Bad palm neighbor – African Sumac?

[Christopher Dillman]

So I've had this 'African Sumac' tree, which has suddenly popped up wild in my front yard and just over a year it's six feet tall and sprawling.

While I like the coverage/privacy it brings, apparently I was told by a palm grower it is not a good neighbor with palms. Its leaves and berry droppings can be poisonous to palms.

News to me! You?

I'd like to avoid digging it out. Insights appreciated!  

[Silas_Sancona]

27 minutes ago, Christopher Dillman said:

So I've had this 'African Sumac' tree, which has suddenly popped up wild in my front yard and just over a year it's six feet tall and sprawling.

While I like the coverage/privacy it brings, apparently I was told by a palm grower it is not a good neighbor with palms. Its leaves and berry droppings can be poisonous to palms.

News to me! You?

I'd like to avoid digging it out. Insights appreciated!  

Don't know about the plant being poisonous to others but definitely don't want it around.. Roots are quite aggressive / invasive, is tough to kill / can sucker profusely, ..some distance from the mother tree.. and you will be grinding away your teeth trying to keep up w/ all the seedlings it will generate.. Many better -and less of a nightmare options around for creating privacy.

Used to be used in landscapes here until it's true nature started to show. Pretty sure it is now on the state's noxious weed list ..or will be soon.  Most legitimate nurseries don't sell it, or face backlash when people see it still being offered.

[Rivera]

Christopher,

I can't weigh in on this plant's allelopathic nature, but most of these exotic "volunteer" plants that show up in our gardens begin to reveal their unfavorable qualities in short time! In coastal SF, it's the albizia julibrissin. They can be quite graceful and delicate looking for such a vigorous plant, which is why I suspect neighbors sometimes allow them to stay when they show up uninvited and get by on their own. Before long they become a problem, seeding themselves all over the place and spreading aggressively into adjacent wild land. 

I'm not knowledgeable about African Sumac, but many fast growing drought tolerant plants depend on an extensive and highly adaptive root system to find water wherever it may be (in this case, I presume right around your palms). So even if it's not poisonous to your palms, it may very well drink up much of their precious water, stunting their growth. I respect a plant with vigor, but bad reputations are usually earned.

Good luck whatever you choose to do.

-Chris

[WaianaeCrider]

African Tulip here in Hawai`i is an invasive monster w/all those characteristics minus the poison.  It's seeds float away in the wind like dandylion seeds and let's not talk bout suckers.  Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Christopher Dillman]

33 minutes ago, WaianaeCrider said:

African Tulip here in Hawai`i is an invasive monster w/all those characteristics minus the poison.  It's seeds float away in the wind like dandylion seeds and let's not talk bout suckers.  Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Funny you mentioned the African Tulip. That was suggested to me by a grower here as a replacement for the Sumac.

The yellow variety of Tulip is what I'm after {hard to find so far in San Diego..}. Gold Medallion is another tree I'm looking for.

[Silas_Sancona]

31 minutes ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Funny you mentioned the African Tulip. That was suggested to me by a grower here as a replacement for the Sumac.

The yellow variety of Tulip is what I'm after {hard to find so far in San Diego..}. Gold Medallion is another tree I'm looking for.

Gold Medallion, Cassia Leptophylla, is a GREAT warm season  flowering tree for your area..

Another larger Cassia/ Senna species you might do some digging on is Senna macranthera ..Often sold as Senna splendida " Golden Wonder"  Unlike Gold Medallion, "Golden Wonder " flowers in mid-late Fall- early winter when a lot of stuff has stopped flowering for the year.  Stunning and will attract all sorts of attention from neighbors / friends who visit. While both will set seedpods, neither presents an aggressive / invasive risk ..as far as i'm aware

African Tulip is a good tree too ..Unlike pother areas such as Hawaii, hasn't showing any invasive tendencies there in San Diego that i'm aware of.. Wood is somewhat weak and prone to wind damage though.

