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Cold hardies from the L.A arboretum


Brad Mondel

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Sabal Rosei: image.thumb.jpeg.7b0fbed8b9f9720e349c741

Brahea clara: image.thumb.jpeg.8a6915903a4eb0da452278b

Jubaea: image.thumb.jpeg.56b476364bfeedd04bc48c4

 

Chamaerops humilus 'argentea':image.jpeg

 

Butia eriospatha:

image.jpeg

Takil:image.jpeg

  • Upvote 2

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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3 hours ago, Brad Mondel said:

Trunking Sabal minors:image.thumb.jpeg.ded24d5c8e77ed0f32b1746image.thumb.jpeg.63206e5b883fb3945f28b00

Butia paraguayensis

image.thumb.jpeg.aba5e35fcd8a44f366f7613

image.thumb.jpeg.ac5aebc369619b8fe5a3cdf

Trachycarpus takil:image.thumb.jpeg.f5e71c5ebc0a701fb617953

 

Brad, are the 3rd & 4th images both Butia paraguayensis?

BTW, all nice looking photos.

Tom Birt - Casas Adobes, AZ

Hi 80, Lo 50

Casas Adobes - NW of Tucson since July 2014

formerly in the San Carlos region of San Diego

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Wow. I am not accustomed to seeing sabal minor trunking like that. Nice! There are plenty of them growing wild in forests here, but they don't usually have a trunk, as far as I have noticed, at least.

That's a nice collection, and I'm sure that the LA aboretum must have lots of non-cold-hardy palms as well.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Tom in Tucson said:

Brad, are the 3rd & 4th images both Butia paraguayensis?

BTW, all nice looking photos.

Tom Birt - Casas Adobes, AZ

Hi 80, Lo 50

According to the arboretum, yes. The second photo was of a palm with many planted together and the first was kinda dwarfed. Butias are variable but it's possible that their palms were mislabeled. There was a Sabal rosei sign in front of bamboo instead of the actual palm. 

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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3 hours ago, Sandy Loam said:

Wow. I am not accustomed to seeing sabal minor trunking like that. Nice! There are plenty of them growing wild in forests here, but they don't usually have a trunk, as far as I have noticed, at least.

That's a nice collection, and I'm sure that the LA aboretum must have lots of non-cold-hardy palms as well.

 

 

Me too! I was surprised to see them trunking. Im thinking the combination of warm weather and dry soil contributed to the trunks on these. 

If it's a special variety and not due to environmental factors we may find out one day…plenty of seeds dangling within reach ;)

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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Butia capitata: (not sure if it's a true capitata because the former capitata is now classified as odorata)image.thumb.jpeg.524d1de4cfd9b7c8e2e2cca

 

Sabal minors naturalizing:image.thumb.jpeg.f266e6a9837716c45757596

 

image.thumb.jpeg.7c292e654f14f1032936560

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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I would make a small bet that the B.capitata is a capitata and not an odorata....

John Case

Brentwood CA

Owner and curator of Hana Keu Garden

USDA Zone 9b more or less, Sunset Zone 14 in winter 9 in summer

"Its always exciting the first time you save the world. Its a real thrill!"

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1 hour ago, John Case said:

I would make a small bet that the B.capitata is a capitata and not an odorata....

Why, out of curiosity?  (I note the RPS site claims the "real" B. capitata is virtually unknown in cultivation.)

Ben Rogers

On the border of Concord & Clayton in the East Bay hills - Elev 387 ft 37.95 °N, 121.94 °W

My back yard weather station: http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=37.954%2C-121.945&sp=KCACONCO37

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It was smaller in stature and size than most odoratas so it's a possibility. 

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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4 hours ago, Ben in Norcal said:

Why, out of curiosity?  (I note the RPS site claims the "real" B. capitata is virtually unknown in cultivation.)

The real capitata is smaller than odorata. The photo displays a trunk much less massive and robust than odorata with leaf scars that are different than yatay, eriospatha, and others. In fact, I make this claim from ignorance, as I have not seen this particular Butia before. I can, with pretty goo confidence, say that it is not odorata, though, as this tree appears to bee an outlier to species more than any other I have seen.

On top of this, it makes for a good argument!

 

JC

John Case

Brentwood CA

Owner and curator of Hana Keu Garden

USDA Zone 9b more or less, Sunset Zone 14 in winter 9 in summer

"Its always exciting the first time you save the world. Its a real thrill!"

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On 11/22/2015, 8:08:31, Brad Mondel said:

Trunking Sabal minors:image.thumb.jpeg.ded24d5c8e77ed0f32b1746image.thumb.jpeg.63206e5b883fb3945f28b00

Butia paraguayensis: 

image.thumb.jpeg.aba5e35fcd8a44f366f7613

image.thumb.jpeg.ac5aebc369619b8fe5a3cdf

Trachycarpus takil:image.thumb.jpeg.f5e71c5ebc0a701fb617953

 

I grew up down the way from this garden. It neve gets old looking at palms from the LA Arboretum. Not to mention all the loud but beautiful peacocks roaming around the joint.

they filmed the intro to fantasy island at the lake front mansion.

Da plane Da plane, boss

Carlsbad, California Zone 10 B on the hill (402 ft. elevation)

Sunset zone 24

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9 hours ago, John Case said:

The real capitata is smaller than odorata. The photo displays a trunk much less massive and robust than odorata with leaf scars that are different than yatay, eriospatha, and others. In fact, I make this claim from ignorance, as I have not seen this particular Butia before. I can, with pretty goo confidence, say that it is not odorata, though, as this tree appears to bee an outlier to species more than any other I have seen.

