Foliar spray

[JohnAndSancho]

So I found some 12 year old threads on foliar fertilizer - I've read about the Southern Ag brand in particular. I'm a small time hobbyist growing palms mostly on the patio of a tiny apartment, and I'm asking if it would be worth it to me to spend $30 or so to supplement my (mostly small/seedlings) with foliar spray during this heat and drought in Texas. I've already added my second dose of slow release (Carl Pool), adding Jobes 4-4-4 chicken poop, and adding Alaska fish emulsion and a few drops of SuperThrive to every other watering. Everything is growing and looks great minus some sunburn. Also mist everything almost nightly. 

 

Would I (or, to be exact, my palms) be pissing away money, or will I see benefits between now and winter? 

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

  On 7/25/2022 at 1:01 AM, JohnAndSancho said:

Would I (or, to be exact, my palms) be pissing away money, or will I see benefits between now and winter?

Expand  

This is an interesting idea as it's always a pain to try and fertilize seedlings.

T J 

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 7/25/2022 at 1:35 AM, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

This is an interesting idea as it's always a pain to try and fertilize seedlings.

T J 

Expand  

If I can be specific, my seedlings are B. Alfreidii and A. Tuckerii plus a very small handful of C. Radicalis on my patio and L  Weddelanium on the inside (.....that are somehow still seedlings after having them forever) I wouldn't take any chances on them. 

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

  On 7/25/2022 at 1:38 AM, JohnAndSancho said:

I wouldn't take any chances on them. 

Expand  

I totally understand,  my container ranch is starting to get out of hand. With so many different sizes hard to differentiate how much each species and sizes should get. Of course I'm not sure how much these palms really even need. 

T J 

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 7/25/2022 at 1:46 AM, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

I totally understand,  my container ranch is starting to get out of hand. With so many different sizes hard to differentiate how much each species and sizes should get. Of course I'm not sure how much these palms really even need. 

T J 

Expand  

I guess an unintended positive is, all of my outdoor pots are getting unintentionally leached with all the extra waterings. My shaded palms are good but the 4 or 5 in full sun...... 

 

The downside is it smells from all the fish emulsion and "organic palm food" is pelletized chicken doo doo. 

[96720]

Foliar feeding is a quick fix if you have a real problem, it is much better for the fertilizer to be taken up by the roots. Be careful and don’t over fertilize!!!

Edited July 25, 2022 by 96720

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 7/25/2022 at 2:21 AM, 96720 said:

Foliar feeding is a quick fix if you have a real problem it is much better for the fertilizer to be taken up by the roots. Be careful and don’t over fertilize!!!

Expand  

So if I read this correctly it's a waste of time and money for my particular needs. 

 

[GottmitAlex]

I employ both.methods. 

Monthly soil fertilizer and weekly foliar.

I just finished the weekly foliar wash.

Made in Deutschland 

 

[GottmitAlex]

[96720]

My opinion you might as well use your money as toilet paper!!!

[GottmitAlex]

  On 7/25/2022 at 2:42 AM, 96720 said:

My opinion you might as well use your money as toilet paper!!!

Expand  

I beg your pardon. Who are you addressing?

 

[Merlyn]

I've been hesitant about foliar sprays, I have some of the Southern Ag Palm Nutritional Spray but only used it a couple of times.  The Southern Ag is only micronutrients, so unless you have a specific deficiency problem with Manganese, Magnesium, or Iron then it'll be of no benefit.  Looking Glass had some good luck with it on some apparently iron-deficient plantings, where the roots may have been too soggy for too long:

 

[JLM]

  On 7/25/2022 at 8:39 AM, GottmitAlex said:

I beg your pardon. Who are you addressing?

 

Expand  

He was probably addressing @JohnAndSancho, either way the response was not the best lol

As for using sprays, i have never done it and i am interested to see where this thread goes and to see results if you do decide to use sprays.

[Looking Glass]

  On 7/25/2022 at 12:35 PM, Merlyn said:

I've been hesitant about foliar sprays, I have some of the Southern Ag Palm Nutritional Spray but only used it a couple of times.  The Southern Ag is only micronutrients, so unless you have a specific deficiency problem with Manganese, Magnesium, or Iron then it'll be of no benefit.  Looking Glass had some good luck with it on some apparently iron-deficient plantings, where the roots may have been too soggy for too long:

Expand  

I’ve had decent luck bridging iron deficiency in a few different plants and palms in the past, using foliar spraying.  But I view it as a bandaid, buying some time to fix the underlying problem.   The jury is still out, in those two palms in that thread though.   

Edited July 25, 2022 by Looking Glass

[96720]

Foliar sprays are a bandaid they don’t address the problem the problem is a soil problem or a root problem that is what should be addressed!!!

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 7/25/2022 at 2:42 AM, 96720 said:

My opinion you might as well use your money as toilet paper!!!

Expand  

I only use credit and debit so that would be awkward. 

[96720]

You get what I mean it’s a waste of money!!!