Like Blue flowering trees?  ..A little harder to find, but highly recommend Guaiacum coulteri. A little slow -though faster if deep soaked 1x month June-October- Never gets too big  -or should i say, will take time reaching a mature height. Drought, heat, and cool tolerant ( Specimens growing in colder areas of Tucson survive dips into the lower mid 20s < or slightly lower >  and occasional Snow. )

Regionally native to N.W. / Western Mexico ( ...just south of AZ in Sonora - to Chiapas / Guatemala ) and is not aggressive / invasive.. ( Seed has a short shelf-life )

Will flower in cycles May-October in response to warmth and humidity.  Blue color is un-rivaled for a flowering tree.. Flowers are slightly fragrant too ( like Licorice ).



Should it peak your interest, No worries if not,   check w/ wholesale nurseries in Palm Springs who can ship to a nursery closer to where you're at.. Know of at least one place out there that keeps them in stock. Grow several myself.

A picture or two

Specimen i planted at a former residence. Have two in the ground at the place i'm at now.



One of my potted specimens.  Thinner than those planted in the ground and because i'm training it.

[Christopher Dillman]

58 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Gold Medallion, Cassia Leptophylla, is a GREAT warm season  flowering tree for your area..

Another larger Cassia/ Senna species you might do some digging on is Senna macranthera ..Often sold as Senna splendida " Golden Wonder"  Unlike Gold Medallion, "Golden Wonder " flowers in mid-late Fall- early winter when a lot of stuff has stopped flowering for the year.  Stunning and will attract all sorts of attention from neighbors / friends who visit. While both will set seedpods, neither presents an aggressive / invasive risk ..as far as i'm aware

African Tulip is a good tree too ..Unlike pother areas such as Hawaii, hasn't showing any invasive tendencies there in San Diego that i'm aware of.. Wood is somewhat weak and prone to wind damage though.

Like Blue flowering trees?  ..A little harder to find, but highly recommend Guaiacum coulteri. A little slow -though faster if deep soaked 1x month June-October- Never gets too big  -or should i say, will take time reaching a mature height. Drought, heat, and cool tolerant ( Specimens growing in colder areas of Tucson survive dips into the lower mid 20s < or slightly lower >  and occasional Snow. )

Regionally native to N.W. / Western Mexico ( ...just south of AZ in Sonora - to Chiapas / Guatemala ) and is not aggressive / invasive.. ( Seed has a short shelf-life )

Will flower in cycles May-October in response to warmth and humidity.  Blue color is un-rivaled for a flowering tree.. Flowers are slightly fragrant too ( like Licorice ).



Should it peak your interest, No worries if not,   check w/ wholesale nurseries in Palm Springs who can ship to a nursery closer to where you're at.. Know of at least one place out there that keeps them in stock. Grow several myself.

A picture or two

Specimen i planted at a former residence. Have two in the ground at the place i'm at now.



One of my potted specimens.  Thinner than those planted in the ground and because i'm training it.

 

Lovely recommendations, thank you! Very intrigued with the Senna splendida.

Same btw as the Senna spectabilis?

Also curious if the Sennas flower more year-round than the Cassias?

Getting off the palm track here, but do admit the Sennas and Cassias appear to be friendly neighbors with palms.

Edited March 11, 2023 by Christopher Dillman

[Silas_Sancona]

1 minute ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Lovely recommendations, thank you! Very intrigued with the Senna splendida. Same btw as the Senna spectabilis?

Different sp. but from a similar area of S. America. S. spectabilis  has larger flower inflos / smaller individual flowers / smaller individual leaves than either splendida / macranthera ( much bigger / wider leaves = both sp. ).

Here's a couple pictures of each sp. from iNat ( iNaturalist ) *** Full Credit to the given photographers***  The first picture is of a specimen growing somewhere just north of Vista. Very curious if the owner might be a member here..

