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Weird leaf condition


Kai

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I have amputated a leaf off my Astrocaryum alatum plant. It has been a very healthy and well growing plant since I got it halfway 2015. But now all of a sudden one of the newer leafs, but not the newest dried up in a matter of days. All other leafs appear to be unaffected.

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I have no idea what might have caused this and therefore no idea if I should be worried about it affecting the rest of the palm or how to treat it. Or worse: it affecting other palms in my collection.

There haven't been any changes in watering or caring. I'm completely in the dark.

Does anybody here have an idea of what might have caused this just by looking at the pictures?

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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2 hours ago, Kai said:

I have amputated a leaf off my Astrocaryum alatum plant. It has been a very healthy and well growing plant since I got it halfway 2015. But now all of a sudden one of the newer leafs, but not the newest dried up in a matter of days. All other leafs appear to be unaffected.

20180424_174824.thumb.jpg.45dd4b60c915e2

20180424_174912.thumb.jpg.bd4fa5a4e0689f

I have no idea what might have caused this and therefore no idea if I should be worried about it affecting the rest of the palm or how to treat it. Or worse: it affecting other palms in my collection.

There haven't been any changes in watering or caring. I'm completely in the dark.

Does anybody here have an idea of what might have caused this just by looking at the pictures?

I've seen this exact condition before in other plants, but I have no idea what it is.

I've never seen it kill a plant, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.

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Sorry I can't help Kai, that is strange, but I thought that I would just mention the obvious anyway,

which is to separate/quarantine it until you do identify the culprit.

I am sure that you would have noticed any tiny mites if they were there,

And if they are not sensitive palms inspect the roots, you know what to look for.

Also I have a Ch. seifrizii (outside) that loses leaves non sequentially, not oldest or lowest first, yet stays healthy.

But it does not get the attention that yours gets so I don't know if the similarities go any further than that.

Good luck.

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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Thanks for your replies guys!

@gtsteve there have been some spider mites but not at a concentration that would dry up a leaf in just one or two days. Also the spider mites were succesfully treated with predatory mites some time ago and haven't returned yet. The charactistic leaf damage (little spots where the mites bit the plant) wasn't present and I can't find any traces of them on the dead leaf.

I quarantined the plant, for as far as that was possible. Put some distance between the other plants and not in the same drainage box so other plants won't come into contact with its drainage water.

I sincerely hope there will be no more leaf necrosis!

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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22 hours ago, Kai said:

Thanks for your replies guys!

@gtsteve there have been some spider mites but not at a concentration that would dry up a leaf in just one or two days. Also the spider mites were succesfully treated with predatory mites some time ago and haven't returned yet. The charactistic leaf damage (little spots where the mites bit the plant) wasn't present and I can't find any traces of them on the dead leaf.

I quarantined the plant, for as far as that was possible. Put some distance between the other plants and not in the same drainage box so other plants won't come into contact with its drainage water.

I sincerely hope there will be no more leaf necrosis!

I also hope there is no more necrosis.

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@Kai, could you post pics of the Astrocaryum and the Sabinaria, showing the whole plants and the infected parts? Did you examine the underside of the infected blade with a microscope or a strong loupe?

Your other Sabinaria is still waiting for you, protected under the canopy of Lyto weddells:

5ae457f562cd3_N15112018-04-28P1040463.th

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My photos at flickr: flickr.com/photos/palmeir/albums

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1 minute ago, Pal Meir said:

@Kai, could you post pics of the Astrocaryum and the Sabinaria, showing the whole plants and the infected parts? Did you examine the underside of the infected blade with a microscope or a strong loupe?

Your other Sabinaria is still waiting for you, protected under the canopy of Lyto weddells:

5ae457f562cd3_N15112018-04-28P1040463.th

Yes I have inspected the Astrocaryum leaves with a loupe and found nothing. I have no microscope but I might buy one soon.

I will take some pictures this afternoon.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the predatory mites I released on my palms about a month ago. I do this as soon as notice just the slightest sign of spider mites.

The predatory mites come in a baggy with dried bean leaves and the bean leaves are spread among my palms. Could these bean leaves have been infected with some sort of plant virus, making some of my palms ill?

Your Sabinaria looks perfect Pal! Let's wait with placing it in my collection again untill we're fairly sure there's no more danger for it.

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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@Kai, is the dried new leaf of the Sabinaria still growing (spear pull)? For both palms I would recommend leaching the soil with plenty of water without any fert. If it is no infestation it might be a problem of the roots or soil, but this is only a guess.

