where the fronds bend seems to create a 'damaged' spot that makes those fronds much more sensitive to cold especially from the bend outward.

[knikfar]

I had a similar experience here in Raleigh, with a low of 11f for the winter. All of my palms are smaller than yours and none of them experienced damage to the existing fronds. But five out of six trachys had spear pull earlier this spring, months after the December cold event. And the sixth one started pushing out browned foliage that I could see had started to rot but probably stopped because I sprayed it with copper fungicide, just in case, while I was treating the others. My sabals and sabal birminghams never showed any signs of stress. I even have a potted sabal on my patio that was completely unprotected all winter, and it only had minor tip burn on some of the older fronds. You'd never know anything happened at all by looking at it today. 

[Allen]

1 hour ago, knikfar said:

I had a similar experience here in Raleigh, with a low of 11f for the winter. All of my palms are smaller than yours and none of them experienced damage to the existing fronds. But five out of six trachys had spear pull earlier this spring, months after the December cold event. And the sixth one started pushing out browned foliage that I could see had started to rot but probably stopped because I sprayed it with copper fungicide, just in case, while I was treating the others. My sabals and sabal birminghams never showed any signs of stress. I even have a potted sabal on my patio that was completely unprotected all winter, and it only had minor tip burn on some of the older fronds. You'd never know anything happened at all by looking at it today. 

Are these adult size Trachy or smaller ones?   Adults should not spear pull easily. 

[knikfar]

On 5/5/2023 at 10:43 AM, Allen said:

Are these adult size Trachy or smaller ones?   Adults should not spear pull easily. 

The oldest ones are probably considered pre-teens. They've all been planted in the last three years, each from pots between 5 and 10 gallons. They range in height between 3' and 5' from the ground to the tip of their tallest fronds. 

[Allen]

7 minutes ago, knikfar said:

The oldest ones are probably considered pre-teens. They've all been planted in the last three years, each from pots between 5 and 10 gallons. They range in height between 3' and 5' from the ground to the tip of their tallest fronds. 

Yes that size will spear pull in temps under 21F with freezing rain