Jacksonville tropicals

[trippc]

Hey, palm enthusiasts! I wanted to share some information about the tropical palms I’ve planted on my property here in Jacksonville, FL (Orange Park, to be exact). The heights of the palms are approximate, but here’s what I’ve planted:   

•  12' Foxtail  
•  12' Royal  
•  5' Dual Adonidia  
•  5' Triple Adonidia  
•  Two 4' Dwarf Malaysian coconuts  
•  5' Queen  
•  9' Queen  

They’ve all been in the ground for at least a few months—some for about six months. All the palms experienced great growth over the summer, although the foxtail’s growth was leaps ahead of the others. At peak summer, I swear the foxtail would open a new frond within a few weeks. Needless to say, they are thriving!  

Now, I’m sure some people are cringing at the fact that I have palms rated for Zone 10b–11 in a Zone 9b area, but I do have an explanation. First, I’d like to say I’m a huge fan of the tropical landscape. Even with a brick house, my wife and I decided to go full tropical when we bought the house this past April.  

Although we live in North Florida, Zone 9b, which is unfortunately more subtropical, I noticed something interesting. My father-in-law has a dual Adonidia in a pot by his pool. The pot sits on pavers beside the pool. This Adonidia has been there for over four years, never covered, and it survives the occasional freezing nights we experience. While it does defoliate, it always makes a comeback in the spring.  

Seeing this made me wonder why this tropical palm was surviving these freezing temperatures. Then it hit me: the pavers absorb heat during the day and release it at night when the sun is no longer out. The pavers are light-colored, which means, in theory, darker pavers or bricks should retain and release even more heat, right?  

This brings me to my wife, who decided she wanted a brick house in Orange Park, not far from the in-laws (about 5 miles or so). This worked out perfectly for my plan! One cool night, when it was in the mid-60s, I noticed a noticeable heat wave as I walked from my backyard toward the brick wall of the house. I realized this might be the same kind of heat radiating from the pavers at my in-laws’ place, which keeps their Adonidia alive.  

So, I started planting: first the foxtail, then the coconuts, followed by the royal. Before I knew it, my property was brimming with tropical palms and plants. I planted the more sensitive trees closer to the house so they could benefit from the brick’s radiated heat during cold nights. The queens, being a bit hardier, were planted further back near the fence, where there’s no radiating heat to assist them.  

Once I saw everything thriving, I decided to back my theory with data. I purchased weather sensors from Amazon and immediately noticed a few degrees of difference in temperature near the brick. Once the temps started to drop, I began monitoring the temperatures and started saving the data in a spreadsheet. Linked below.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OhEzHmzhZxIAaz99XZHH_zpdEXuwjV1CW5VJoppOxhc/edit?usp=sharing

Sensor 1 was placed on the small Queen palm (as seen in the photos), located far from my house and within 10 feet of the fence.

Sensor 2 was placed on the Royal palm (as seen in the photos), located about 6 feet from the house.

Sensor 3 was placed on the Foxtail palm (as seen in the photos), also located about 6 feet from the house.

Since placement, I have not moved the sensors.

So far, you can see a trend: the brick does indeed keep the palms warmer! Awesome, so problem solved, right? Not exactly. This chart will continue to be updated, and as you can see, we are currently experiencing a significant cold snap. Just last night, the sensor on the small Queen palm recorded temperatures below freezing, while the Foxtail and Royal palm sensors recorded just a few degrees above freezing.

This prompted me to wrap the coconuts since they are much smaller and further from the heat-radiating brick. I also plan to wrap the Foxtail and Royal palms if their sensor readings drop below freezing for more than an hour. I’m hopeful that the size of the Foxtail and Royal palms will help them withstand these cold nights.

The Adonidia palms are on their own without frost cloth, as they are closest to the house, with the dual Adonidia actually being enclosed by bushes and the house itself.

As we battle this cold snap, I just wanted to share the experiment I have going on here in North Florida. To my knowledge, I don’t know anyone who has successfully grown coconuts or Foxtails in this area. However, I’m hopeful I can change that!

Attached, you will find fairly recent photos of the palms. As you can see, the coconuts are currently wrapped until nighttime temperatures rise above 40°F. The Foxtail and Royal palms both have Christmas lights on them—not for heating purposes but simply because it’s the holiday season, and my wife asked me to put them up.

I plan to keep updating the spreadsheet over the next few months and share updates on the forum regarding any defoliation or damage. So far, none of the trees have shown any noticeable burns or damage.

P.S. I’m by no means an expert. I’m really new to palms in general and have only scratched the surface of knowledge about these trees. If you have any advice, insights, or questions, please feel free to comment. Thanks!