My photos at flickr: flickr.com/photos/palmeir/albums

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2 hours ago, Pal Meir said:

@Kai, is the dried new leaf of the Sabinaria still growing (spear pull)? For both palms I would recommend leaching the soil with plenty of water without any fert. If it is no infestation it might be a problem of the roots or soil, but this is only a guess.

I think it's still growing. I gave it a little pull but it's still firm. I sparingly fertilized most of my palms not too long ago, so you might be on to something. I actually hope that's the cause and I don't have to deal with an invisible enemy.

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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Yesterday I marked the dried spear and it's still pushing up. Looks like I'll only have to deal with some delay in growth and an uggly dried up leaf. Let's hope that was the last of that...

20180504_233735.thumb.jpg.d6fc1cb6ccc123

The Astrocaryum is still looking healthy as well and new spear growth is quite fast.

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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The spear pushing may not be indicative of what we hope yet, you have probably seen pictures of palms laying on the ground cut into quarters and still pushing spears for a couple of weeks. 

Have you thought of repotting? I would consider lifting it, washing the roots off, putting it in fresh stuff and hope. 

Oh and Lizzy suggests that you phone your national/regional botanic gardens or Kew. Also, that you spray it with a systemic bug killer in case you have a burrowed weevil, and that you move it to a different room, she has the hort qualifications not me. And you may be able to enquire from the country of origin of the palms if possible. And lastly she suggests that it may be the quality of your water may have changed from the supplier without your knowledge, and that some plants are more susceptible than others. 

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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10 hours ago, gtsteve said:

The spear pushing may not be indicative of what we hope yet, you have probably seen pictures of palms laying on the ground cut into quarters and still pushing spears for a couple of weeks. 

Have you thought of repotting? I would consider lifting it, washing the roots off, putting it in fresh stuff and hope. 

Oh and Lizzy suggests that you phone your national/regional botanic gardens or Kew. Also, that you spray it with a systemic bug killer in case you have a burrowed weevil, and that you move it to a different room, she has the hort qualifications not me. And you may be able to enquire from the country of origin of the palms if possible. And lastly she suggests that it may be the quality of your water may have changed from the supplier without your knowledge, and that some plants are more susceptible than others. 

Thanks Steve,

As far as suppliers go, I grew this palm from seed and it hasn't been in contact (yet) with outside conditions. My Amsterdam climate also probably ensures I have no risk of palmweevils.

As far as water quality goes, I water my palms only with freshly collected rainwater. Never had any problems with that before but that doesn't mean it can't be the first time...

From time to time I release a batch of predatory mites on my collection to prevent spider mite outbreaks. This seems to work as I closely monitor the plants.

Do you or Lizzy still think repotting, cleaning roots and fresh mix is still a good idea? My gutfeeling tells me to let it grow out of it...

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The Netherlands

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Kai, we really just wanted to go through as many of the alternatives that we could think of, for your consideration, without actually recommending any. You are in the best position to judge, you should probably go with your gut feeling. 

We rang our botanic gardens once and they were very helpful, that is a suggestion. :) 

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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3 hours ago, gtsteve said:

Kai, we really just wanted to go through as many of the alternatives that we could think of, for your consideration, without actually recommending any. You are in the best position to judge, you should probably go with your gut feeling. 

We rang our botanic gardens once and they were very helpful, that is a suggestion. :)

Ok thanks Steve! I really appreciate it!

I think I will just wait a bit as things don't seem to get worse. All the other leaves are still perfectly healthy and the damaged spear is pushing up pretty fast now (allthough I just learned from you that it is no guarantee for recovery). I'm not 100% sure yet, but it looks like it's pushing up living leave material again. If there's any progress I will post it here.

This is a plant I don't want to lose so if anything happens I might just give kew a call, thanks for bringing it up.

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Amsterdam,

The Netherlands

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3 hours ago, Pal Meir said:

:greenthumb:

Over-fertilizing during the dark season?

Yes I think that's it. I never fertilize in wintertime, but this spring I might have started a bit too soon. I need to be more carefull with it.

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The Netherlands

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55 minutes ago, Kai said:

Done.

And it looks like I didn't cut into any living material.

Now I have to wait all over again for a perfect new leaf.:badday:

Or you take with you the other Sabina and your next leaf will look like this:

5af8546d710e0_N15112018-05-13P1040486.th

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My photos at flickr: flickr.com/photos/palmeir/albums

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  • 5 weeks later...
36 minutes ago, Kai said:

New leaf coming up, we're good!

:greenthumb::)

Sabinaria: Water regularly, don’t let dry out, but don’t use soil that can get soggy. And don’t give too much fert, only very very diluted.

My photos at flickr: flickr.com/photos/palmeir/albums

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