S. macranthera  ..Or what was marked as S. splendida X " Golden Wonder " for years.  The actual species ( splendida ) looks different ( leaf / flower arrangement )  Are similar enough that they were mixed up when introduced to the Nursery trade ..or is what is assumed.





S. spectabilis.    Cassia leptophylla, Golden Medallion Tree,  looks similar ( holds it's flowers in whorls also but they're shorter than in spectabilis )

[Christopher Dillman]

21 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Different sp. but from a similar area of S. America. S. spectabilis  has larger flower inflos / smaller individual flowers / smaller individual leaves than either splendida / macranthera ( much bigger / wider leaves = both sp. ).

Here's a couple pictures of each sp. from iNat ( iNaturalist ) *** Full Credit to the given photographers***  The first picture is of a specimen growing somewhere just north of Vista. Very curious if the owner might be a member here..

S. macranthera  ..Or what was marked as S. splendida X " Golden Wonder " for years.  The actual species ( splendida ) looks different ( leaf / flower arrangement )  Are similar enough that they were mixed up when introduced to the Nursery trade ..or is what is assumed.

S. spectabilis.    Cassia leptophylla, Golden Medallion Tree,  looks similar ( holds it's flowers in whorls also but they're shorter than in spectabilis )

 

Amazing photos. And surprisingly my local nursery in San Diego doesn't carry any of the Sennas. They have the Gold Medallion and Thevetia, both with yellow flowers which is what I'm after.

Also pains me to say I can't have a flowering tree that attracts bees. Of course the typical answer I get from nurseries - 'anything that blooms attract bees.' Although certainly some plants attracts tons more than others. My son unfortunately has a bee allergy, and I have to mitigate as many bees on my property as possible.

I'll keep searching for the Sennas - but which tree variety would you say attracts less bees - Senna, Gold Medallion (Cassia), African Tulip, or Thevetia?

[Silas_Sancona]

1 minute ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Amazing photos. And surprisingly my local nursery in San Diego doesn't carry any of the Sennas. They have the Gold Medallion and Thevetia, both with yellow flowers which is what I'm after.

Also pains me to say I can't have a flowering tree that attracts bees. Of course the typical answer I get from nurseries - 'anything that blooms attract bees.' Although certainly some plants attracts tons more than others. My son unfortunately has a bee allergy, and I have to mitigate as many bees on my property as possible.

I'll keep searching for the Sennas - but which tree variety would you say attracts less bees - Senna, Gold Medallion (Cassia), African Tulip, or Thevetia?

All three will attract them, though hard to say to what degree..  Thevetia are commonly planted here but can't say i've seen a ton of Bees attracted to specimens i have been around, not that they don't visit the flowers.  That said, the plant itself is fairly poisonous ( sap and seeds,  if you have any pets ..specifically dogs that might chew on random stuff in the yard ) Compared to say Oleander ( Same plant family ) they might be a little less toxic, but you'd still want to be careful where you'd place one, if you went in that direction..
 

African Tulip will attract Bees, but believe the nectar produced by the flowers is toxic = kills both our native and introduced Honeybees. Ironically, California Buckeye also produces nectar that is toxic to Honeybees also.


A quick side note on Bees, While yes, Honeybees can sting if harassed enough / can be a little temperamental at times.. Native, solitary species (...there are dozens of sp. in S. Cal and here in AZ ) usually don't sting unless you were to grab one. Some are so small ( size of a pin head ) that if they did try to sting, it wouldn't penetrate the skin. Even then, they don't always fight back / defend themselves.  Carpenter / Bumble Bees are typically similar in their temperament to solitary species, even if intimidating looking when they buzz you.

[Christopher Dillman]

1 hour ago, Silas_Sancona said:

S. macranthera  ..Or what was marked as S. splendida X " Golden Wonder " for years.  The actual species ( splendida ) looks different ( leaf / flower arrangement )  Are similar enough that they were mixed up when introduced to the Nursery trade ..or is what is assumed.


