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Tracy

I don't even remember now, at which So Cal Palm Society meeting auction I bought this Dypsis.  I do recall it was solitary and probably no more than a 1 gallon when purchased.  I dropped it in a shaded spot under a Burretiokentia hapala, probably anticipating it would be a smaller gauge trunk and continue taking advantage of the Burretiokentia's shade.  It has since produced one new subterranean offset from the main trunk.  Any thoughts on which fine leafed Dypsis this is?  Markings on the trunk should be a clue.

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Tracy
12 hours ago, Tracy said:

Any thoughts on which fine leafed Dypsis this is?  Markings on the trunk should be a clue.

So, no takers.  I think I recall seeing similar markings on the leaf sheath of Jason's (aka Hilo Jason) young Dypsis sp Lafazamanga .  What I don't remember is his plant having these narrow leaflets, which more resemble Dypsis onilahensis leaflets in width, but then it could be that mine is still a small plant, stretched in full shade.  Any thoughts on id are appreciated.

20200906-BH3I0988.jpg

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lzorrito

D. arenarum...?

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Tracy
9 hours ago, lzorrito said:

D. arenarum...?

Isso é possível.  I can't rule it out.  I'll watch and repost when it gets larger or maybe post the other one I got at the same time which has remained solitary.  Both were the same size on acquisition, but I planted the other one which is still solitary quite a bit before I planted the one pictured above.

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joe_OC

D arenerum has red emerging spears, even when young.  D lafazamanga emerging spears are green when young, but become red as the plants matures.  

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Matt in OC

I agree with Joe on it being neither of those. It’s so colorful that it almost looks like sp. Lafa, but obviously too slight for that and not solitary. The delicacy of the leaflets and size looks like albofarinosa but the shape of the leaflets and coloring of the base is wrong. Baronii blacks stem? :D

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tim_brissy_13

Maybe psammophila? Complete guess based on the dainty size/structure and some darker colours showing through. 

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Frond-friend42

Looks most like psammophila compared to others so far...to me.

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Matt in OC

The speckling doesn’t look like my tiny Psammo sucker. I seem to remember Basilonga having that speckling but haven’t had a chance to take a look yet.

DCCFB06D-17A9-4BBE-BD98-BAE3767DDA2D.jpeg

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Tracy
17 minutes ago, Matt in OC said:

he speckling doesn’t look like my tiny Psammo sucker. I seem to remember Basilonga having that speckling but haven’t had a chance to take a look yet.

 

Correct Matt, the speckling looks nothing like Dypsis psammophila, even if the leaflets and leaves look somewhat similar.  This holds more leaflets on a leaf than my psammophila as well.  Speckling is similar to Dypsis basilonga, except basilonga's speckling is more distributed on a white background, this is more dense.  I haven't ruled out a hybrid but am not ready to concede that yet.  I actually bought two of these at the auction.  The other plant was put in the ground first and has remained solitary.  I'll get a photo of it in the next couple of days.  It has a narrow gauge trunk similar to albofarinosa & psammophila.  Most of the year it is in deep shade, but in mid summer when the sun is in it's highest arc, it does get some mid-day full sun.

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lzorrito
13 hours ago, Tracy said:

Isso é possível.  I can't rule it out.  I'll watch and repost when it gets larger or maybe post the other one I got at the same time which has remained solitary.  Both were the same size on acquisition, but I planted the other one which is still solitary quite a bit before I planted the one pictured above.

 

13 hours ago, joe_OC said:

D arenerum has red emerging spears, even when young.  D lafazamanga emerging spears are green when young, but become red as the plants matures.  

Both quite right, but as you all know, different soil types, places of grown, shady or sunny position, much or less water, fertilizer or not and so on, really have a lot of influence on the appearance and structure of palm trees. Let's wait and see how it evolves as it grows.

@Tracy, just curious...does it has a heel?

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Tracy
9 hours ago, Tracy said:

The other plant was put in the ground first and has remained solitary.  I'll get a photo of it in the next couple of days.  It has a narrow gauge trunk similar to albofarinosa & psammophila.  Most of the year it is in deep shade, but in mid summer when the sun is in it's highest arc, it does get some mid-day full sun.

