How to ID juvenile mules for the best form

[KennyRE317]

haha, I guess my triple mule isn't going to be going in my yard

[tank]

Here are 2 updated photos. It is very difficult to photograph since it is buried behind other trees and a big boulder. The palm is probabably 25 feet and two foot trunk minimum. It holds more leaves than you could possibly count and is very jurassic looking. Notice also that this palm has bright yellow petioles.

Man, this plant is really keeping its older leaves. The elevator reference definitely applies. Definitely not a mongrel. Thank you for the updated pictures.

[edbrown_III]

Tank, I meant to tell you theat the palms had taken down to 20 or so --- the one had its crown collapsed that first cold winter but pushed back. 89 I had the regular mule I got from Merrill crown colaspe too butr it putlled through ad is huge . Same way with Brahea clara --- I thought I had lost it but it came back. Alll of these happen the first year they were planted so it must be a first winter cold sensitivity thing. I will try to take a few pictures of leaf comparison may be some one can discenr the difference ---

Best regards

Ed

[KennyRE317]

with the super upright growth habit of that mule, it would make an awesome canopy in a smaller corner. too bad there's no real way to tell if a mule will have more upright fronds or more relaxed ones

Edited July 22, 2013 by KennyRE317

[sonoranfans]

with the super upright growth habit of that mule, it would make an awesome canopy in a smaller corner. too bad there's no real way to tell if a mule will have more upright fronds or more relaxed ones

one way would be to get a more upright butia as the mother plant. butia yatay x syagrus should be more upright. Camerons mule is a yatay x syagrus in this thread:

http://www.palmtalk.org/forum/index.php?/topic/37295-cold-hardy-blue-palms/

Its in post #15, and its quite upright and pretty fast.

The only yatay x syagrus available in the US that I know of are from patric shafer in northern California. His are small seedlings(2'+ overall)

[KennyRE317]

with the super upright growth habit of that mule, it would make an awesome canopy in a smaller corner. too bad there's no real way to tell if a mule will have more upright fronds or more relaxed ones

one way would be to get a more upright butia as the mother plant. butia yatay x syagrus should be more upright. Camerons mule is a yatay x syagrus in this thread:

http://www.palmtalk.org/forum/index.php?/topic/37295-cold-hardy-blue-palms/

Its in post #15, and its quite upright and pretty fast.

The only yatay x syagrus available in the US that I know of are from patric shafer in northern California. His are small seedlings(2'+ overall)

interesting thread in the link! .... my butia capitata compacta has been planted for almost 2 months and starting to turn a bit bluer now that it's been in the ground, i'm curious to see how it'll turn out in a couple more months or a year

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Here are 2 updated photos. It is very difficult to photograph since it is buried behind other trees and a big boulder. The palm is probabably 25 feet and two foot trunk minimum. It holds more leaves than you could possibly count and is very jurassic looking. Notice also that this palm has bright yellow petioles.

Now that is a beautiful massive palm, very jurassic looking, I wonder what it will look like when it starts trunking. I love the yellow petioles. This is why hybrids are fun, especially on F2, because you just don't know what you're gonna get. This one is probably only reproducible via tissue culture.

It's not what I would be looking for when trying to fit in a mule palm into my landscaping where I want to place a dainty coconut looking palm, but I would still love to grow something like that elsewhere in my garden - if I even knew where to find a specimen like that. It does look like it provides some pretty significant wildlife habitat, be careful, could be rats in there, you might need to start keeping some snakes or feed some feral cats to encourage them to hunt around your palms.

[Tropicdoc]

I would like a coconutty mule too. Axel we've discussed this before (picking a queen-looking mule) Palms look tropical to me when they have a thin trunk. I always wondered if a butiagrus x syagrus would get the look. I just bought 4 of tim hopper's p. sunkha x syagrus. Hoping that these will have a nice look. I think they will survive my climate with a need for heat cables maybe every 4 or 5 years. In my neighborhood is this butia that has laxed leaflets and a thin trunk. There are several fruiting queens around it. I wish I knew how to hybridize!

[Tropicdoc]

well I cant figure out how to paste in the pic of the lax leaf butia on my street. Its in a thread I started called droopy butia id

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

I would like a coconutty mule too. Axel we've discussed this before (picking a queen-looking mule) Palms look tropical to me when they have a thin trunk. I always wondered if a butiagrus x syagrus would get the look. I just bought 4 of tim hopper's p. sunkha x syagrus. Hoping that these will have a nice look. I think they will survive my climate with a need for heat cables maybe every 4 or 5 years. In my neighborhood is this butia that has laxed leaflets and a thin trunk. There are several fruiting queens around it. I wish I knew how to hybridize!

Agreed. We are working on two different hybrids, p. cocoides x queen and p cocoides x cocos nucifera. Hopefully they will yield a thin trunk hardy palm.

[Tropicdoc]

Sorry guys if I misled anyone my hybrids are properly syagrus x p sunkha. Parajub pollen on syagrus flowers

[RJ]

On 7/20/2013 at 11:49 AM, Gtlevine said:

Speaking of Jurrasic Mules, this palm is the sibling of the beast above. It is absolutely enormous palm with more the traditional mule look to it. Trunk is beginning to rival Jubaea. I put a standard shovel for scale.