 

Eureka! Found a 24in box Splendida at another nursery. Look forward to checking it out next time they open. Will post a pic. Thanks again for the recommendation.

[Marius]

12 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Don't know about the plant being poisonous to others but definitely don't want it around.. Roots are quite aggressive / invasive, is tough to kill / can sucker profusely, ..some distance from the mother tree.. and you will be grinding away your teeth trying to keep up w/ all the seedlings it will generate.. Many better -and less of a nightmare options around for creating privacy.

Used to be used in landscapes here until it's true nature started to show. Pretty sure it is now on the state's noxious weed list ..or will be soon.  Most legitimate nurseries don't sell it, or face backlash when people see it still being offered.

Searsia lancea or Karee as we call it, is native to where I live and I have always enjoyed gardening under it as it’s canopy protects well and the roots are not aggressive.
 

see excerpt from South African biodiversity institute article:  Growing Searsia lancea

The karee is an excellent shade tree especially in hot regions such as the Karoo and Kalahari since it is evergreen and drought resistant. Searsia lancea does not have an aggressive root system and can be used near paving and tarred surfaces. Because the karee is hardy, frost resistant and evergreen, it is ideal for establishing a protective canopy for frost sensitive and shade loving plants. It could thus be considered as a possible pioneer plant for establishing a new forest in an area that receives frost. Searsia lancea  is suitable for use as a large hedge along the boundaries of properties such as farms because of its dense growth habit. 

full article: 

http://pza.sanbi.org/searsia-lancea

 

[Silas_Sancona]

3 minutes ago, Marius said:

Searsia lancea or Karee as we call it, is native to where I live and I have always enjoyed gardening under it as it’s canopy protects well and the roots are not aggressive.
 

see excerpt from South African biodiversity institute article:  Growing Searsia lancea

The karee is an excellent shade tree especially in hot regions such as the Karoo and Kalahari since it is evergreen and drought resistant. Searsia lancea does not have an aggressive root system and can be used near paving and tarred surfaces. Because the karee is hardy, frost resistant and evergreen, it is ideal for establishing a protective canopy for frost sensitive and shade loving plants. It could thus be considered as a possible pioneer plant for establishing a new forest in an area that receives frost. Searsia lancea  is suitable for use as a large hedge along the boundaries of properties such as farms because of its dense growth habit. 

full article: 

http://pza.sanbi.org/searsia-lancea

 

May behave there, but is an absolutely horrible invasive here in the U.S. Southwest..  Aside from how easily it can spread by seed, roots getting into water/ sewer lines / lifting concrete is another reason it has been ax-ed from use in landscapes. Sissoo is another non native that turned out to be a nightmare introduction.


Several plants from S. Africa infact go absolutely bonkers here / are causing serious problems where they have escaped / spread here. ( Natal / Napier Grass, Buffelgrass, Stinknet / Globe Chamomile ) same with numerous things from North Africa / Middle east / parts of the Mediterranean ( Fountain Grass, Sahara Mustard, Tamarix, etc. )

 

[WaianaeCrider]

12 hours ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Funny you mentioned the African Tulip. That was suggested to me by a grower here as a replacement for the Sumac.

The yellow variety of Tulip is what I'm after {hard to find so far in San Diego..}. Gold Medallion is another tree I'm looking for.

I've seen the yellow at the Kaiser Hospital on O`ahu.  Pretty BUT I'm sure it's just as invasive.  Nasty weed.

[WaianaeCrider]

9 hours ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Amazing photos. And surprisingly my local nursery in San Diego doesn't carry any of the Sennas. They have the Gold Medallion and Thevetia, both with yellow flowers which is what I'm after.

Also pains me to say I can't have a flowering tree that attracts bees. Of course the typical answer I get from nurseries - 'anything that blooms attract bees.' Although certainly some plants attracts tons more than others. My son unfortunately has a bee allergy, and I have to mitigate as many bees on my property as possible.

I'll keep searching for the Sennas - but which tree variety would you say attracts less bees - Senna, Gold Medallion (Cassia), African Tulip, or Thevetia?

