a tough lesson about buying palms........

[trioderob]

I just had a Jubaeopsis die on me peak o summer.

(yes it got water/fert/micros)

this bring me a to cardinal buying rule particularly for newbies.

DONT BUY PALMS THAT HAVE BEEN IN A POT OF THE SAME SIZE TOO LONG AND HAVE ROOTS WHICH ARE NOT VIBRANT.

palms in a pot too long are now a bonsai

this sucker never did establish proper roots and went into slow decline.

stay away from root-bound palms unless you know what you are doing.

never underestimate the roots

if a plant is root bound you better know how to prepare the roots

Edited September 4, 2015 by trioderob

[trioderob]

give them roots room

[trioderob]

"Mankind is like forest of different trees,

Yet all roots of autotrophic trees

deep in the soil,

Only parasitic have those roots,

pierce other tree's heart! Dive deep into yourself,

O man! Can you survive without

Your roots?

know how you are here,

Is it the mortal parent brought

you here, Or your fate,

Only be grateful to their love and

care forever!" -

Ramdas Bhandarkar

[Pete in Paradise Hills]

I just had a Jubaeopsis die on me peak o summer.

(yes it got water/fert/micros)

this bring me a to cardinal buying rule particularly for newbies.

DONT BUY PALMS THAT HAVE BEEN IN A POT OF THE SAME SIZE TOO LONG AND HAVE ROOTS WHICH ARE NOT VIBRANT.

palms in a pot too long are now a bonsai

this sucker never did establish proper roots and went into slow decline.

stay away from root-bound palms unless you know what you are doing.

never underestimate the roots

if a plant is root bound you better know how to prepare the roots

Where was this plant in a pot? For me I have found plants grown locally do better than those imported from Hawaii. I have had success with 2 super silvers grown in fallbrook that were bursting out of 5g pots

[Jim in Los Altos]

Hmm. Rob, I've always had the opposite experience. The most root bound palms I've planted have always established and started growing vigorously the fastest. The palms coming out of pots with a greater soil to root ratio always seem to take longer to get with it. When I say root bound I mean a mass of roots and the pot even busting open. Those are the robust ones. Could something else possibly have been going on with you Jubaeopsis? Sometimes it's just a weak genetically palm that can't take the sudden change of being put into the ground or something else.

[trioderob]

super silver are kind of native - thats what I planted in its place - its never skipped a beat.

the JUBEOP. was local too

Hawaiian do great here if you build 50% shade cloth tent

[trioderob]

Hmm. Rob, I've always had the opposite experience. The most root bound palms I've planted have always established and started growing vigorously the fastest. The palms coming out of pots with a greater soil to root ratio always seem to take longer to get with it. When I say root bound I mean a mass of roots and the pot even busting open. Those are the robust ones. Could something else possibly have been going on with you Jubaeopsis? Sometimes it's just a weak genetically palm that can't take the sudden change of being put into the ground or something else.

anything is possible but may gut feeling is it had bad roots - I could see when i dug it out that the roots were puny

[Pete in Paradise Hills]

super silver are kind of native - thats what I planted in its place - its never skipped a beat.

the JUBEOP. was local too

Hawaiian do great here if you build 50% shade cloth tent

Have 2 b hapala one from Joe in San marcos in afternoon sun doing well another from Hawaii in filtered light burning badly but still healthy spear. 9 times out of 10 I will choose a palm from say Fallbrook over the Hawaii or Florida import

[trioderob]

my Jubaeopsis might have been genetically inferior ............

[MattyB]

You are elbow deep in your ass and still pulling

[trioderob]

Matty-

you have not been drinking Japanese rice wine - have you ?

Edited September 4, 2015 by trioderob

[Jeff Searle]

Wow.....are you guys dating?

[Bill H2DB]

Here is a VERY root bound Pseudophoenix S. that I just put in the ground last week.

I've had it for about 18 + /- years , and have finally set it free !

I slightly loosened the outer ring of root mat , and planted it in my regular yard sand , under a high oak canopy.

Buccaneer Palm 1 by Bill H, on Flickr

Bucaneer Palm 2 by Bill H, on Flickr

Bucaneer Palm 3 by Bill H, on Flickr

[Phoenikakias]

I have never ever lost a palm because it has become extremely root bound in pot prior to outplanting. And I am referring to Pritachardia, Medemia, Syagrus, Thrinax and ... JUBAEOPSIS!

[trioderob]

then you are lucky.

there are numerous articles about not leaving palms in a container for too long.

these articles include those written by people who are renowned for selling very large amounts of palms over a period of years.

there are also past threads on this very forum talking about the same subject

here is a read on the subject:

http://cru.cahe.wsu.edu/CEPublications/FS047E/FS047E.pdf

Edited September 4, 2015 by trioderob

[BS Man about Palms]

I have read and noted about trees and various other shrubs not being happy about "circling roots" and the like. I did this early on to some palms. They were not happy about it. I have since found palms in general are the LEAST affected by being under potted.

I remember working at "palm mountain" an old rare palm nursery and hearing and seeing about some 50 or so palms.. IIRC sabals that had been in 5 gal pots a long time and full of roots. Their "new" help was taking the palms out, banging the roots, straightening them out and potting them into 15 gal pots. The super saw this by about the last 5 palms... He said "fine, keep it up, learn".... Sure enough with in about 2 months or less, EVERYONE was dead..

DON'T DISTURB PALM ROOTS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE.

[LJG]

Most palms do fine jammed in a pot up to a certain point. I have killed numerous Rancho Soledad palms that were in pots cracked open because the roots had no where else to go. The root ball was so dense it would repell water and it was so packed with roots that no new roots could be pushed from the RIZ. So the palm couldn't grow new roots to spread into native soil. I have since learned to avoid palms potted like this. I have never found a Cali grown palm do this. Only ones shipped in from FL or Hawaii.

[Pando]

Ok, so I was on my smartphone reading away on this thread, and it was slow to load. Up comes MattyB's post. Then immediately popped up Bill H2DB's image. Somehow I put these together; some things can't be unseen.

[trioderob]

what weird is this was a Cali palm.

never had any problems with Hawaiian RSD palms

"in deep and still pulling "

Edited September 5, 2015 by trioderob

[Phoenikakias]

So many different cases mentioned by me all other than luck should suggest. Something else happens that evades our attention

[Sabal Steve]

Rob,

What was the soil culture and sun exposure like? Could you tell us a little about your watering pattern?

I planted a large one gallon out earlier in the year, and it's done fine - albeit quite slow. It went into full sun and clay, and I am only able to water it with the garden hose every 10 days or so, so it can't be getting watered too deep. I'll probably get a 5 gallon bucket with a small hole to slow water it at some point. Strangely, there was not all that much root mass in the 1 gal container, so maybe we're comparing apples to oranges, but I think any additional insight would be helpful.

[cagary]

I have read and noted about trees and various other shrubs not being happy about "circling roots" and the like. I did this early on to some palms. They were not happy about it. I have since found palms in general are the LEAST affected by being under potted.

I remember working at "palm mountain" an old rare palm nursery and hearing and seeing about some 50 or so palms.. IIRC sabals that had been in 5 gal pots a long time and full of roots. Their "new" help was taking the palms out, banging the roots, straightening them out and potting them into 15 gal pots. The super saw this by about the last 5 palms... He said "fine, keep it up, learn".... Sure enough with in about 2 months or less, EVERYONE was dead..

DON'T DISTURB PALM ROOTS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE.

You mean all of the "new" help had died?

[Josh-O]

That rice wine looked tasty..

I say roll the dice..