Syagrus botryophora (then and now) when will it seed?

[Walt]

Back in October of 2009 I bought a 7.5 gallon Syagrus botryophora. Prior to this one I had another, but lost it to a freeze when it was young with no developed trunk. Also, I had it planted in the open yard where it would get the full brunt of cold, frost, wind, etc.

With my second S. bot. (shown in below photos) I decided to container grow it until it started to develop a trunk. During the winters of 2009-2010 and 2010-2011 I placed the palm in my heated greenhouse on freezing nights. It's a good thing I didn't plant my S. bot. because January of 2010 and December of 2010 were very cold.

In April of 2011 I planted out my S. bot in a more sheltered location, and this location has become even more sheltered since then. My S. bot. went through the past two winters fine.

Right now my S. bot has 15 feet of clear trunk.I'm wondering how much trunk it will need to have until it first flowers and develops viable seed, as I would like to propagate more of these palms. I have one other S. bot. growing in a more shaded area than this one and it hasn't grown near as fast. Even this palm doesn't get full sun. If so, it probably would be taller than it is. But this palm is by far the fastest grower I ever had.Perhaps my now dead Caryota urens might be close.

Above Photo: My Syagrus botryophora (second from left and shown by red arrow) the day I brought it home from the D'Asign palm sale.

Above photo: My Syagrus botryophora after planting in the ground in April of 2011.

Above photo: My Syagrus botryophora as of October 26, 2014.

[Rafael]

Quite impressive growth Walt

Mine is still in that first stage

[dalmatiansoap]

Woohoo! Great specimen! I lost mine in "pre first" stage.

[Jeff Searle]

Your a few feet away(trunk) from it starting to flower from all the ones I have seen. Maybe a year or two more. It looks good! If your in a sandy soil, give it plenty of water.

[Mike Evans]

Wow, that is looking good Walt. Glad to see it does so well in colder areas.

[Walt]

Your a few feet away(trunk) from it starting to flower from all the ones I have seen. Maybe a year or two more. It looks good! If your in a sandy soil, give it plenty of water.

That's good to hear, but hope my S. bot. survives the upcoming winter. As I said, the past two winters were relatively mild. My soil is pure sand. I normally hand water this palm 2-3 times a week when we aren't getting rain. But this past rainy season was a good one. I think my area exceeded the normal average. All the lakes up here are full and many piers were under water.

[Walt]

Wow, that is looking good Walt. Glad to see it does so well in colder areas.

Thanks, Mike. But like I said, this palm hasn't seen any real cold so far. I fear one day my palm will sucumb to a bad freeze.

And BTW, that butiagrus palm you gave me for hosting the June 2013 CFPACS meeting is doing great. It's grown noticably.

[Walt]

Another year has almost come and gone -- and still no inflorescence on my Syagrus botryophora. It's still growing taller and I'm having a hard time viewing/seeing just what is going one way up top. I took this photo today as documentation of another year of growth.

 

 

[DoomsDave]

That is a fine specimen!

I just pray for it in the winter. They don't take the cold well, but maybe yours has been made bullet-proof . . .

[Walt]

37 minutes ago, DoomsDave said:

That is a fine specimen!

I just pray for it in the winter. They don't take the cold well, but maybe yours has been made bullet-proof . . .

No, they don't take cold and frost well. I lost one to a freeze back in 2006.  Luckily, the past three winters were relatively mild (slightly above average for nighttime lows on the coldest days). My lowest temperature for the last three winters was 30 degrees F (this past winter), but that was at about 4-6 feet above the ground. I estimate that it was a couple of degrees warmer at the palm's canopy as my coldest nights are always radiational cooling nights, and the air is warmer the higher up from the ground. And of course, the 30 degrees only lasted a few minutes at sunrise.

I have another S. botryophora (about 1/3 or less the size of the one shown) planted in a more protected area with a huge clump of Bambusa oldhamii growing on the northside of it. However, that clump totally died over the past several months (I was totally dumbfounded about it) and will have to all be cut down (a monumental task), leaving my other S. botryophora exposed.

If you look fast to the right of screen starting around the 1:07 mark you can see my other S. botryophora (maybe a little taller now as I shot this video last May) by the clump of Bambusa oldhamii (now mostly dead).

 

 

 

[Tyrone]

Walt I enjoyed your video. I've got some S botryphora seed I'm waiting to germinate at the moment and these are a very nice species. I also love B oldhamii. I planted a row of 22 of them to create a cathedral effect and huge frost/windbreak and they're growing like crazy at the moment. I love bamboo. You should plant another B oldhamii to replace the one lost, maybe in a different area. It's weird that it just died like that.

[Walt]

1 hour ago, Tyrone said:

Walt I enjoyed your video. I've got some S botryphora seed I'm waiting to germinate at the moment and these are a very nice species. I also love B oldhamii. I planted a row of 22 of them to create a cathedral effect and huge frost/windbreak and they're growing like crazy at the moment. I love bamboo. You should plant another B oldhamii to replace the one lost, maybe in a different area. It's weird that it just died like that.

Tyrone: I can't for the life of me understand how the entire clump of Bambusa oldhamii died just like that. The first sign of warning was that I noticed new late summer culms were not coming up. I think only four new culms came up, and these were much shorter and smaller in diameter that normal. Then I started seeing defoliation of the leaves, but new leaves weren't emerging. Eventually, I could tell some of the culms were dead and changing color.

