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Windmill problem


EastCanadaTropicals

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Ok, so when I first uncovered my windmill, it looked fine. It was raining alot when I uncovered it in April, and I thought windmills liked wet weather so I left it. But the spear and emrging frond began to look worse and worse after every rainstorm. The emerging leave and spear are fully browned, but they arent completely pulling off. What can I do to help? Is it still alive? Should I get an older palm next time? No other leaf on the windmill looks that bad, but the other leaves have some winter damage. Any advice? If it's dead, next time, ill plant the largest sabal minor I can find, place it on a south facing wall, and protect the leaves every year.

Nothing to say here. 

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4 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Ok, so when I first uncovered my windmill, it looked fine. It was raining alot when I uncovered it in April, and I thought windmills liked wet weather so I left it. But the spear and emrging frond began to look worse and worse after every rainstorm. The emerging leave and spear are fully browned, but they arent completely pulling off. What can I do to help? Is it still alive? Should I get an older palm next time? No other leaf on the windmill looks that bad, but the other leaves have some winter damage. Any advice? If it's dead, next time, ill plant the largest sabal minor I can find, place it on a south facing wall, and protect the leaves every year.

My windmill looks like crap right now!  We've had alot of rain and it sits close to the eaves.  Walked past it this morning and I was like, "What on the earth happened?" 
I assume some fungus from all the rain.  The spear and other fronds around the bud are discolored and seem to have fungal growth on them. 

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14 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Ok, so when I first uncovered my windmill, it looked fine. It was raining alot when I uncovered it in April, and I thought windmills liked wet weather so I left it. But the spear and emrging frond began to look worse and worse after every rainstorm. The emerging leave and spear are fully browned, but they arent completely pulling off. What can I do to help? Is it still alive? Should I get an older palm next time? No other leaf on the windmill looks that bad, but the other leaves have some winter damage. Any advice? If it's dead, next time, ill plant the largest sabal minor I can find, place it on a south facing wall, and protect the leaves every year.

We had 10 inches of rain in one week.

Also I don't think they like cold, wet rain. 

Additionally, if there was cold damage to the spear or other fronds, the leaves lose their protective cuticle.  This makes them more vulnerable to other problems such as fungus and sunburn. 

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We need photos

Meg

Palms of Victory I shall wear

Cape Coral (It's Just Paradise)
Florida
Zone 10A on the Isabelle Canal
Elevation: 15 feet

I'd like to be under the sea in an octopus' garden in the shade.

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44 minutes ago, PricklyPearSATC said:

We had 10 inches of rain in one week.

Also I don't think they like cold, wet rain. 

Additionally, if there was cold damage to the spear or other fronds, the leaves lose their protective cuticle.  This makes them more vulnerable to other problems such as fungus and sunburn. 

It was around 7-15c

Nothing to say here. 

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30 minutes ago, PalmatierMeg said:

We need photos

Sorry, here's a photo:

20210511_180739.jpg

Nothing to say here. 

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55 minutes ago, PricklyPearSATC said:

My windmill looks like crap right now!  We've had alot of rain and it sits close to the eaves.  Walked past it this morning and I was like, "What on the earth happened?" 
I assume some fungus from all the rain.  The spear and other fronds around the bud are discolored and seem to have fungal growth on them. 

My windmill isn't trunking yet, so I'm a bit worried about it's survival.

Nothing to say here. 

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56 minutes ago, PricklyPearSATC said:

My windmill looks like crap right now!  We've had alot of rain and it sits close to the eaves.  Walked past it this morning and I was like, "What on the earth happened?" 
I assume some fungus from all the rain.  The spear and other fronds around the bud are discolored and seem to have fungal growth on them. 

Anything I can do to remove the fungus?

Nothing to say here. 

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57 minutes ago, PricklyPearSATC said:

My windmill looks like crap right now!  We've had alot of rain and it sits close to the eaves.  Walked past it this morning and I was like, "What on the earth happened?" 
I assume some fungus from all the rain.  The spear and other fronds around the bud are discolored and seem to have fungal growth on them. 

And also, the palm is mulched, but not on the trunk, since that would encourage more fungi.

Edited by EastCanadaTropicals

Nothing to say here. 

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If the palm saw temps of less than 21F (-6F) and was wet it can develop cold injury on a palm that small.  One this small as you've noted can die easily but you are best served by treating it with copper fungicide or hydrogen peroxide and seeing if it grows out of it in a couple months.  In 5a Canada I'm assuming you are protecting this palm every winter.  

YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@tntropics - 60+ In-ground 7A palms - (Sabal) minor(7 large + 27 seedling size, 3 dwarf),  brazoria(1) , birmingham(4), etonia (1) louisiana(5), palmetto (1), riverside (1),  (Trachycarpus) fortunei(7), wagnerianus(1),  Rhapidophyllum hystrix(7),  18' Mule-Butia x Syagrus(1),  Blue Butia odorata (1) +Tons of tropical plants.  Recent Yearly Lows -6F, -1F, 12F, 11F, 18F, 16F, 3F, 3F, 6F, 3F, 1F, 16F, 17F, 6F, 8F

 

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Winter damage.  You live in a cold place, you really have to do a lot to get them through.  Follow JamesPalms methods, he's in 5B up in Norval.  Winter damage doesn't always appear right away, often times it shows up in spring when things start to warm up.

All you can really do at this point is use some copper fungicide and wait.

Edited by Chester B
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2 minutes ago, Chester B said:

Winter damage.  You live in a cold place, you really have to do a lot to get them through.  Follow JamesPalms methods, he's in 5B up in Norval.  Winter damage doesn't always appear right away, often times it shows up in spring when things start to warm up.

All you can really do at this point is use some copper fungicide and wait.

But when I first uncovered it, the emerging frond was completely undamaged. I was thinking the same thing since the rain would unfreeze the palm, I guessed?

Nothing to say here. 

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20 minutes ago, Allen said:

If the palm saw temps of less than 21F (-6F) and was wet it can develop cold injury on a palm that small.  One this small as you've noted can die easily but you are best served by treating it with copper fungicide or hydrogen peroxide and seeing if it grows out of it in a couple months.  In 5a Canada I'm assuming you are protecting this palm every winter.  

When the rain came, it was like, 10c and the rain stopped at night, so it wouldn't have bothered the windmill when it went down to 2c.

Nothing to say here. 

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7 minutes ago, Chester B said:

Winter damage.  You live in a cold place, you really have to do a lot to get them through.  Follow JamesPalms methods, he's in 5B up in Norval.  Winter damage doesn't always appear right away, often times it shows up in spring when things start to warm up.

All you can really do at this point is use some copper fungicide and wait.

I'm subscribed to JamesPalms.

Nothing to say here. 

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Here's a photo when I first uncovered it in very late March, the cold wave in April 1, it was covered for that day, and not fertilized until it started getting more consistently warm.

20210404_140706.jpg

Edited by EastCanadaTropicals

Nothing to say here. 

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Again, winter damage doesn't always show up right away, it often takes a warm up to appear.  I had a newly planted Butia that went through winter and looked great, as soon as it got into the 60's in April it started browning and had that bleached straw look to the fronds like yours has.  It died.  When I have seen fungus usually it is dark and splotchy.

My windmills, whether they are a strap leaf seedling or fully mature sit in cold wet weather for months on end.  It doesn't bother them.  They go through a couple months of single digit Celsius highs with rain or moisture most days.  I think Trachys are more prone to fungus when its hot and wet, not cold and wet.

Your palms are not evolved to live in a climate like yours so your winter protection really needs to be effective to get them through, even one or two nights where it isn't on point can have devastating effects.  You can have weeks without ever going above freezing, that is challenging.  

What is working in your favor is Trachycarpus seem prone to spear pull and can recover from it.  

Edited by Chester B
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8 minutes ago, Chester B said:

Again, winter damage doesn't always show up right away, it often takes a warm up to appear.  I had a newly planted Butia that went through winter and looked great, as soon as it got into the 60's in April it started browning and had that bleached straw look to the fronds like yours has.  It died.  When I have seen fungus usually it is dark and splotchy.

My windmills, whether they are a strap leaf seedling or fully mature sit in cold wet weather for months on end.  It doesn't bother them.  They go through a couple months of single digit Celsius highs with rain or moisture most days.  I think Trachys are more prone to fungus when its hot and wet, not cold and wet.

Your palms are not evolved to live in a climate like yours so your winter protection really needs to be effective to get them through, even one or two nights where it isn't on point can have devastating effects.  You can have weeks without ever going above freezing, that is challenging.  

What is working in your favor is Trachycarpus seem prone to spear pull and can recover from it.  

Well, it was 19c one week in March, and 27c in April 16.