[GottmitAlex]

  On 7/25/2022 at 3:28 PM, 96720 said:

You get what I mean it’s a waste of money!!!

Expand  

Ok.  

 

[Tomas]

The Fertilon fertlizer contains only microelements and the foliar application is recomended, because only small quantities are needed, while the foliar uptake of the macronutrients NPK is too limited for the needs of a palm. The best nitrogen source for foliar application is urea I think

Tomas

[GottmitAlex]

Two months doing it. (Foliar) Every 7 days. 

It's all palmgain, salt and fertilon combi 2.

 

Lik the Cole Porter song says: " Anything goes". One tries anything. 

 

 

 

 

[GottmitAlex]

OMG! It's Saturday. Had to foliar "spray" my palms. All of them 

 

[GottmitAlex]

Waste of dough.... Yup.... 

[GottmitAlex]

Don't know what to think of this!

 

My baby pacific golden tall!!

 It has the foliar spray virus!

 

 

OMG.. the big ones have acquired the virus!

 

[GottmitAlex]

The oldest one?: 

 

Good luck with that in our climate.

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 8/2/2022 at 2:02 AM, GottmitAlex said:

Don't know what to think of this!

 

My baby pacific golden tall!!

 It has the foliar spray virus!

 

Expand  

My salty brother - I can grab a sprayer from work. When I started this post, I wasn't clear but I was specifically questioning Southern Ag brand foliar spray. I see what you're doing with different products and I see how good your palms are doing. So, allow me to follow up. I have a variety of potted palms ranging from seedlings to an 8 foot queen. What would you recommend for me to mix into what is actually an Ecolab housekeeping mister for my patio palms to get them a deeper green in the intense and seemingly endless SE TX heat? 

 

I hope this doesn't sound sarcastic - I miss the deep dark green and I'm totally not digging the lime green shit I'm seeing in most of my patio squad. 

[96720]

You want green you need iron I use kerex super iron chelate and don’t use it sparely move them off the concrete or any other surface you don’t want stained use it liberally and in two weeks green green green!! Remember don’t let it get on any surface you don’t want stained that means move it into the dirt each time you water it!!

[Collectorpalms]

  On 8/2/2022 at 2:08 AM, JohnAndSancho said:

My salty brother - I can grab a sprayer from work. When I started this post, I wasn't clear but I was specifically questioning Southern Ag brand foliar spray. I see what you're doing with different products and I see how good your palms are doing. So, allow me to follow up. I have a variety of potted palms ranging from seedlings to an 8 foot queen. What would you recommend for me to mix into what is actually an Ecolab housekeeping mister for my patio palms to get them a deeper green in the intense and seemingly endless SE TX heat? 

 

I hope this doesn't sound sarcastic - I miss the deep dark green and I'm totally not digging the lime green shit I'm seeing in most of my patio squad. 

Expand  

Chelated Iron, like the products I recommend will fix the next set of fronds, but more importantly adjusting the PH to 5.8 your palms will be able to absorb Iron more readily. Tap water here is 8.7, no way for plants to absorb Iron in soil. Its a science, but easy to fix for potted plants.

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 8/2/2022 at 2:51 AM, Collectorpalms said:

Chelated Iron, like the products I recommend will fix the next set of fronds, but more importantly adjusting the PH to 5.8 your palms will be able to absorb Iron more readily. Tap water here is 8.7, no way for plants to absorb Iron in soil. Its a science, but easy to fix for potted plants.

Expand  

Coolsies coolsies. And this will work with a misting sprayer I can "borrow" from work?

[JohnAndSancho]

Bump since everything seems to be turning yellow now. I didn't have this issue last year, but it also rained a lot last year....and my palms are bigger now and need more nutrients. 

 

So since the liquid chelated stuff will stain everything green, and I am in an apartment - I found some granulated stuff at the orange big box store called Dr. Iron. Would this be good enough? Should I go ahead and start mixing this into my bucket of premixed soil that I keep on hand for repottings? 

 

@GottmitAlex is there something US produced similar to what you're spraying with?

 

Shot in the dark but I've just read in another thread that fertilizer should be used less in intense heat.... It's been just a little hot and dry here - thoughts from the experts? I have dosed everything with Carl Pool twice this year and I was watering with diluted fish emulsion every other watering until maybe a couple weeks ago when I ran out. 

[Merlyn]

Southern Ag makes a liquid chelated iron, I think it's intended for foliar spray.  I haven't tried it myself.  I think I got confused by some pages saying chelated...and some not saying anything about chelated...  I think Sonoranfans posted this photo earlier, which may explain why you are having iron problems.  If your water is high pH then iron is not very available.  Adding a lot of iron to the soil doesn't help a whole lot, so maybe foliar is a good choice:

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 8/9/2022 at 12:19 AM, Merlyn said:

Southern Ag makes a liquid chelated iron, I think it's intended for foliar spray.  I haven't tried it myself.  I think I got confused by some pages saying chelated...and some not saying anything about chelated...  I think Sonoranfans posted this photo earlier, which may explain why you are having iron problems.  If your water is high pH then iron is not very available.  Adding a lot of iron to the soil doesn't help a whole lot, so maybe foliar is a good choice:

Expand  

I read reviews of Southern Ag  plus @96720's comments about the liquid spray staining everything green. I live in an upstairs apartment so I'm pretty sure that's a bad idea. 

