Better to leave snow on fronds or brush off???

[Zone7Bpalmguy]

I'm pretty confident that a good snow is on its way. Temps won't be a problem for the windmills, lows only in the mid teens or so but I wonder about the weight of the snow and the fronds. Forecast is about 5-8" possibly.  Snow is an insulator but will a heavy wet snow bend or break the fronds? Would I be better off in sacrificing the insulation value to keep better looking fronds? 

A few years ago we got a decent bit of ice but I kept knocking the ice off. In the long run I think I beat up some of the fronds, trying to keep it off. Thoughts anyone? Thanks.

[Allen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHONya_q1lo

 

[jwitt]

Brush/knock it off.

Your palm leaves will stay colder, longer with the snow on them. It takes 144 Btu's (heat) to change 1 pound of 32f snow into 1 pound of 32f water.  That is the same energy needed to warm 1 pound of water from 32f to 176f.  

I would rather that energy(sun/air)going to the palm leaf, not melting the snow. 

That snow as it is in a "solid" state, can get super cold on a radiatonal night. That leaf will not warm above 32f until that snow changes state into a liquid.  

If you are dealing with a ground level palm buried in snow on a zero night, yes the snow will probably "insulate" from the colder air due to the warmer ground. 

Short story, a palm leaf will warm faster without snow as opposed to with snow. 

 

I knocked the snow off shortly after the morning picture.  

11/7/24

11/16/24

[Las Palmas Norte]

It's the heavy wet snow that can be damaging.

[SeanK]

13 minutes ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

It's the heavy wet snow that can be damaging.

I expect that here. Snow, then a mix. Then refreezing overnight.

[Zone7Bpalmguy]

Sounds like a game plan. I appreciate all the responses. Thanks everyone!

[Las Palmas Norte]

1 hour ago, SeanK said:

I expect that here. Snow, then a mix. Then refreezing overnight.

Nasty. Hopefully that mess clears quickly. 

[ZPalms]

5 hours ago, jwitt said:

Brush/knock it off.

Your palm leaves will stay colder, longer with the snow on them. It takes 144 Btu's (heat) to change 1 pound of 32f snow into 1 pound of 32f water.  That is the same energy needed to warm 1 pound of water from 32f to 176f.  

I would rather that energy(sun/air)going to the palm leaf, not melting the snow. 

That snow as it is in a "solid" state, can get super cold on a radiatonal night. That leaf will not warm above 32f until that snow changes state into a liquid.  

If you are dealing with a ground level palm buried in snow on a zero night, yes the snow will probably "insulate" from the colder air due to the warmer ground. 

Short story, a palm leaf will warm faster without snow as opposed to with snow. 

 

I knocked the snow off shortly after the morning picture.  

11/7/24

11/16/24

Unrelated to the topic but your filifera and trachy look nice and full 🤠

[jwitt]

10 hours ago, ZPalms said:

Unrelated to the topic but your filifera and trachy look nice and full 🤠

Thanks!

It may not have been had I not have knocked the snow off.  In the back/right of the picture is a forty foot(ash) tree that lost some limbs from the snow.  Looks twenty foot high with the snow weighing it down. 

[palmofmyhand]

On 1/8/2025 at 7:36 PM, jwitt said:

Brush/knock it off.

Your palm leaves will stay colder, longer with the snow on them. It takes 144 Btu's (heat) to change 1 pound of 32f snow into 1 pound of 32f water.  That is the same energy needed to warm 1 pound of water from 32f to 176f.  

I would rather that energy(sun/air)going to the palm leaf, not melting the snow. 

That snow as it is in a "solid" state, can get super cold on a radiatonal night. That leaf will not warm above 32f until that snow changes state into a liquid.  

If you are dealing with a ground level palm buried in snow on a zero night, yes the snow will probably "insulate" from the colder air due to the warmer ground. 

Short story, a palm leaf will warm faster without snow as opposed to with snow. 

 

I knocked the snow off shortly after the morning picture.  

11/7/24

11/16/24

hey if you don’t mind me asking, what palm is that on the left in your picture?

[jwitt]

Filifera 

[palmofmyhand]

6 minutes ago, jwitt said:

Filifera 

your filifera is doing well in a zone 7b?

[jwitt]

3 hours ago, palmofmyhand said:

your filifera is doing well in a zone 7b?

From seed at 5270 feet in elevation.

[Las Palmas Norte]

On 1/8/2025 at 5:05 PM, SeanK said:

I expect that here. Snow, then a mix. Then refreezing overnight.

Did you knock off the snow load?

[SeanK]

25 minutes ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

Did you knock off the snow load?

Nope. Too tall. We lucked out. Nighttime lows were forecast for 27° but we only got down to 32°>

[palmofmyhand]

21 hours ago, jwitt said:

From seed at 5270 feet in elevation.

do you happen to know a good place where I could buy a filifera potted or seed?

[jwitt]

2 hours ago, palmofmyhand said:

do you happen to know a good place where I could buy a filifera potted or seed?

Sorry, no.