What is your palm tree hot take?

[sonoranfans]

I love palms with thick trunks and jubaea is one of  the most magnificent of these.  But I am certainly not going to be limited by thick trunks.  I love the colorful crownshafts and various leaf shapes of palms.  Not a big fan of thorny palms, so my only phoenix is a rupicola triple on which I trimmed the hurricane damage off today.  Not one stab removing 30-35 dead leaves, that is my kind of palm.  Another thing about palms I don't like is very unhealthy but "alive" palms that look bad because they are stressed.   I don't blame it on the palm but the grower.  I believe in growing what the climate supports, so the plant can be happy and healthy.   If I could grow a jubaea well I would, but it would just be torturing it here in Florida.  

[miamicuse]

That's what I mean by "pineapple cut varnished sylvester palms".

Is an "interesting" look but not for me.

[tim_brissy_13]

Another hot take:

Washingtonia robusta is a very attractive plant. 
 

Imagine you’d never seen one before. Large, full, bright green fronds. Orange leaf bases. Some of the more common palms are common because they are popular, and for good reason. 

[aabell]

8 minutes ago, tim_brissy_13 said:

Another hot take:

Washingtonia robusta is a very attractive plant. 
 

Imagine you’d never seen one before. Large, full, bright green fronds. Orange leaf bases. Some of the more common palms are common because they are popular, and for good reason. 

I agree with this one. Washingtonia are the prettiest of the 'planted so often in so many places that people hate' them crew. 

As a Floridian I generally dislike Phoenix, without many exceptions. As desert palms they just look out of place here next to the Sabals, Royals, and coconuts. Even the more tropical species like roebelinii and reclinata aren't nearly as nice as other pinnate palms, to me. Maybe I'm biased because I don't like the spines. Huge old CIDP in the right climate are awesome, but you don't see many great examples here. 

Jubaea are stunning in my opinion. 

[Harry’s Palms]

We have so many Washingtonia in Southern California that they have naturalized. Some believe they are native. I have had many just pop up in my yard as volunteers. Its abundance makes it unattractive to many but I like them. I was given a volunteer that was on a neighbors hill so I planted it . It is now very tall , I have it trimmed once a year . Harry

Clearly out pacing any other palms in my collection.

[PindoPalm]

On 2/26/2025 at 3:40 PM, Slifer00 said:

Should I delete it?

No i like to hear some other peoples opinions 

[Arecaceus]

23 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

Putting fertilizer in planting holes…. Long acting high quality stuff.   I do it for every palm and plant.   Noticed many top growers of rare stuff do it also.   Never had a problem except explosive initial growth.

Also, I hate coconuts.  

I have done this before. Usually when I don't mix in a lot of new soil.

[sonoranfans]

I don't like trimming of mature palms, the taller they get the worse it is.  Self shedding palms become much appreciated as they grow tall.  

[FlaPalmLover]

As far as plants go, palms are really fairly useless, on average, and most of their appeal comes from their aesthetic appeal and uniqueness. 

[aabell]

12 hours ago, FlaPalmLover said:

As far as plants go, palms are really fairly useless, on average, and most of their appeal comes from their aesthetic appeal and uniqueness. 

I think "usefulness to humans" is an incredibly poor standard to judge any plant by.

[sonoranfans]

4 hours ago, aabell said:

I think "usefulness to humans" is an incredibly poor standard to judge any plant by.

Humans have very varied interpretations of "usefulness".  Some make dwellings or hats for sun protection, some eat the fruit.  I can say that palms are apparently much more useful preventing hurricane damage to your house than dicots.  Oaks, elms, eucalyptus all were felled by hurricane Milton last fall.  Some fell on houses, some became a mess to haul away.  My 8 closest neighbors had obvious roof damage including leaks, needing new roofing jobs.  My house had minimal damage to 10 feet of the cap.  My place has ~60 mature palms instead of dicots.  The tallest palms took a whooping for sure, but are already pushing out new leaves.    Perhaps you should ask carribean islanders how useful palms are?  After a big hurricane comes through the palms often still standing ready to refresh the crowns while the dicots are often dead and gone.  Dicots are messy when they seasonally drop leaves and twigs, many palms are relatively clean, especially the self shedding ones.   

[FlaPalmLover]

10 hours ago, aabell said:

I think "usefulness to humans" is an incredibly poor standard to judge any plant by.