Nothing to say here. 

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9 minutes ago, Chester B said:

Again, winter damage doesn't always show up right away, it often takes a warm up to appear.  I had a newly planted Butia that went through winter and looked great, as soon as it got into the 60's in April it started browning and had that bleached straw look to the fronds like yours has.  It died.  When I have seen fungus usually it is dark and splotchy.

My windmills, whether they are a strap leaf seedling or fully mature sit in cold wet weather for months on end.  It doesn't bother them.  They go through a couple months of single digit Celsius highs with rain or moisture most days.  I think Trachys are more prone to fungus when its hot and wet, not cold and wet.

Your palms are not evolved to live in a climate like yours so your winter protection really needs to be effective to get them through, even one or two nights where it isn't on point can have devastating effects.  You can have weeks without ever going above freezing, that is challenging.  

What is working in your favor is Trachycarpus seem prone to spear pull and can recover from it.  

But why are all the other fronds fine? That's what gave me doubts on winter protection, since the emerging frond would be sheltered from the rest? I should focus more heat on the heart of palm, because it hasn't grown at all this spring.

Nothing to say here. 

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Thanks for all the advice guys! 

Nothing to say here. 

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Pure or diluted hydrogen peroxide?

Nothing to say here. 

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4 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Pure or diluted hydrogen peroxide?

When you buy it from the store its like a 3% solution.  So pour it straight on.

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Just now, Chester B said:

When you buy it from the store its like a 3% solution.  So pour it straight on.

Mine says 3 percent, so i'm good. Thanks! One question is why are the other fronds looking so much better than the center? Are new fronds just more tender to cold, I guess?

Nothing to say here. 

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5 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Mine says 3 percent, so i'm good. Thanks! One question is why are the other fronds looking so much better than the center? Are new fronds just more tender to cold, I guess?

Most commonly water gets into the center spear area which is like a big funnel shape.  The water can freeze there and damages tender growing tissue in the palm spear area.  Then as temps rise fungus develops on this dead tissue and if left unchecked can damage healthy tissue in the palm if it is not growing fast enough to push this damaged area out.  The fungus does not attack the other drier parts of the palm like the existing fronds.  If the damage is too bad the palm loses it's growth point to freeze/fungus and will not have anything to produce a spear from.

Edited by Allen
  • Like 1

YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@tntropics - 60+ In-ground 7A palms - (Sabal) minor(7 large + 27 seedling size, 3 dwarf),  brazoria(1) , birmingham(4), etonia (1) louisiana(5), palmetto (1), riverside (1),  (Trachycarpus) fortunei(7), wagnerianus(1),  Rhapidophyllum hystrix(7),  18' Mule-Butia x Syagrus(1),  Blue Butia odorata (1) +Tons of tropical plants.  Recent Yearly Lows -6F, -1F, 12F, 11F, 18F, 16F, 3F, 3F, 6F, 3F, 1F, 16F, 17F, 6F, 8F

 

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50 minutes ago, Allen said:

Most commonly water gets into the center spear area which is like a big funnel shape.  The water can freeze there and damages tender growing tissue in the palm spear area.  Then as temps rise fungus develops on this dead tissue and if left unchecked can damage healthy tissue in the palm if it is not growing fast enough to push this damaged area out.  The fungus does not attack the other drier parts of the palm like the existing fronds.  If the damage is too bad the palm loses it's growth point to freeze/fungus and will not have anything to produce a spear from.

Could it still be alive?

Nothing to say here. 

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34 minutes ago, EastCanadaTropicals said:

Could it still be alive?

Sure

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YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@tntropics - 60+ In-ground 7A palms - (Sabal) minor(7 large + 27 seedling size, 3 dwarf),  brazoria(1) , birmingham(4), etonia (1) louisiana(5), palmetto (1), riverside (1),  (Trachycarpus) fortunei(7), wagnerianus(1),  Rhapidophyllum hystrix(7),  18' Mule-Butia x Syagrus(1),  Blue Butia odorata (1) +Tons of tropical plants.  Recent Yearly Lows -6F, -1F, 12F, 11F, 18F, 16F, 3F, 3F, 6F, 3F, 1F, 16F, 17F, 6F, 8F

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Looking good, by mid summer it should look decent again.

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8 hours ago, Chester B said:

Looking good, by mid summer it should look decent again.

The new frond is growing really fast, so maybe early summer.

Nothing to say here. 

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