I also like bamboo. I'm growing about seven species of bamboo. One species I particularly like (that I'm growing) is Bambusa membranacea. I took the below video of it last May. Since then it's sent up a new cycle of culms and expanded the diameter of the clump. I like this species better than B. oldhamii. I will try to post a photo of my dead clump of B. oldhamii in the next day or so. Little did I know when I took that video my clump would be dead in a few months.

 

 

[DoomsDave]

Walt:

I wonder if they have to have that warm climate like in Miami that give them that "flivver" trunk, instead of that nice compact crown like yours has before it will flower?

I've seen a number here in Cali, and they don't seem to want to get down and funky and reproduce, so very unlike everyone else out here . . . . .

 

[Walt]

8 hours ago, DoomsDave said:

Walt:

I wonder if they have to have that warm climate like in Miami that give them that "flivver" trunk, instead of that nice compact crown like yours has before it will flower?

I've seen a number here in Cali, and they don't seem to want to get down and funky and reproduce, so very unlike everyone else out here . . . . .

 

Dave: It's no big deal if my S. bot. doesn't flower and seed, I'm just curious as to why it seems to be taking so long. I have a foxtail palm with 15 feet of trunk, and so far it's never flowered. Yet, I see them all  the time half that size seeding. Of course, I don't mind as I don't want anymore foxtail palms nor the mess with the seeds (like I see in people's yards that have foxtails).

[Walt]

Well, Jeff said in his reply two years ago that my Syagrus botryophora was about two years away from seedling. Well, he was right on the mark as my palm started producing its first spathe this past late spring. In fact, I think since I first noticed the emerging spathe that there is a second spathe emerging 180 degree opposite the first one. The problem is that I just can't get a good cameral angle on the crown of the palm due to all the other palm and tree obstructions. I can't even stand back far enough now to get the entire palm in my camera frame.

I don't know if this is normal for this particular species of syagrus, but I note that this spathe is short and stout, as compared to a queen palm's spathe, which are long like a bull African elephant's tusk.

[palmfriend]

Thank you for those photos showing the growth rate so well!

It is amazing how some species almost "explode" when put in the ground -

and congratulations for reaching the next (seedling) stage!

best regards

 

[palmfriend]

Thank you for those photos showing the growth rate so well!

It is amazing how some species almost "explode" when put in the ground -

and congratulations for reaching the next (seedling) stage!

best regards

 

[Pal Meir]

11 hours ago, Walt said:

 

I don't know if this is normal for this particular species of syagrus, but I note that this spathe is short and stout, as compared to a queen palm's spathe, which are long like a bull African elephant's tusk.

It seems to be normal that the prophyll of S botryophora is stout and short; there is a photo in Lorenzi et al. 2004, p. 207 that shows the same appearance of the spathe as on your palm.

[PalmTreeDude]

On October 27, 2014 at 10:30:34 AM, Walt said:

Back in October of 2009 I bought a 7.5 gallon Syagrus botryophora. Prior to this one I had another, but lost it to a freeze when it was young with no developed trunk. Also, I had it planted in the open yard where it would get the full brunt of cold, frost, wind, etc.

 

With my second S. bot. (shown in below photos) I decided to container grow it until it started to develop a trunk. During the winters of 2009-2010 and 2010-2011 I placed the palm in my heated greenhouse on freezing nights. It's a good thing I didn't plant my S. bot. because January of 2010 and December of 2010 were very cold.

 

In April of 2011 I planted out my S. bot in a more sheltered location, and this location has become even more sheltered since then. My S. bot. went through the past two winters fine.

 

Right now my S. bot has 15 feet of clear trunk.I'm wondering how much trunk it will need to have until it first flowers and develops viable seed, as I would like to propagate more of these palms. I have one other S. bot. growing in a more shaded area than this one and it hasn't grown near as fast. Even this palm doesn't get full sun. If so, it probably would be taller than it is. But this palm is by far the fastest grower I ever had.Perhaps my now dead Caryota urens might be close.

 

 

Above Photo: My Syagrus botryophora (second from left and shown by red arrow) the day I brought it home from the D'Asign palm sale.

 

 

Above photo: My Syagrus botryophora after planting in the ground in April of 2011.

 

 

Above photo: My Syagrus botryophora as of October 26, 2014.

 

Woah! Amazing!

[Walt]

I suppose my S. botryophora will slow down its growth rate now. I know queen palms seem to slow down after growing relatively fast the first 5-7 years. My other S. botryophora hasn't grown near the same speed as the one pictured here. Genes?  Culture? They both get about the same culture (fertilization, watering, and sun). No way to make conclusive judgments when you just have two palms of the same species. My other, smaller S. bot. is planted in a slightly warmer spot (2-3 degrees on the coldest radiational cooling nights), so in that respect it should survive longer in the event of a hard freeze.

[Al in Kona]

I like the looks of Syagrus botryophora but for me the negative aspect of this palm is that the old dry leaves hang on the palm (not self cleaning) and when it gets so tall I'm not about to climb up that thin trunk to trim them off.  My tree has produced seed a number of times as you can see in the pic.  Right now it has two spathes being produced so guess I will have more later this year too.  My tree must be about 30 ft. tall now.

[Peter Pacific]

Beautiful palm.  I had two die and the last one I took out of the ground and put it in a pot.  It has been in the ground for years but just es didn't grow in my conditions, full sun, sandy soil.  Hopefully I will see some improvement.