 

@Gtlevine Gary do you have an update of this palm, and possible the "elevator shaft" palm. I have a few mule back crosses from patric and I'm pretty sure your palms are the daddy's. 

 

If I've done my reading correctly these are the offspring of the HFG mule created by Dr. Wilcox correct? 

Edited July 15, 2019 by RJ

[Gtlevine]

You are correct, they are from seeds off that palm in 1998. I will update them when i get a chance.

[Gtlevine]

Here is one of them

[RJ]

On 7/20/2019 at 12:29 PM, Gtlevine said:

Here is one of them

Thanks Gary, look how many fronds that tree is holding. Has to be 30+. Do your two F2's produce viable seeds as well? Or are they just pollen fertile? Look forward to a picture of the other one, it looks like it has a massive trunk. 

[Gtlevine]

They produce some viable seed

[Gtlevine]

Other F2 

this one is enormous with a 40-50 foot span

[Kailua_Krish]

3 hours ago, Gtlevine said:

They produce some viable seed

If you ever have extra I’m sure they’d sell like hot-cakes on here

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

15 hours ago, Gtlevine said:

Other F2 

this one is enormous with a 40-50 foot span

Now that is a mule palm I would definitely buy some viable seeds !!! 

[RJ]

That monster rocks. So sounds like it's 20+/- years old correct? Is the mother palm still at the garden? 

[Collectorpalms]

On 7/26/2019 at 12:25 PM, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

Now that is a mule palm I would definitely buy some viable seeds !!! 

So that's what I have, an offspring from HBG, and I am going to have to move it, its going to get way too big for location. I am glad it survived the freeze, cause I didn't think I would be able to replace it. I posted it on my freeze update thread. I can tell its got Jubaea in it.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Collectorpalms

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

@Collectorpalms that's a shame you have to move it but amazing it outlasted Palmageddon =) I prefer any hybrid that exhibits more of the Jubaea characteristics. Crossing my fingers for a successful transplant of it !! 

T J 

[Collectorpalms]

51 minutes ago, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

@Collectorpalms that's a shame you have to move it but amazing it outlasted Palmageddon =) I prefer any hybrid that exhibits more of the Jubaea characteristics. Crossing my fingers for a successful transplant of it !! 

T J 

Whaaat is your best of Favorite Hybrid?  I am tossed up. I am sorta done with regular mules? They are everywhere now at the big landscape outlets. Mine mentioned here is just going to turn into the monster mule, not the mutant looking one Id still die for one like that. Maybe there is something in that granite soil. I just put two regular mules in the ground that I think I want to take out and put in more rare ones. I am guessing I have another 20 years till I have to worry about the next killer big freeze. I am already better prepared for the next event.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Collectorpalms

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

1 hour ago, Collectorpalms said:

Whaaat is your best of Favorite Hybrid?

This is a very simple question and I believe you own one. JxS hands down best mule out there 2nd is BxPJT then BxLytoWedd. The JxS still eludes me but one day I'll have one haha. I have a BxPJT and BxLytoWedd planted in my front yard planter. JxB will go in the ground hoping next year. 

T J 

[Collectorpalms]

19 minutes ago, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

This is a very simple question and I believe you own one. JxS hands down best mule out there 2nd is BxPJT then BxLytoWedd. The JxS still eludes me but one day I'll have one haha. I have a BxPJT and BxLytoWedd planted in my front yard planter. JxB will go in the ground hoping next year. 

T J 

Yes, I do have the JxS. Right now its going through a bit of an ugly duckling nutrient issue. Actually a lot of my palms are. None of the potted ones got fertilized in their pots for a year. They just got water. I had a 50 pound bag of Palmgain, but never used it. After the freeze I think I had PTSD, it wasnt until I got rid of all my telephone poles this spring I could look outside.

Anyhow. The city is going to tear up the yard and I am losing my biggest Canary and a Live oak that takes up most of my center island. So its in a hold pattern right now, and JxS getting treated trying to decide if it should go in the new center island of the yard. But if it stays picky with spotting I might not keep it, the Jubaea Genes are strong. But, I have zero issues with queens in my soil and water. They get fat and healthy green.

I also have the BxPJT that had spear pull this winter, but its come back fast. Its a lot more tropical looking. I would say that my third Choice would be your third as well! How much was yours and what size when you got it? BxLytoWedd ?

Edited May 21, 2022 by Collectorpalms

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

8 hours ago, Collectorpalms said:

I also have the BxPJT that had spear pull this winter, but its come back fast. Its a lot more tropical looking. I would say that my third Choice would be your third as well! How much was yours and what size when you got it? BxLytoWedd ?

What temp did your BxPJT see to spear pull ? I'm expecting this palm to be bulletproof except for maybe another Palmageddon but what are the chances. I bought my BxLytoWedd as an 8x12 for 90$ or so about 2 years ago. Well if you decide to give up on your JxS tell me a price and I'll take it off your hands =) 

T J