ALL my palms attract bees when in flower and I have a lot of palms in flower all year.

 

[96720]

I would have to agree with Nathan the blue of Guaiacum is spectacular they bloom of and on all summer and blue is much more relaxing color in summer instead of yellow red and orange mine is a different species than Nathan’s.

 

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by 96720
Add photo

[Silas_Sancona]

3 hours ago, 96720 said:

I would have to agree with Nathan the blue of Guaiacum is spectacular they bloom of and on all summer and blue is much more relaxing color in summer instead of yellow red and orange mine is a different species than Nathan’s.

 

 

If you originally bought it from somewhere local, it is probably G. coulteri.. though maybe the narrower- leaved, "supposed / suggested" variant from Sonora some have called G. c. var. palmeri.. Regardless,

Yes, anything that flowers Blue ...and /or X shade of Purple, esp. in Summer.. is a calming change from constant Red, Orange, or Yellow flowering things, too much of either in a garden can make a landscape look too "hot" especially here where most buildings ( exterior paint color choices ), rock, etc are typically warm-toned to begin with.

On a similar note, years ago when i lived in KS, the bar i worked at was originally painted shades of red and gold inside the Lounge and main room. We constantly delt with fights on concert or "open" nights.

Under new management, we spent 6 weeks repainting the entire building various shades of blue, green, and white.   Guess what kind of behavior we saw less of ...esp. on busy nights.

[Christopher Dillman]

13 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

If you originally bought it from somewhere local, it is probably G. coulteri.. though maybe the narrower- leaved, "supposed / suggested" variant from Sonora some have called G. c. var. palmeri.. 

Thoughts on the Guaiacum Officinale? Seems to be more tree-like than the coulteri. Agreed on the colors, though yellow flowers really do bring out more of the green in landscapes.

Decisions decisions. The Guaiacum is really growing on me - pardon puns. 

[Silas_Sancona]

2 minutes ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Thoughts on the Guaiacum Officinale? Seems to be more tree-like than the coulteri. Agreed on the colors, though yellow flowers really do bring out more of the green in landscapes.

Decisions decisions. The Guaiacum is really growing on me - pardon puns. 

Also one of my favorites, but very little tested in CA.. More cold sensitive than G. coulteri as well..  Not easy to access anything bigger than seedling sized plants, if even available,  as well..  Many online sellers who might advertise having it, will often sell another species.( G. sanctum )

As mentioned, trick w/ getting G. coulteri to tree size fast / fast-er is deep soaking 1-2x/month May-September/October, mirroring irrigation provided from Monsoon / Hurricane season rainfall,  staking,  ..and trimming away any lower branches as the plant gains height..

Do those 3 basic things and you can get them up to tree size in a fairly short amount of time.. Yes, there are boxed specimens around in the nurseries, but the generally aren't staked, to help get them up, and are quite expensive.  There is also some debate about how easily / successfully large specimens transplant. I personally don't purchase anything bigger than a 15gal. W/ these, i start w/ 5gal, or my own seed grown plants.

Specimen in a public garden on the west side of Phoenix Au- Naturale  ..no trimming done to expose trunks.. Been in the ground since roughly 2008, and has experienced sub 28F cold a few times w/ just some minor tip damage that it grew out of quickly. Were at approx. 10ft when i first saw them in 2013. There's another in a different area that i believe was planted in 2013-14, but is already close to 10ft, maybe taller now.



Specimen " in training " at the old house, before the stakes broke..



Googly / iNat images of specimens in Sonora / Sinaloa where they are often trimmed to tree size by people or Cattle..  *** Photo credits to those who took the pictures ***









Guaiacum sanctum,  the other " Caribbean" Guaiacum species ( ..besides G. officinale ) is pretty tough ..grow it here w/ out issue. Would likely do pretty well in coastal / near coastal S. Cal.  A Little easier to find ( though you'll have to start w/ small plants also ) than G. officinale,  but flowers are smaller than coulteri or officinale. Nice species to consider trying regardless..

