ditto.

Will the real heteromorpha please stand up?!

Matty - both the Dr. Balansky and the Mike Harris collections are about 23 miles from Moose Land. Ironically, Mr. Harris & I will be visiting Randy (Palmisland) for a mini PRA/CRA tomorrow. If time permits, perhaps a quick side trip can happen. Mr. Harris has such a large collection - we may have difficulty locating the Dypsis heteromorpha in his 3+ acre garden, if its still around. Pete's palm may also be difficult to locate. There are so many undescribed or yet to be ID'd Dypsis in his extensive collection.

Mr. Searle - we are meeting at Mike's at 7:30 am (New Years Day). You are more than welcome to join us enjoying Bagels, Palms & Crotons.

Yea right! I was never officially asked. Or welcomed. Considered? Is this some secretive "click" or group of favorites I don't belong to? Are there dues I have to pay? Was my cell phone # lost? You could of mailed me an invite, you know.

OK....I want to come, but I first have to check with the Boss ( wife). If so, I will have to rise bright and early and get my chores done first. Ok?

As far as the palm in question, we ARE talking about the one in the pictures above, right?

Before you all jump on Ron, I'm pretty sure he was stating that Pete has the real deal, meaning the very palm we all have ( in question). And I like others questioned from the very get go if indeed this WAS the real Dypsis heteromorpha. After all, it comes from very high elevations and SHOULD NOT grow here in south Florida at 0 elevation. So put your sticks down.

Yea right! I was never officially asked. Or welcomed. Considered? Is this some secretive "click" or group of favorites I don't belong to? Are there dues I have to pay? Was my cell phone # lost? You could of mailed me an invite, you know.

OK....I want to come, but I first have to check with the Boss ( wife). If so, I will have to rise bright and early and get my chores done first. Ok?

Mr Moose is the Master of Ceremonies...i'm just along for the ride....you are most welcome

New Years Resolution...develop social skills

Matty - both the Dr. Balansky and the Mike Harris collections are about 23 miles from Moose Land. Ironically, Mr. Harris & I will be visiting Randy (Palmisland) for a mini PRA/CRA tomorrow. If time permits, perhaps a quick side trip can happen. Mr. Harris has such a large collection - we may have difficulty locating the Dypsis heteromorpha in his 3+ acre garden, if its still around. Pete's palm may also be difficult to locate. There are so many undescribed or yet to be ID'd Dypsis in his extensive collection.

Take pictures moose. Take pictures...

Pictures!

Please?

Moose only bumps

Now wait a minute, Moose is the King of Kings when starting new threads and posting pictures....over on Palmpedia. Ask Dean, he's a huge asset over on that site. Anyways, it's all good and hopefully somebody will take a few pictures tomorrow.

Just got off the phone with Searle, he is on board. Looks like we may be searching the Harris estate, then on to Pete's?

Photo's will be posted on Palmpedia. My feelings should recover from the bruising.

Don't forget to ask where the seed was collected...

Happy New Year!

Now wait a minute, Moose is the King of Kings when starting new threads and posting pictures....over on Palmpedia. Ask Dean, he's a huge asset over on that site. Anyways, it's all good and hopefully somebody will take a few pictures tomorrow.

Yep - Moose Man is the Palmpedia Man.

Don't forget to ask where the seed was collected...

Happy New Year!

Saw Dr B today...and his heteromorpha. He said he got the seed from Alfred 10 or so years ago.

Moose took a few pics but said he's having trouble posting pics with new browser his son installed.

He's going to try to post them on PalmPedia but between Randy's palms and crotons...and Pete's

secret stash a lot of pics were taken. Pete still has half a dozen or so Dypsis, wild collected, remain unnamed.

Still unable to post photos on Palm Talk. I've uploaded Pete's Dypsis heteromorpha photos on Palmpedia. They can be located in the 2014 PRA thread. I've also made a separate thread "Dypsis heteromorpha", so you don't have to search through such a long thread. Its up to you to decide if Pete's palm is the same as everyone else's.

Moose,

The palm you uploaded looks like albofarinosa and is different than the palm we are growing as heteromorpha.

Here are Moose' photos, not sure if it's the same as what I've seen here in California.

Pretty sure that is not the same palm so now we have three candidates. Unless Alfred went to Tsaratanana would seem unlikely that this is the real one.

Pete's Dypsis heteromorpha is indeed an albofarinosa. I am surprised this was not cleared up on the PRA with all the knowledgable palm people around...

Chrysalidocarpus rufescens; previously Dypsis heteromorpha, aka sp. 215. 

6 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

Chrysalidocarpus rufescens; previously Dypsis heteromorpha, aka sp. 215. 

It has an official name now or is this a joke I didn't get?!

No joke

14 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

No joke

Please do elaborate.... So is it that the plant we have been growing as Dypsis (Chrysalidocarpus) heteromorpha has been split off with a new name and there is something else out there that is the "real deal" C heteromorpha, or was Dypsis "heteromorpha" an interim name when it was a type of onilahensis/baronii?

Photos of what I have been growing as Dypsis (Chrysalidocarpus) heteromorpha below.

Thank you for sharing, elaborating and educating.  Further reading assignments are welcome (papers or links).

There is another palm that was described as Dypsis heteromorpha. The palm we are mentioning is not it. New name for this palm is now known. Not sure if the true heteromorpha is still a Dypsis. 

15 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

There is another palm that was described as Dypsis heteromorpha. The palm we are mentioning is not it. New name for this palm is now known. Not sure if the true heteromorpha is still a Dypsis. 