Here are pictures of the sibling plant that I purchased at the same time as the original posted plant.  When I got them, they looked identical.  This second plant I'm posting is a little larger, as it went into the ground first and has put all its energy into the single trunk instead of pushing out a below ground sucker.

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Hilo Jason

I’m thinking Lafazamanga, except the solitary one puzzles me a bit. But the coloring and marking of the suckering example sure looks similar to Lafazamanga. 

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Matt in OC

Lafazamanga has been so robust for me. I agree with Jason on some of the markings on the trunk, but...

Heres mine. 

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Dypsisdean

I thought I remembered a discussion that some of these D. lafazamangas may be hybrids from the garden where some recent seeds and plants were distributed.

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Palm Tree Jim
22 hours ago, Tracy said:

Correct Matt, the speckling looks nothing like Dypsis psammophila, even if the leaflets and leaves look somewhat similar.  This holds more leaflets on a leaf than my psammophila as well.  Speckling is similar to Dypsis basilonga, except basilonga's speckling is more distributed on a white background, this is more dense.  I haven't ruled out a hybrid but am not ready to concede that yet.  I actually bought two of these at the auction.  The other plant was put in the ground first and has remained solitary.  I'll get a photo of it in the next couple of days.  It has a narrow gauge trunk similar to albofarinosa & psammophila.  Most of the year it is in deep shade, but in mid summer when the sun is in it's highest arc, it does get some mid-day full sun.

I have to agree, not psammophila. Let me grab some pictures of my psammophila and a plant that reminds me of your mystery Dypsis Tracy. If I recall, my plant was purchased as a hybrid. 

The problem is, not sure of what.

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Palm Tree Jim
8 hours ago, Dypsisdean said:

I thought I remembered a discussion that some of these D. lafazamangas may be hybrids from the garden where some recent seeds and plants were distributed.

How long ago Dean?

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Palm Tree Jim

The hybrid that looks very much like Tracy’s plant.

 

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Palm Tree Jim

Dypsis psammophila.

 

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Palm Tree Jim

And Dypsis lafamazanga.

 

4BEB303D-FC77-462A-AAA2-7F0BE254015C.jpeg

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Hilo Jason

Are anyone’s Lafazamangas suckering?  Or only splitting?  Mine here has only split and no sign of suckering. Jim’s photo looked the same way. If Lafazamanga doesn’t sucker then that could rule that out. 

Thoughts?

I agree that the palms in question are not psammophila. 

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Hilo Jason
1 hour ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

How long ago Dean?

I believe there was a comment from Len within the last year or so where he said he believes these newer batches of Lafazamanga could be hybrids. Len has tried these in the past (from Jerry Andersen) and they never grew well. Then this latest batch came along which were seed from Jerry but grown and sold by Floribunda and this newest batch is turning out to be an easy and fast grower for California growers. So I believe Len thinks they could have hybridized and that’s why they are stronger growers. 

Len can correct me if I have this wrong, and if so I apologize! 

The good news is that I hope to confirm or deny this soon as my Lafazamanga from this newest batch is now seeding. If they make viable seed then I guess that will give us our answer? 

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joe_OC

Took pictures of my smallest Dypsis.  Both have emerging red fronds.

 

D lafazamanga

569AAB62-AD36-45F0-A796-502CF5413E9B.thumb.jpeg.f241fcf8ef8e4f2beaa134bad1b40718.jpeg

D arenerum 

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lzorrito
1 hour ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

The hybrid that looks very much like Tracy’s plant.

Yes, very similar indeed!:greenthumb:

Practically look a like, just the clustering to make the difference.

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Dypsisdean
5 hours ago, Palm Tree Jim said:

How long ago Dean?

FWIW - this was Jerry's last plant. I purchased it about a year ago as a medium sized 1 gal. It has been remarkably fast and is just over my head now.

lafa1.JPG

lafa2.JPG

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Palm Tree Jim
6 hours ago, Hilo Jason said:

Are anyone’s Lafazamangas suckering?  Or only splitting?  Mine here has only split and no sign of suckering. Jim’s photo looked the same way. If Lafazamanga doesn’t sucker then that could rule that out. 