When did I say anything about being useful to humans? I’m well aware of the benefits mentioned by Sonoranfans (which are really centered around usefulness to humans too) and will probably never buy another house with large trees that shed leaves because they’re a pain and a concern with hurricanes but as far as providing shade and/or helping the environment palms are fairly useless. Some have fruit with certain useful properties, sure. They consume an inordinate amount of water for the amount of space that they occupy. Once they mature that aspect is less of an issue, though, I’m sure, or when they’re in tropical, rain-heavy environments in which they’re surrounded by canopy or water. Many are fairly drought tolerant such as sabals, which need no supplemental water at all, or otherwise are native to an area and its climate. However I see some people on here irrigating their palms with what I’d consider to be an exorbitant amount of water even as there are well-known groundwater shortages all across the world. Without that irrigation those same palms wouldn’t make it, would grow much slower, or would look far worse.

[Banana Belt]

On 2/28/2025 at 3:43 PM, sonoranfans said:

I love palms with thick trunks and jubaea is one of  the most magnificent of these.  But I am certainly not going to be limited by thick trunks.  I love the colorful crownshafts and various leaf shapes of palms.  Not a big fan of thorny palms, so my only phoenix is a rupicola triple on which I trimmed the hurricane damage off today.  Not one stab removing 30-35 dead leaves, that is my kind of palm.  Another thing about palms I don't like is very unhealthy but "alive" palms that look bad because they are stressed.   I don't blame it on the palm but the grower.  I believe in growing what the climate supports, so the plant can be happy and healthy.   If I could grow a jubaea well I would, but it would just be torturing it here in Florida.  

I like your thinking, well said.  When a palm is growing well I like it, trying to grow something in a climate it does not like is both frustrating and sad but consider all the plants people have grown and improved over the many thousands of years, adapting, cross breeding, selecting and working to improve a plant.  Successes and failures, it takes its toll and is time consuming.  Every so often a success is achieved and a new variety or plant emerges, so my hot take is Hat's Off to any Palm grower who is working to cross breed, and work with palms to come up with something wonderful.  Who knows, some day someone in the future will not only be able to grow beautiful Jubaea in South Florida but Antarctica as well, nothing is really impossible just harder to do.

 

 

 

 

 

[Rivera]

On 3/1/2025 at 6:26 AM, Harry’s Palms said:

We have so many Washingtonia in Southern California that they have naturalized. Some believe they are native. I have had many just pop up in my yard as volunteers. Its abundance makes it unattractive to many but I like them. I was given a volunteer that was on a neighbors hill so I planted it . It is now very tall , I have it trimmed once a year . Harry

Clearly out pacing any other palms in my collection.

They've been naturalized in northern California for a long time as well, and there are dense stands in some locations. However, I've never seen a Washingtonia bear an infructescence in my cool seaside neighborhood in San Francisco even though they reproduce easily and prolifically in every surrounding county. A modicum of seasonal heat seems to be the missing bit. 

[Matthew92]

Hot take: Phoenix dactylifera shouldn't be planted on a mass scale in FL.

[Matthew92]

16 hours ago, Matthew92 said:

Hot take: Phoenix dactylifera shouldn't be planted on a mass scale in FL.

To clarify: I am ok with them being used a little more in N. FL because there aren't really any other palms that size that make such a landscape impact that are as cold hardy (yes P. canariensis is just as bud hardy or more so but it's leaves will brown before P. dactylifera). And at least from my observations: further south in FL they are more likely to look ratty/the humidity seems to take its toll more (although I know there are still many that do look good): which leads to the root issue of them being a desert native palm and is out of place/not climatically suited for best appearance in much of FL. I mean even in North FL, I still think they should be used more sparingly.

[troposphere]

hot take:  Syagrus romanzoffiana rarely look good in garden or urban environments, especially in mediterranean climates.  They are adaptable and widely used around the world but that's because they refuse to die and somehow no one cares that they look trashy unless in perfect conditions..  Naturally occurring Queen palms in their native range are absolutely stunning.   

[PhoenixFXG]

1. Crownshaft palms all look the same! When I see people plant small crownshaft palms. I think, you could’ve planted the same palm and I wouldn’t know.

2. jungle planting makes the most unique palms look insignificant. I like a specific area for one palm and maybe non palms plants to accentuate that specific palm. Honestly it looks like you have an addiction lol of course privacy screen could be the main goal

3. solidarity palms planted as doubles, triples etc are not beautiful enough on its own so you have to add it with others to make it palpable.

4. Phoenix palms don’t have an issue with humidity or rain. The issue with Florida is that we have almost no potassium, manganese or magnesium in the soils and people usually don’t fertilize correctly.

sorry if I hurt your feelings 😂

[tim_brissy_13]

38 minutes ago, PhoenixFXG said:

1. Crownshaft palms all look the same! When I see people plant small crownshaft palms. I think, you could’ve planted the same palm and I wouldn’t know.