Where did you come across this new information? I was under the impression that the plants in cultivation (with tristichious habit, fuzzy red colour) have keyed out to be the same as that described as D heteromorpha (now C heteromorphus). Even down to the flowers and seeds I thought there were reports of them matching, as well as the success in cultivation in cooler areas which makes sense given the high altitude of the habitat. Maybe others with mature specimens in their gardens can comment on how they key out to the description. 

On 11/10/2022 at 9:18 AM, Mandrew968 said:

Chrysalidocarpus rufescens; previously Dypsis heteromorpha, aka sp. 215. 

 

11 hours ago, tim_brissy_13 said:

Where did you come across this new information? I was under the impression that the plants in cultivation (with tristichious habit, fuzzy red colour) have keyed out to be the same as that described as D heteromorpha (now C heteromorphus). Even down to the flowers and seeds I thought there were reports of them matching, as well as the success in cultivation in cooler areas which makes sense given the high altitude of the habitat. Maybe others with mature specimens in their gardens can comment on how they key out to the description. 

 Tim, as you point out this must be some really NEW news.  I went back to the paper from Taxon that Bill Baker shared in August on the "Phylogenomics and generic limits of Dypsidinae..." which he-coauthored and others.  Link he provided to the paper is here for reference:   https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/tax.12797

When I reviewed the listing of what is now Chrysalidocarpus, Dypsis and Vonitra on pages 7 & 8, where species are classified into their new genus, it confirms the reclassification of Dypsis heteromorpha as Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus .  Missing from the species list is the new species name which Mandrew968 has shared, which is Chrysalidocarpus rufescens..  So if there is something new since the paper was published in August, I'm hoping we can get more detail as in perhaps a link to the paper making this announcement which clarifies the keys to differentiate between Chrysalidocarpus rufescens and Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus???

following...

Well rufescens means reddish so makes sense.

15 hours ago, Tracy said:

 

 Tim, as you point out this must be some really NEW news.  I went back to the paper from Taxon that Bill Baker shared in August on the "Phylogenomics and generic limits of Dypsidinae..." which he-coauthored and others.  Link he provided to the paper is here for reference:   https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/tax.12797

When I reviewed the listing of what is now Chrysalidocarpus, Dypsis and Vonitra on pages 7 & 8, where species are classified into their new genus, it confirms the reclassification of Dypsis heteromorpha as Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus .  Missing from the species list is the new species name which Mandrew968 has shared, which is Chrysalidocarpus rufescens..  So if there is something new since the paper was published in August, I'm hoping we can get more detail as in perhaps a link to the paper making this announcement which clarifies the keys to differentiate between Chrysalidocarpus rufescens and Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus???

The plant in cultivation as Dypsis heteromorpha was never correct. Just became a trade name. It doesn’t key out exact in POM from what I recall. The plant Baker references is true heteromorpha as described in POM. Hopefully in the write up for rufescens we can read what separated it from heteromorpha.

7 hours ago, LJG said:

The plant in cultivation as Dypsis heteromorpha was never correct. Just became a trade name. It doesn’t key out exact in POM from what I recall. The plant Baker references is true heteromorpha as described in POM. Hopefully in the write up for rufescens we can read what separated it from heteromorpha.

Thanks Len.  Until we can see the article, I feel like I am listening to that song by Creedence Clearwater Revival, "I heard it through the Grapevine".  

1 hour ago, Tracy said:

Thanks Len.  Until we can see the article, I feel like I am listening to that song by Creedence Clearwater Revival, "I heard it through the Grapevine".  

It will be interesting to see if they found it in habitat and were able to describe from there or if this description is from cultivation. I always felt like this palm behaved as a southern or high plateau palm, not a northern rain forest palm like where heteromorpha comes from. 

Thanks Len. Guys, this is what I do to feed my kids. Not a rumor but people like to keep things hush until publishing. Thought palmtalk might like the skinny before the rest of the world...

4 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

Thanks Len. Guys, this is what I do to feed my kids. Not a rumor but people like to keep things hush until publishing. Thought palmtalk might like the skinny before the rest of the world...

Any idea about timing for the publication?  You have definitely stimulated some appetites.   

On 11/16/2022 at 9:17 AM, Tracy said:

Any idea about timing for the publication?  You have definitely stimulated some appetites.   

No sir, I don't. But make a note and when it happens, you can say, "already knew that one!"

4 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

No sir, I don't. But make a note and when it happens, you can say, "already knew that one!"

So noted and appreciated.   If I do get around to replacing my palm name tags, you have also saved me an interim tag.  I would have been migrating this to Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus, but I will be able to go straight to C rufescens.

I am totally amazed that the name Chrysalidocarpus rufescens is being bandied about before it has even been published. It is not helpful to have such "leaks" occur and I wonder who the source is. 

At any rate, I am working in this very subject at the moment. Whatever the name will be, this is a very beautiful palm.
john

On 11/24/2022 at 1:45 AM, John Dransfield said:

At any rate, I am working in this very subject at the moment. Whatever the name will be, this is a very beautiful palm.
john

I enjoyed reading the article on the newly named Chrysalidocarpus rufescens in Palms 67(1) Pages 43-50 today.  At some time, it will be interesting to see the real Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus at some point in the future.  It sounds as though there are none of the real Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus known to be in cultivation at this point.  Is that accurate?

On 3/25/2023 at 8:08 AM, Tracy said:

I enjoyed reading the article on the newly named Chrysalidocarpus rufescens in Palms 67(1) Pages 43-50 today.  At some time, it will be interesting to see the real Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus at some point in the future.  It sounds as though there are none of the real Chrysalidocarpus heteromorphus known to be in cultivation at this point.  Is that accurate?

Just had a read too. That’s how I read it. 
 

Btw, not a chance those Trachys in Cornwall are geminisectus. Don’t really look anything like them (aside from the growth rate and texture issue noted in the journal).