[MarcusH]

On 11/22/2024 at 11:07 AM, trippc said:

Hey, palm enthusiasts! I wanted to share some information about the tropical palms I’ve planted on my property here in Jacksonville, FL (Orange Park, to be exact). The heights of the palms are approximate, but here’s what I’ve planted:   

•  12' Foxtail  
•  12' Royal  
•  5' Dual Adonidia  
•  5' Triple Adonidia  
•  Two 4' Dwarf Malaysian coconuts  
•  5' Queen  
•  9' Queen  

They’ve all been in the ground for at least a few months—some for about six months. All the palms experienced great growth over the summer, although the foxtail’s growth was leaps ahead of the others. At peak summer, I swear the foxtail would open a new frond within a few weeks. Needless to say, they are thriving!  

Now, I’m sure some people are cringing at the fact that I have palms rated for Zone 10b–11 in a Zone 9b area, but I do have an explanation. First, I’d like to say I’m a huge fan of the tropical landscape. Even with a brick house, my wife and I decided to go full tropical when we bought the house this past April.  

Although we live in North Florida, Zone 9b, which is unfortunately more subtropical, I noticed something interesting. My father-in-law has a dual Adonidia in a pot by his pool. The pot sits on pavers beside the pool. This Adonidia has been there for over four years, never covered, and it survives the occasional freezing nights we experience. While it does defoliate, it always makes a comeback in the spring.  

Seeing this made me wonder why this tropical palm was surviving these freezing temperatures. Then it hit me: the pavers absorb heat during the day and release it at night when the sun is no longer out. The pavers are light-colored, which means, in theory, darker pavers or bricks should retain and release even more heat, right?  

This brings me to my wife, who decided she wanted a brick house in Orange Park, not far from the in-laws (about 5 miles or so). This worked out perfectly for my plan! One cool night, when it was in the mid-60s, I noticed a noticeable heat wave as I walked from my backyard toward the brick wall of the house. I realized this might be the same kind of heat radiating from the pavers at my in-laws’ place, which keeps their Adonidia alive.  

So, I started planting: first the foxtail, then the coconuts, followed by the royal. Before I knew it, my property was brimming with tropical palms and plants. I planted the more sensitive trees closer to the house so they could benefit from the brick’s radiated heat during cold nights. The queens, being a bit hardier, were planted further back near the fence, where there’s no radiating heat to assist them.  

Once I saw everything thriving, I decided to back my theory with data. I purchased weather sensors from Amazon and immediately noticed a few degrees of difference in temperature near the brick. Once the temps started to drop, I began monitoring the temperatures and started saving the data in a spreadsheet. Linked below.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OhEzHmzhZxIAaz99XZHH_zpdEXuwjV1CW5VJoppOxhc/edit?usp=sharing

Sensor 1 was placed on the small Queen palm (as seen in the photos), located far from my house and within 10 feet of the fence.

Sensor 2 was placed on the Royal palm (as seen in the photos), located about 6 feet from the house.

Sensor 3 was placed on the Foxtail palm (as seen in the photos), also located about 6 feet from the house.

Since placement, I have not moved the sensors.

So far, you can see a trend: the brick does indeed keep the palms warmer! Awesome, so problem solved, right? Not exactly. This chart will continue to be updated, and as you can see, we are currently experiencing a significant cold snap. Just last night, the sensor on the small Queen palm recorded temperatures below freezing, while the Foxtail and Royal palm sensors recorded just a few degrees above freezing.

This prompted me to wrap the coconuts since they are much smaller and further from the heat-radiating brick. I also plan to wrap the Foxtail and Royal palms if their sensor readings drop below freezing for more than an hour. I’m hopeful that the size of the Foxtail and Royal palms will help them withstand these cold nights.

The Adonidia palms are on their own without frost cloth, as they are closest to the house, with the dual Adonidia actually being enclosed by bushes and the house itself.

As we battle this cold snap, I just wanted to share the experiment I have going on here in North Florida. To my knowledge, I don’t know anyone who has successfully grown coconuts or Foxtails in this area. However, I’m hopeful I can change that!

Attached, you will find fairly recent photos of the palms. As you can see, the coconuts are currently wrapped until nighttime temperatures rise above 40°F. The Foxtail and Royal palms both have Christmas lights on them—not for heating purposes but simply because it’s the holiday season, and my wife asked me to put them up.

I plan to keep updating the spreadsheet over the next few months and share updates on the forum regarding any defoliation or damage. So far, none of the trees have shown any noticeable burns or damage.

P.S. I’m by no means an expert. I’m really new to palms in general and have only scratched the surface of knowledge about these trees. If you have any advice, insights, or questions, please feel free to comment. Thanks!

That's a very nice selection of palms you have there growing. 