[96720]

I would post a picture of mine but palm talk insists on putting it upside down 

[Marius]

On 3/12/2023 at 7:43 AM, Silas_Sancona said:

May behave there, but is an absolutely horrible invasive here in the U.S. Southwest..  Aside from how easily it can spread by seed, roots getting into water/ sewer lines / lifting concrete is another reason it has been ax-ed from use in landscapes. Sissoo is another non native that turned out to be a nightmare introduction.


Several plants from S. Africa infact go absolutely bonkers here / are causing serious problems where they have escaped / spread here. ( Natal / Napier Grass, Buffelgrass, Stinknet / Globe Chamomile ) same with numerous things from North Africa / Middle east / parts of the Mediterranean ( Fountain Grass, Sahara Mustard, Tamarix, etc. )

 

This is not unique to California.  It happens a lot when plants are introduced into areas where they are not native. In South Africa we have problems with many invasive species from other countries. 

[Silas_Sancona]

1 minute ago, Marius said:

This is not unique to California.  It happens a lot when plants are introduced into areas where they are not native. In South Africa we have problems with many invasive species from other countries. 

Yep, very true...  Not sure which sp. it is specifically, but know Mesquite is causing big time problems in parts of Africa since being introduced.. Siam Weed, a native to S. TX and Mexico, is another nasty weed in places like Australia.. 

Part of the reason a plant that may behave here, might become a nightmare in Asia/ Africa, or Australia?, or here from those places?  they are oceans away from the animals / fungi, etc that help control them, which they evolved with, over millennia..  In the case of African Sumac, no need for it in landscapes here. We have plenty of great Rhus species, which won't cause ecological issues if they escape a garden..

[Christopher Dillman]

12 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

In the case of African Sumac, no need for it in landscapes here. We have plenty of great Rhus species, which won't cause ecological issues if they escape a garden..

Well.. the latest is I've struck out on the Splendidas and Leptophyllas here in San Diego. As an aside (and minor gripe) - tough being a solitary consumer when walking into these nursery lots, who prefer only focusing on the landscape contractors. They said they had two Splendidas on their lot, couldn't find anyone to help me find them, then refused to send me pics of them if they did find them. I get it - they're way understaffed and have to focus on the bulk orders. But still.. 😐

There are others more readily avail at nurseries – Caesalpinia mexicana and Tabebuia chrysotrichas, Palo Verde, Tipuana. Goal is still a yellow flowering tree and low branching, zone 10a (Encinitas, CA).

The clock is ticking - come full Spring time that Sumac is going to be another three feet tall. 😬

 

Edited March 14, 2023 by Christopher Dillman

[Silas_Sancona]

3 hours ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Well.. the latest is I've struck out on the Splendidas and Leptophyllas here in San Diego. As an aside (and minor gripe) - tough being a solitary consumer when walking into these nursery lots, who prefer only focusing on the landscape contractors. They said they had two Splendidas on their lot, couldn't find anyone to help me find them, then refused to send me pics of them if they did find them. I get it - they're way understaffed and have to focus on the bulk orders. But still.. 😐

There are others more readily avail at nurseries – Caesalpinia mexicana and Tabebuia chrysotrichas, Palo Verde, Tipuana. Goal is still a yellow flowering tree and low branching, zone 10a (Encinitas, CA).

The clock is ticking - come full Spring time that Sumac is going to be another three feet tall. 😬

 

Tipuana are nice, but will get HUGE out there in time  ..And i mean BIG, lol..

Palo Verde, X Desert Museum is another great flowering tree, but have to be careful w/ providing water.. Many people water wayyy too much, which causes the tree to have a lot of weakened growth, which can break easily in windstorms ( Happens several times a year here )

Tabebuia **now Handroanthus ** chrysotricha / tricus are awesome for spring color ..Green the rest of the year until they drop most /all leaves in winter..