2. jungle planting makes the most unique palms look insignificant. I like a specific area for one palm and maybe non palms plants to accentuate that specific palm. Honestly it looks like you have an addiction lol of course privacy screen could be the main goal

3. solidarity palms planted as doubles, triples etc are not beautiful enough on its own so you have to add it with others to make it palpable.

4. Phoenix palms don’t have an issue with humidity or rain. The issue with Florida is that we have almost no potassium, manganese or magnesium in the soils and people usually don’t fertilize correctly.

sorry if I hurt your feelings 😂

No feelings hurt, but couldn’t disagree more with points 1-3. Personally I think the real beauty of palm growing is that we’re all different and have different preferences for how to plant and which species to plant which just adds to the wide variety of gardens we see on here and elsewhere. I like the jungle look but also appreciate a single planted focal point for some species. 
 

As for crownshafted palms, you can’t convince me a Pinanga looks like Hedyscepe which looks like Chamaedorea ernesti-augustii etc etc even from the first frond. 

[sonoranfans]

10 hours ago, PhoenixFXG said:

1. Crownshaft palms all look the same! When I see people plant small crownshaft palms. I think, you could’ve planted the same palm and I wouldn’t know.

2. jungle planting makes the most unique palms look insignificant. I like a specific area for one palm and maybe non palms plants to accentuate that specific palm. Honestly it looks like you have an addiction lol of course privacy screen could be the main goal

3. solidarity palms planted as doubles, triples etc are not beautiful enough on its own so you have to add it with others to make it palpable.

4. Phoenix palms don’t have an issue with humidity or rain. The issue with Florida is that we have almost no potassium, manganese or magnesium in the soils and people usually don’t fertilize correctly.

sorry if I hurt your feelings 😂

1) I agree that in your area the crownshafted species you can grow, (probably 5% of the crownshafted species) are very limited so they may all look the same.

2) I prefer insignificance to the cookie cutter landscape then, very boring to me.

3) doubles and triples are useful for p[alms with smaller crowns to increase shade and they stand up better together in wind, which is handy in florida.

4) Phoenix dactylifera are desert palms they always look better in the desert because theya re adapted to it..  WIth adequate water they glow in the desert in a way they never do in florida.   I lived in arizona for 10 years, they grow MUCH better phoenix  dactylifera palms there with excellent quality dates as well. Many palms get potassium deficiency in florida due to our high drainage soils and rainfall, its the most common deficiency by a big margin.  OF all my palms phoenix are only about midpack in their demands for potassium.  Try a cuban copernicia to see a palm that is needy of potassium.  

 

 

 

 

[SeanK]

A couple of observations after 25 years with palms 

1. Some people have a landscape-only interest, while others are more collectors, looking for rare or hard-to-grow.

2. The more palms a person has, the more his/her general landscape suffers. It seems collectors just dig holes and drop a palm in. No regard for accent plants or lawn care.

[happypalms]

Iam Irish descendant and when I think of Ireland, I think of leprechauns, four leaf clovers, Jerry Adam’s and my lovely dear old great great great grandmother, but never have I heard or thought of Hot take! How do you confuse an Irishman put him in a round room with a shovel in the corner and tell him to take his pick! 

[Harry’s Palms]

@SeanK I took out my lawn about a year or less after moving into our new home . I had too many palms to get the mower around! They came from our old house. Shortly after replacing the sod with smooth beach pebbles ,river rock borders , and putting a walkway in , my neighbor took his lawn out and put gravel down with rock borders , then put palms in . I gave him a triple Howea Foresteriana that he always had his eye on . It was in a pot and got too big for my porch. I went over , knocked on his door with the palms and asked him where he would like them planted . He wanted them on his side of our border between our houses and was so stoked that he went to a Kentia farm and bought three more! He now has Dypsis Lutescens , Ravenea Rivularis , Syagrus Romanzoffiana, and a few Phoenix Roebelini. As well as Chamaedorea Radicalis TF in pots that I gave him. 
          I think a collection can be presented in a way that is very attractive. Landscape doesn’t have to “suffer” from a collectors desire to grow many varieties . I have seen collections that are full of palms that look awesome and I really like my own. Harry

[Harry’s Palms]

My “ Hot Take” on palms and collecting . I took out all the sod in the front , back , and side yards soon after buying our home . I gave the plants that were put in by the developers to neighbors that wanted them . I then dug holes everywhere to put in palms that I had in pots from our old house. That was about 28 years ago , 7 years after I started collecting palms . I put in bunches of smooth beach pebbles and the rocks are from the yard and the hill when I was digging , I used them for borders. Harry

‘This was sod with one Myrtle tree . Now a sidewalk to the court yard with a steel gate.