 

I didn't have this problem last year, and my indoor plants are fine. It's just all the stuff that's been sitting in the heat. I mean, in fairness it rained a lot more last year so I watered outdoors less, but my outdoor palms get the same filtered tap water my indoor palms get. The only difference is I keep my apartment between 65-70 degrees and outdoors it's been like 30-35 degrees higher. 

 

My spindle, c. Plumosa, Washie, and baby strap leaf B. Alfreidii look great. Everything else is getting yellow splotches. 

[Merlyn]

  On 8/9/2022 at 12:32 AM, JohnAndSancho said:

My spindle, c. Plumosa, Washie, and baby strap leaf B. Alfreidii look great. Everything else is getting yellow splotches. 

Expand  

Typically iron causes new spears to be very pale or yellow-green, so if your main issue is yellow splotches I wouldn't bother with iron.  It seems like a foliar spray would be a pain unless you feel like putting down dropcloth over plastic to absorb overspray, or carry them all down to a yard area to spray them.  Your splotch issues are most likely related to potassium, manganese, or magnesium, all of which are reasonably easy to supplement in the soil.

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 8/9/2022 at 1:10 PM, Merlyn said:

Typically iron causes new spears to be very pale or yellow-green, so if your main issue is yellow splotches I wouldn't bother with iron.  It seems like a foliar spray would be a pain unless you feel like putting down dropcloth over plastic to absorb overspray, or carry them all down to a yard area to spray them.  Your splotch issues are most likely related to potassium, manganese, or magnesium, all of which are reasonably easy to supplement in the soil.

Expand  

Maybe I misspoke with the word "splotch," as my c. Benezeii looks awful. This is a frond that opened up March-ish. As I look at my other palms and dig into palmipedia I am kind of under the impression that this particular, expensive palm is not digging the heat but I'm not a scientist and I - please, somebody, anybody, everybody correct me if I'm wrong but if I were to buy some chelated iron and sul-po-mag and add diluted amounts to every other watering for my potted palms, it shouldn't be harmful. 

 

Right? Right?

[Merlyn]

I'm far from an expert on palms in pots, or on C. Benezii...which I hadn't heard of until today.  My guess based on that photo is too hot, too dry.  Potassium might help, but the dead leaf ends seems like underwatering. 

[96720]

Looks like sun burn and have you checked for spider mites 

[Darold Petty]

Merlyn,  Chamaedorea benziei is now C. carchensis.   

[rprimbs]

I think the best use of foliar spray is for citrus. The "Asian greening" disease messes up the flow of nutrients from the roots, so a foliar spray helps tremendously.  In that case Keyplex is the best brand. 

[JohnAndSancho]

  On 8/10/2022 at 11:52 AM, Merlyn said:

I'm far from an expert on palms in pots, or on C. Benezii...which I hadn't heard of until today.  My guess based on that photo is too hot, too dry.  Potassium might help, but the dead leaf ends seems like underwatering. 

Expand  

It's def been hot and dry.... I've been misting it nightly and watering it every other day, half a gallon or so. It's still in the 5g nursery pot and nursery soil so it drains well. 

 

  On 8/10/2022 at 2:45 PM, 96720 said:

Looks like sun burn and have you checked for spider mites 

Expand  

 

It's pretty well shaded on my patio. It's right up against the apartment. I see no bugs on it - I think @Merlyn's thoughts make the most sense. In habitat, these things aren't used to seeing endless 100 degree days with 40% humidity. 

 

  On 8/10/2022 at 2:53 PM, Darold Petty said:

Merlyn,  Chamaedorea benziei is now C. carchensis.   

Expand  

 

Good to know. Thanks Darold. 

[JohnAndSancho]

Welp I went all in. I bought chelated iron, a humic acid/seaweed blend, and some copper fungicide just because I've got a cat palm that was turning black and bubbled like crazy with peroxide. And some more fish fertilizer. So, Stink Water 2.0? 

[D Palm]

I’ve used foil at spray to correct my Valencia Orange with great success. I also use it on my Pindo palms (in addition to granulars and spikes).  This palm is super common in my area. Mine has a fat trunk about 8-9 feet tall with fronds that weep all the way to the ground.

I have seen almost no other pindo in my county with fronds below the 3&9 position that aren’t wilted. If you spray at high noon, will probably have less of an affect than at dusk. It also currently has a ton of fruit with about 200 more on the ground rotting away. Probably the most healthy Pindo I have ever seen in person.

i would say it’s a great “add-on” or “extra” but not an “only use” option.

Chleated Iron is also great - do not mix on pavers, concrete, Etc.