On top of this, it makes for a good argument!

 

JC

I see - tough to scale it in the pic, and never been there.  I wonder if it could also be another dwarf-ish Butia if the "real" capitata is as rare in cultivation as purported?

Ben Rogers

On the border of Concord & Clayton in the East Bay hills - Elev 387 ft 37.95 °N, 121.94 °W

My back yard weather station: http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=37.954%2C-121.945&sp=KCACONCO37

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1 hour ago, Ben in Norcal said:

I see - tough to scale it in the pic, and never been there.  I wonder if it could also be another dwarf-ish Butia if the "real" capitata is as rare in cultivation as purported?

We shall see....more work on this genus clearly needs to be done...let's open a DNA lab!

John Case

Brentwood CA

Owner and curator of Hana Keu Garden

USDA Zone 9b more or less, Sunset Zone 14 in winter 9 in summer

"Its always exciting the first time you save the world. Its a real thrill!"

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Brad:

Thanks for sharing! We take the cold-hardy palms here way too much for granted. \

Sabal minor is quite variable. The further south in their range you go, the more likely they are to be acualescent (lacking a trunk). I saw some shorties in the median of the Will Rogers Expressway in Oklahoma as I roared northeast in Jimi Hendrix (my experienced car) to Springfield Missour-ah to escape a long line of tornadoes bearing down upon me.

Those little palms were a shock! Dozens of them. Far better able to survive a tornado than me.

See my PM.

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Now I'm all interested in sabal minor suddenly. I have to go searching old PalmTalk posts for trunking specimens (or, Keith & TropicDoc, post away....you're living in Sabal Minor ground zero).  I am amazed at how cool those trunking ones look.

Josh-O, that is some way cool trivia. I was about 6 years old when Fantasy Island was on the air, but I totally remember Tattoo shouting "zee plane." and we all thought it was filmed in Hawaii. Never would I have guessed L.A. 

I have never been to the LA arboretum, but isn't it the one with the famous photos of giant washingtonias and weeping willows hanging over a lagoon, and mountains in the backdrop?

Cool stuff, guys.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sandy Loam
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Glad I could inspire someone to be interested in Sabals again. Sabal Minor "Louisiana" is a trunking variety and also Sabal brazoriensis is an ancient hybrid between Minor and Palmetto. It gets a nice trunk as well. 

There was a lot of old and tall Washingtonias. They dropped seed in the cracks of my car that I will germinate later! 

Thanks everyone for the nice comments and interest in these cold hardy palms. 

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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Nice assortment. I've eaten the seeds of that spectacular old Jubaea. Yum.

The Trachycarpus takil appears to be one of the T. fortunei collected from the town near the habitat of T. takil. Takil leaves are divided in a more regular fashion than T. fortunei and are very distinctive.

Jason Dewees

Inner Sunset District

San Francisco, California

Sunset zone 17

USDA zone 10a

21 inches / 530mm annual rainfall, mostly October to April

Humidity averages 60 to 85 percent year-round.

Summer: 67F/55F | 19C/12C

Winter: 56F/44F | 13C/6C

40-year extremes: 96F/26F | 35.5C/-3.8C

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Compare the takil to fortunei. How does a true Takil differ? 

Fortunei: 

image.thumb.jpeg.b95dcaf3dac95ac350f32a2

 

Alleged Takil:image.thumb.jpg.cd5a3f35aa9dfc8138409905

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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Nice Clara!

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 12/24/2015, 7:46:47, Ovar said:

Because is not Takil :winkie: .

Takil have not fiber on the trunk. Both palms on the picture are fortunei.

I agree.  I think it's a T. fortunei mislabeled as T. takil.

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If I could have any palm on Earth it'd be that first minor, it's trunking so perfectly. I wonder if its arborescence decreases its cold tolerance though. That big Jubaea is another gem I wouldn't mind having, in a better climate with a lot of space of course.

Great pictures btw, thanks for sharing.

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I agree, it is a really awesome specimen!

I would guess that it would be a little less hardy than usual but I'm sure it would be fine in a zone 8. I collected seeds off of that palm so hopefully the trunk is a genetic trait. All of their Sabal minors were trunking except for the younger ones. Can you imagine having that palm in your front yard? 

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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1 hour ago, Ovar said:

DSCF3764.JPG

I said that?  Lol!

 

Those S. minor are nice!  I think it *could* be a genetic trait (showing a trunk), but it also could be growing conditions.  I've seen many S. minor in habitat, and sometimes you'll see a bunch next to each other with no trunk, then one or more in a different area with a trunk.  At least in the parts of AL, GA & FL that I've observed this, the trunking ones are on a little bit higher ground and have access to moving water.  I need to find my pictures I took in Gainesville last year of a few minors that were on a hillside, right in the path of a seep, that were at least double the size of palms at the bottom of the hill.

 

Seeing as those palms aren't growing next to a moving stream and probably don't get heavily watered frequently, genetics probably do play a role in forming a trunk.  How deep is the soil there?  If there's rock fairly close to the surface, that could cause the palm to be forced to push the trunk above ground.  

 

Then again, they could just be very old or var. Louisiana.  One thing is sure:  they are awesome!  

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I'm not sure about the soil, there was mulch and leaf litter everywhere. I didn't see any rocks or anything. 

Hopefully you can dig out those photos of yours. It would be cool to study this more and find out what environmental conditions trigger stem formation in minors. 

Los Angeles, CA and Myrtle Beach, SC.

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