I formed borders and then put bark down . My wife added sea shells . The Dioon got much larger than I anticipated . Regrets? Heck no!

Potted Geraniums and Lilly of the Nile. The bark and top soil are refreshed regularly . This is earlier last year before winter.

‘More potted Geraniums , bark and beach pebbles with rock borders.This was just sod that was constantly wet or brown. I kept it green and well maintained until I had time to install some more palms and then used a ground cover to border my walk way 

‘Then there is the hill , or slope , that is still a work in progress . This is the view side of the property , a partial view of my 1/4 acre . I only have 15 or so palms down there . Carefully choosing palms that can handle full southern exposure . Eventually there will be a pathway around the palms with stone steps to help me navigate the hill. This is the most challenging to landscape. Harry

[SeanK]

1 hour ago, Harry’s Palms said:

@SeanK I took out my lawn about a year or less after moving into our new home . I had too many palms to get the mower around! They came from our old house. Shortly after replacing the sod with smooth beach pebbles ,river rock borders , and putting a walkway in , my neighbor took his lawn out and put gravel down with rock borders , then put palms in . I gave him a triple Howea Foresteriana that he always had his eye on . It was in a pot and got too big for my porch. I went over , knocked on his door with the palms and asked him where he would like them planted . He wanted them on his side of our border between our houses and was so stoked that he went to a Kentia farm and bought three more! He now has Dypsis Lutescens , Ravenea Rivularis , Syagrus Romanzoffiana, and a few Phoenix Roebelini. As well as Chamaedorea Radicalis TF in pots that I gave him. 
          I think a collection can be presented in a way that is very attractive. Landscape doesn’t have to “suffer” from a collectors desire to grow many varieties . I have seen collections that are full of palms that look awesome and I really like my own. Harry

I can see that in arid areas, lawns consume a disproportionate amount of potable water. One needs a grey water collection system.

[Harry’s Palms]

I don’t think lawns are any worse than palms as far as water consumption. I just didn’t find the sod attractive . I prefer pebbles and other hardscaping instead. Harry

[TropicsEnjoyer]

On 5/27/2025 at 11:53 PM, PhoenixFXG said:

4. Phoenix palms don’t have an issue with humidity or rain. The issue with Florida is that we have almost no potassium, manganese or magnesium in the soils and people usually don’t fertilize correctly.

 

Lack of fertilization is a plague for many florida palms 😂. It’s a shame people will pour hundreds on making their lawn look immaculate but can’t bother buying a 15$ bag of palm fertilizer for their one or two ratty looking palms.

[sonoranfans]

22 hours ago, Harry’s Palms said:

I don’t think lawns are any worse than palms as far as water consumption. I just didn’t find the sod attractive . I prefer pebbles and other hardscaping instead. Harry

Naaah, grass is worse.  The lawns turn brown long before the palms when the irrigation system breaks.  Sabal palmettos in the landscape do far better than bermuda grass in a drought like this past spring.  Some palms are actually very drought resistant, grass is not.  IF you look at the surface area from which transpiration evolves, the grass has far more area exposed to sun for water losses.  

[Harry’s Palms]

My lawn wasn’t large enough to take that much water . I use a lot of water on my palms now that they are mature. We don’t get that much rain here especially this last year . Usually 2/3 of the year is without measurable rainfall. Harry

[amh]

I do not care for Bismarckia nobilis. I always thought the species looked great in pictures, but when I saw it in real life, I was very underwhelmed.

[PhoenixFXG]

1 hour ago, amh said:

I do not care for Bismarckia nobilis. I always thought the species looked great in pictures, but when I saw it in real life, I was very underwhelmed.

Agree. copernicia fallaensis is everything Bismarck palm wanted to be. Bismarcks are awkward looking.

 

in fact I planted a fallaensis even though I knew it would take 2-3 times longer to get to the same size as Bismarck 

[Atlanta Area Palm Guy]

1 hour ago, amh said:

I do not care for Bismarckia nobilis. I always thought the species looked great in pictures, but when I saw it in real life, I was very underwhelmed.

I find this to be the case for Pindo Palms as well.  Though, I do have a couple here just for the heck of it. 

I didn't notice any Bismarckias when I was in Central Florida.  You'd think you'd see them in good microclimate areas there, but I didn't notice any.  I'm sure some people have them going good there though.

[amh]

20 minutes ago, PhoenixFXG said:

Agree. copernicia fallaensis is everything Bismarck palm wanted to be. Bismarcks are awkward looking.