Caesalpinia ** now Erythrostemon ** mexicana / canus,  and the related Tara, formally Caesalpinia cascalote would be better choices for smaller sized tree options that will also flower more often during the year ..Erythrostemon mexicanus esp.

*** Most older, not up-to-date on taxon changes nurseries will still sell the above "Caesalipnias" under the old name, Caesalpinia.

[Christopher Dillman]

15 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Tipuana are nice, but will get HUGE out there in time  ..And i mean BIG, lol..

All great info, thank you!

Got another one to throw at you - Koelreuterua paniculata (Golden raintree). On the tropical side like the Tipu, though I don't 'think' they get very big.

Also my instincts tell me to get something more on the tropical side which will play nicely as neighbor to my palms.

[Silas_Sancona]

3 hours ago, Christopher Dillman said:

All great info, thank you!

Got another one to throw at you - Koelreuterua paniculata (Golden raintree). On the tropical side like the Tipu, though I don't 'think' they get very big.

Also my instincts tell me to get something more on the tropical side which will play nicely as neighbor to my palms.

Flowers are ok,  but you'll have TONS of seedlings / pods to deal with..  I wouldn't plant one myself.

[D Palm]

If you want to avoid digging or hand removing it, Tractor supply has some liquid spray in a red can. Can’t remember the name, but it took care of a yellow invasive Carolina jasmine vine that took over part of my yard in a couple weeks time.

another guy I know has used disel fuel….but can’t officially recommend that because of environmental concerns.

[96720]

tropical crape myrtle trees are pretty and bloom off and on all summer don’t like frost tabibua trees are beautiful in bloom but don’t bloom for very long!!

Hong Kong orchids are also beautiful trees that bloom for quite a while in spring!!!

[Silas_Sancona]

43 minutes ago, 96720 said:

tropical crape myrtle trees are pretty and bloom off and on all summer don’t like frost tabibua trees are beautiful in bloom but don’t bloom for very long!!

Hong Kong orchids are also beautiful trees that bloom for quite a while in spring!!!

Good choices, though ..besides where i'd worked, have yet to see any Tropical Crepe Myrtle planted anywhere in the valley..  Would be a nice sight though..

Yet to see big, full Handroanthus impetiginosus,  ( no longer in the Genus Tabebuia ),  ...the hardiest, and most easily accessible of the Trumpet Trees.. around either.  Most specimens observed thus far look kind of sparse and heat stressed.  Nowhere near as tall / lush as they look in CA. 

Hong Kong Orchids do seem to take our heat alright though, and look good ..if they're fertilized correctly / watered enough.

[96720]

That tropical crape myrtle is in my yard in Phoenix!!

[mnorell]

Lagerstroemia speciosa is fully viable in much of Southern California as well. I have grown it successfully there in the past. I also think there is a specimen at the Fullerton Arboretum that flowers regularly. It might not do well right at the coast because of a lack of heat buildup, or in regularly frosty spots, but is worth testing much more widely, it is far from being a difficult one to cultivate, and I would expect it to do just fine in the mostly frostless areas of the low desert. I think it's an issue with the trade, and that the tree is never publicized or otherwise brought to the public's attention...Tabebuia/Handroanthus/Cybistax/Roseodendron (pick your favored synonym, taxonomists stay in business by playing with this complex in the Bignoniaceae) are also basically nonexistent in the Coachella Valley of California, while only two of the many beautiful candidates in the Handroanthus "Ipe" group have become relatively common in the coastal plain over the last 40 years after endless hard lobbying by botanical gardens and forward-thinking horticulturists and designers. All of these love heat and provide substantial ornamental value. I think the main obstacle in the trade for hot desert areas is that there is a feeling that the related Tecoma stans can be sold more successfully since it is well adapted in the desert, effortless to propagate, quicly trainable as a standard, and basically evergreen (the Tab. complex are generally deciduous)...and has flowers that are so similar in appearance, at least to the yellow-flowered species.

