CITES Interstate Restrictions

[ahosey01]

I am attempting to purchase some palms from a grower in Florida.  The grower's local ag inspector is telling this grower that two of the species I want to purchase cannot be purchased by an out-of-state buyer because they are on a CITES appendix, so they must be removed from the order.  I don't want to give any specifics on grower, species, location, etc.

I have only ever heard of CITES restrictions applying to imported plant material.  I can confirm that both plants are on the CITES list but were seed-grown in Florida nurseries from seed off Florida plants.

Has anyone else ever heard of this before?

[Merlyn]

@ahosey01 I've never heard of CITES being an issue for interstate shipments either.  The exception may be CITES 1 plants, which it appears requires a permit?  

https://www.fws.gov/service/3-200-36-exportre-exportimportinterstate-and-foreign-commerce-plants-under-cites

 

[ahosey01]

2 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

@ahosey01 I've never heard of CITES being an issue for interstate shipments either.  The exception may be CITES 1 plants, which it appears requires a permit?  

https://www.fws.gov/service/3-200-36-exportre-exportimportinterstate-and-foreign-commerce-plants-under-cites

 

I found this doc too, but I still think it only applies to international transactions because the import docs are specifically called out in the list of required things:

 

[Merlyn]

@ahosey01 that's what I thought too, but the language specifically says:

"Generally, a permit is needed if you seek to conduct import, export, take, or conduct interstate or international commercial activities and your species of interest is protected under domestic or international law but can also be legally traded. "

https://fwsepermits.servicenowservices.com/fws?id=fws_kb_article&sys_id=400f70b71b5b58101f45dbdbe54bcb1a

In step 3 of the page it calls out personal exemptions for CITES II and III, but these specifically link to international travel...like if you were moving to Spain and taking CITES II plants with you.

The permit request form is FWS Form 3-200-36 (Rev. 02/2023), available on the right column of this page:

https://fwsepermits.servicenowservices.com/fws?id=fws_kb_view&sys_id=2edb7f161bbe50104fa520eae54bcb26

In there the questions on page 7 one check is for "Interstate commerce."  So if the ESA applies to the species (I presume it does since it's under CITES I, II, or III) then the seller needs a permit for plants coming from cultivated stock.

[Tracy]

Adam, I took a look at the Service's page link you posted and they do seem to address interstate sales:

Interstate Commerce permits authorize the sale of endangered and threatened species across State lines, but only for activities determined to be consistent with the purposes of the ESA. Interstate commerce activities with plants require, prior to the sale, that the seller obtain a permit for plants coming from cultivated stock and that the buyer obtain a permit for plants taken from the wild. 

The confusing part to me, is that they are referencing the ESA for the endangered or threatened species.  ESA = Endangered Species Act.  As far as I know the USF&WS only puts species native to the US (maybe US Territories too) get listed.  So I don't know how you could get a consistency listing for something which isn't listed as an Endangered Species.  Said differently, if the species you are interested in acquiring aren't domestic palms, while on the CITES list, they are on the Service's Endangered Species list.

It also appears from that paragraph that the burden for obtaining the permit for plants coming from cultivated stock is on the seller, not you the buyer.  Maybe they don't want to go through the headache of the paperwork. 

[peachy]

We have that carry on here. Nothing is allowed to be sent to the West or Tasmania from the Eastern states.  My state of Queensland has bans on so many things coming in but luckily palms are not affected. (but don't try to get an ornamental banana or Koi in here) I realise some things need to be kept out but many of the restrictions are ridiculous.

Peachy

[happypalms]

5 minutes ago, peachy said:

We have that carry on here. Nothing is allowed to be sent to the West or Tasmania from the Eastern states.  My state of Queensland has bans on so many things coming in but luckily palms are not affected. (but don't try to get an ornamental banana or Koi in here) I realise some things need to be kept out but many of the restrictions are ridiculous.

Peachy

You forgot rabbits to peachy, even pet rabbits are not permitted across the border, good old Joh must have introduced that law!

Richard

[Tracy]

14 hours ago, Tracy said:

Adam, I took a look at the Service's page link you posted and they do seem to address interstate sales:

Interstate Commerce permits authorize the sale of endangered and threatened species across State lines, but only for activities determined to be consistent with the purposes of the ESA. Interstate commerce activities with plants require, prior to the sale, that the seller obtain a permit for plants coming from cultivated stock and that the buyer obtain a permit for plants taken from the wild. 

The confusing part to me, is that they are referencing the ESA for the endangered or threatened species.  ESA = Endangered Species Act.  As far as I know the USF&WS only puts species native to the US (maybe US Territories too) get listed.  So I don't know how you could get a consistency listing for something which isn't listed as an Endangered Species.  Said differently, if the species you are interested in acquiring aren't domestic palms, while on the CITES list, they are on the Service's Endangered Species list.

It also appears from that paragraph that the burden for obtaining the permit for plants coming from cultivated stock is on the seller, not you the buyer.  Maybe they don't want to go through the headache of the paperwork. 

I failed to read the section above the one that I cited from the USF&WS webpage for the permits:

This application covers plant species listed in Appendix I of the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES) and/or any plant species listed under the U.S. Endangered Species Act (ESA), whether live or dead and including any readily recognizable parts, products, or derivatives unless otherwise noted in the Appendices.  

I note in bold the pertinent information.  So in the US, this covers only Appendix 1 CITES or US ESA listed plants.  If the plant is Appendix II or III, and not on the US ESA, it does not seem that a permit is required for interstate shipments.  Adam, you may want to review this language for the permit and discuss with your vendor.