Thoughts?

I agree that the palms in question are not psammophila. 

I have 2 and they both have only split Jason.

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Tracy
On 9/9/2020 at 10:21 AM, Hilo Jason said:

Are anyone’s Lafazamangas suckering?  Or only splitting?  Mine here has only split and no sign of suckering. Jim’s photo looked the same way. If Lafazamanga doesn’t sucker then that could rule that out. 

Good observation as mine is definitely suckering and not splitting.  Looks a lot like the hybrid Jim posted too.

 

On 9/9/2020 at 9:05 AM, Palm Tree Jim said:

The hybrid that looks very much like Tracy’s plant.

 

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Any idea on what the cross on yours is?  You can see that I have a pair of suckers off the original main stalk now.  I'm wondering how large these will get, if they will remain smaller trunked type clustering palms like albofarinosa and psammophila or if they will get like some of the slightly thicker trunked clustering Dypsis like pembana, lutescens and lanceolata.

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Palm Tree Jim

I will check my records and see if I can identify the cross.

Either way, ours seem to be identical.

And for the record, nice plants!

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Stevetoad

I have one that looked exactly like this when it was small. There’s a thread somewhere trying to ID it. Mine grew up to be an upright onilahensis. Lost most of its color too. :(

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Tracy
29 minutes ago, Stevetoad said:

I have one that looked exactly like this when it was small. There’s a thread somewhere trying to ID it. Mine grew up to be an upright onilahensis. Lost most of its color too. :(

So how long ago roughly Steve?  While similar looking as young, I'm guessing mine and yours are different seed batches, so if Jim's and mine are both some sort of hybrid, then its possible they are different plants than what you have.  Any old photos of yours when young?

 

On 9/9/2020 at 2:40 PM, Dypsisdean said:

FWIW - this was Jerry's last plant. I purchased it about a year ago as a medium sized 1 gal. It has been remarkably fast and is just over my head now.

lafa1.JPG

lafa2.JPG

Dean that is a beautiful plant and would be an ideal size under my Burretiokentia hapala.  The one thing that jumps out at me is that it appears the emerging spear is red.  On my plant they appear to be green with a light yellow/white stripe when pushing out before opening.  The color on my two suckers is that brownish red because they are holding the old crownshafts which have turned brown.  If mine changes over time and looks like yours, I would be happy though.

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Stevetoad
21 minutes ago, Tracy said:

So how long ago roughly?  While similar looking as young I'm guessing they are different seed batches, so if Jim's and mine are both some sort of hybrid, then its possible they are different plants.

Probably are different plants. I planted mine back in 2014 and it still only has about 2-3 rings of trunk. One of my slowest palms. Funny thing is that I have a weepy and a few other upright onilihensis and they are both way faster. So mine might be something else or just a dud. I only have this one crappy pic from when it was still colorful. I had a few guys that know dypsis better than me say it’s onilahensis so I went with that.  

86A34698-E336-475E-AA99-F0646F70278F.jpeg

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Tracy
19 minutes ago, Stevetoad said:

I planted mine back in 2014 and it still only has about 2-3 rings of trunk. One of my slowest palms.

Sounds like its solitary too, although the other one I have hasn't suckered yet, and it was the first to be planted.

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Stevetoad
9 minutes ago, Tracy said:

Sounds like its solitary too, although the other one I have hasn't suckered yet, and it was the first to be planted.

Mine was single and then suckered. Has about 5 suckers now. I wonder with all the dypsis that everyone has if there are just a ton of random hybrids now. I have another one that was from a local baronii plant and looks nothing like baronii. It’s a single furry thing. So who knows. 

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Tracy
2 minutes ago, Stevetoad said:

Mine was single and then suckered. Has about 5 suckers now. I wonder with all the dypsis that everyone has if there are just a ton of random hybrids now. I have another one that was from a local baronii plant and looks nothing like baronii. It’s a single furry thing. So who knows. 

Yes, I was just thinking about that as I have several clumping species in close proximity which were all flowering at the same time with bees flying around from one plant to another.  If I get viable seed setting, it wouldn't surprise me if some are hybrids.

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