It's always an uphill battle in a land of endless (and inappropriately sold/planted and subsequently hat-racked) jacarandas...

 

[96720]

If you are stuck on yellow another choice would be Delonix regia var. flavida

[Christopher Dillman]

43 minutes ago, 96720 said:

If you are stuck on yellow another choice would be Delonix regia var. flavida

Oh, thank you for that. Fine looking tree indeed – the low canopy + yellow is what I'm after.

More phoning around in San Diego for the hunt!

[Christopher Dillman]

Well, no longer stuck on a yellow flower. Going all in with a 15 gal cockspur coral tree {Erythrina crista-galli} to replace the sumac. Add a slice of Hawaii in my yard.

One thing I've been told is these corals require far less water than the sumac. And need to 'stump' the tree, that is cut back the branches so spring growth shows up. 

Meet your new neighbor moving in queen palms!

[Silas_Sancona]

14 minutes ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Well, no longer stuck on a yellow flower. Going all in with a 15 gal cockspur coral tree {Erythrina crista-galli} to replace the sumac. Add a slice of Hawaii in my yard.

One thing I've been told is these corals require far less water than the sumac. And need to 'stump' the tree, that is cut back the branches so spring growth shows up. 

Meet your new neighbor moving in queen palms!

Good choice..

While correct that Erythrina generally require less water, who ever passed along the " stumping " advise,  is very incorrect..  Yes, the occasional trim might be needed to remove any dead, or cris crossing, branches on older trees, or to train for height,  but removing everything / most of the canopy  -each year- will delay / remove most or all flowers ..and make the tree susceptible to wood boring insects..  In other words, let it grow.

If you're ever up that way, there is an excellent example of this tree near the L.A. Arboretum ..if it is still there ( been awhile since my last visit ). 

[Silas_Sancona]

45 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Good choice..

While correct that Erythrina generally require less water, who ever passed along the " stumping " advise,  is very incorrect..  Yes, the occasional trim might be needed to remove any dead, or cris crossing, branches on older trees, or to train for height,  but removing everything / most of the canopy  -each year- will delay / remove most or all flowers ..and make the tree susceptible to wood boring insects..  In other words, let it grow.

If you're ever up that way, there is an excellent example of this tree near the L.A. Arboretum ..if it is still there ( been awhile since my last visit ). 

Found it.. Obviously, a pretty old specimen.. Yours would take time to reach half this size.

[Christopher Dillman]

1 hour ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Found it.. Obviously, a pretty old specimen.. Yours would take time to reach half this size.

Spectacular. Thank you for sharing!

It was a bit odd, one of the lead managers at the nursery where I purchased the 15gal crista-galli. Claimed he grew one from a seed, and 40 years later he has a giant in his yard. Stood by the 'stumping' technique during winters.

I'd rather stick with your gameplan.  Flowers are always the goal. 

[Hillizard]

16 hours ago, Christopher Dillman said:

Spectacular. Thank you for sharing!

It was a bit odd, one of the lead managers at the nursery where I purchased the 15gal crista-galli. Claimed he grew one from a seed, and 40 years later he has a giant in his yard. Stood by the 'stumping' technique during winters.

I'd rather stick with your gameplan.  Flowers are always the goal. 

The Calif. state record tree (i.e., the "monumental" one ) is so large that yearly pruning wouldn't be practical: https://www.monumentaltrees.com/en/usa/california/sacramentocounty/19197_californiastatecapitolmuseum/36109/

[Christopher Dillman]

4 hours ago, Hillizard said:

The Calif. state record tree (i.e., the "monumental" one ) is so large that yearly pruning wouldn't be practical: https://www.monumentaltrees.com/en/usa/california/sacramentocounty/19197_californiastatecapitolmuseum/36109/

20 years later, I will revisit this post and think 'careful what you ask for..'

I'll have to pay homage to this tree next time I'm at the state capitol.