There are endless conversations and shared experiences with zone pushed palms. The facts are clear.  Pushing an entire zone and up is tough , especially once they grow to a size where it gets nearly impossible to protect them. Once the internal bud grows higher than the roof that gives the palm shelter, it will be exposed to the cold air . Your created micro climate will vanish like a ghost.  Queens are long lasting palms in Jacksonville,  don't even need protection unless you are going to have another 1980s storm.  From doing my research your zone 9b is pretty solid for the most part with some 9a winters in between. 

Good luck with your palms. 

 

[kinzyjr]

@trippc

You have quite the selection.  If you are free on Saturday, December 7th, 2024, stop in at St. Johns Botanical Garden and Nature Preserve in Hastings.  We'll be having a CFPACS Meeting, complete with BBQ lunch, plant auction, and vendor sale.

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/85612-central-florida-palm-cycad-society-holiday-2024-meeting/

 

Here are some links from your neck of the woods:

Miscellaneous:
Palms Around Town - Jacksonville, FL: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/69928-palms-around-town-jacksonville-fl/
Florida species recommendations: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/82980-florida-species-recommendations/
Most exotic palms in 9b: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/54931-most-exotic-palms-in-9b/
Palms at my childhood home: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/66694-palms-at-my-childhood-home/

Majesty Palms:
Large Majesty Palms north of Jacksonville: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/67162-large-majesty-palms-north-of-jacksonville/

 

Chambeyronia:
C. Macrocarpa in Atlantic Beach: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/71361-c-macrocarpa-in-atlantic-beach/

 

Archontophoenix:
Archontophoenix Maxima in northeast Florida: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/79699-archontophoenix-maxima-in-northeast-florida/

Coconuts
Coconut Palm in Jacksonville FL 3rd year and still going strong: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/72481-coconut-palm-in-jacksonville-fl-3rd-year-and-still-going-strong/
Baby coconut project (9B): https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/79957-baby-coconut-project-9b/
Cocos ID at Home Depot: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/67971-cocos-id-at-home-depot/

 

Becarriopheonix alfredii:
Beccariophoenix alfredii growth NE Florida: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/70906-beccariophoenix-alfredii-growth-ne-florida/
Becarriopheonix alfredii Jacksonville florida: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/58877-becarriopheonix-alfredii-jacksonville-florida/

Bottles and Spindles:
Spotted a trunking, outdoor Spindle Palm / Hyophorbe verschaffeltii in Jacksonville Beach!!!: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/71359-spotted-a-trunking-outdoor-spindle-palm-hyophorbe-verschaffeltii-in-jacksonville-beach/
Northeast Florida Spindle Palms: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/54038-northeast-florida-spindle-palms/
Bottle palms: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/74384-bottle-palms/

 

Jubaea chilensis:
Growing Jubaea chilensis in Florida: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/69381-growing-jubaea-chilensis-in-florida/

Royals:
Roystoneas in Jax: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/71483-roystoneas-in-jax/
Northern most royals east of the Mississippi: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/58085-northern-most-royals-east-of-the-mississippi/
Range of royal palms: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/61438-range-of-royal-palms/
Jax, Fl Royal Palm Update: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/79007-jax-fl-royal-palm-update/
northernmost Royal Palm in INLAND Florida ???: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/31380-northernmost-royal-palm-in-inland-florida/
Roystonea regia in Flagler Beach (North Florida): https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/34769-roystonea-regia-in-flagler-beach-north-florida/
Goodby Creek Streetview: https://www.google.com/maps/@30.2139595,-81.6220549,3a,75y,25.7h,92.57t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s6LoS8NS8mVxtQu2u1rXXKA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

Other Species:
Jacksonville,FL Queen palms: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/82554-jacksonvillefl-queen-palms/
How rare are Arikury palms?: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/83069-how-rare-are-arikury-palms/
Jackass palm in Jacksonville: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/81855-jackass-palm-in-jacksonville/
Livistona everywhere: https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/76610-livistona-everywhere/

[CodyM]

On 11/24/2024 at 1:47 AM, kinzyjr said:

You have quite the selection.  If you are free on Saturday, December 7th, 2024, stop in at St. Johns Botanical Garden and Nature Preserve in Hastings.  We'll be having a CFPACS Meeting, complete with BBQ lunch, plant auction, and vendor sale.

@kinzyjr Do you know if it’ll be open to the public? If so, what time? I’d love to go!

[kinzyjr]

6 minutes ago, CodyM said:

@kinzyjr Do you know if it’ll be open to the public? If so, what time? I’d love to go!

The meeting is open with an RSVP.  As of this post, I'll consider you RSVP'ed and add you to the guest list.  Send me a PM and let me know if any family/friends are coming with you and I'll update the guest list.  When you arrive, let them know you're there for the CFPACS meeting.

Anyone else interested - just let me know.

Date, time, and address available here:

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/topic/85612-central-florida-palm-cycad-society-holiday-2024-meeting/