 

in fact I planted a fallaensis even though I knew it would take 2-3 times longer to get to the same size as Bismarck 

I really like the copernica genus and Copernicia fallaensis is an amazing palm, unfortunately I am just too cold to grow any of these palms.

Bismarckia might just need mass, I think a really fat trunk may improve its appearance.

[amh]

7 minutes ago, Atlanta Area Palm Guy said:

I find this to be the case for Pindo Palms as well.  Though, I do have a couple here just for the heck of it. 

I didn't notice any Bismarckias when I was in Central Florida.  You'd think you'd see them in good microclimate areas there, but I didn't notice any.  I'm sure some people have them going good there though.

I really like the butias, in fact I'm attempting to germinate hundreds of them right now. To me, pindo palms look great in forested, jungle type or mass plantings, but I think that they can leave something to be desired as a singular specimen plant or urban palm, the environment really make a difference.

The only Bismarkia that I have seen were in Port Aransas off of North Station Street and Turtle Cove. There is a mass planting of various palms to block the view of the riff-raff.

[Atlanta Area Palm Guy]

34 minutes ago, amh said:

I really like the butias, in fact I'm attempting to germinate hundreds of them right now. To me, pindo palms look great in forested, jungle type or mass plantings, but I think that they can leave something to be desired as a singular specimen plant or urban palm, the environment really make a difference.

The only Bismarkia that I have seen were in Port Aransas off of North Station Street and Turtle Cove. There is a mass planting of various palms to block the view of the riff-raff.

Oh, I see.  I think you may be right about Pindos.

[amh]

11 minutes ago, Atlanta Area Palm Guy said:

Oh, I see.  I think you may be right about Pindos.

Of course I'm right.

Our preferences are subjective, I prefer forest, so I gravitate towards palms that I think will look good as part of a forest. Other people like grasslands or desert, so they plant accordingly. There are rarely wrong answers here. 

[Atlanta Area Palm Guy]

46 minutes ago, amh said:

Of course I'm right.

Our preferences are subjective, I prefer forest, so I gravitate towards palms that I think will look good as part of a forest. Other people like grasslands or desert, so they plant accordingly. There are rarely wrong answers here. 

Yeah, I can see those Pindos doing well in a forested setting.  They might need critter protection if they are on the small side.  It would depend on what the local wildlife prefer for food, of course.

[amh]

11 minutes ago, Atlanta Area Palm Guy said:

Yeah, I can see those Pindos doing well in a forested setting.  They might need critter protection if they are on the small side.  It would depend on what the local wildlife prefer for food, of course.

Deer are the main baddies, they do not eat the palms, but they like to rub their antlers against them.

[rizla023]

Not a popular opinion, but I am also in the camp where less is more, especially when collecting. I feel there are so many yards with a ton of super cool species but you can barely make it through the overcrowded mess. Maybe it’s just OCD and the type A gardener lol

[Silas_Sancona]

* Cool w/ a little chaos, but not a fan of the overcrowded " is there a house / bodies / shady dealings  -pun intended-  hidden back there, ..somewhere.. "  look either  ...Unless you have some space to stretch out a bit..  Still,  Wouldn't want all the maintenance and  ..plants need some room, even palms..  Tiny lot " stuffed to the edges " just doesn't look right.. 

* Not a fan of the super duper manicured / arranged like soldiers / clipped into snazzy shapes by a madman look either. ..to any garden. 

...But, either is a personal choice.. Have at it, if you choose  ..Just don't ask me to think / get all huffy puffy when i don't think  it's the wonder-fullest, greatest garden on earth too, even if you get a thumbs up for the neater things in there sometimes.. 



* Thinking constant dumping of  fertilizer  on something   solves everything.. 

* ...Same with pest-y insect control..  You'll kill yourself well before winning ANY battle with bugs.. 





* Phoenix / Tucson ..region in general: -Ditch -The -Queens / Go full tilt purge on any nursery selling them.. Plant Mules instead.  They start croaking?  ditch 'em too.   

* ..take full advantage of the awesome, near native palm options we have.  ..Besides  just  Washingtonia. - galore.


* San Jose / ..Areas around the Bay Area w/ similar conditions,  Slow the roll w/ Queens, ..i mean, we have tons,  all over the place..  Plant more  ( ...A lot more... ) Majesties.. 

* Close to the coast?  ( ..Ahem,  Santa Cruz ), More Kentia, Please.  ...You can do it ..I know ya' can.. 



** Most  important of all:  Never really concerned myself w/ the popularity / unpopularity, like /  dislike ...or complaints of..  regarding my differing / Spear point focused forward thinking / musings,  Regarding  -anything...   😊