Trachycarpus Takil, Anyone?

[MRB1192]

Hey All - 

I picked up the palm below last weekend from a local nursery. It was labeled Trachycarpus Takil. The gentleman who sold it to me said it is more than likely Trachycarpus Nanital, which I'm equally excited about because I'm looking forward to one day having a beefy Trachy. 

Curious if anyone out there actually has a true, mature Takil? From my conversation with the seller of my palm, he was saying he thinks most (if not all) specimens marketed as Takil do not actually end up being Takil. 

[Chester B]

Your palm is a nainital.   I have one too which isn't a bad thing at all, they are very impressive palms.  That frond on the lower right corner is a dead giveaway.  I bet that frond is stiff life plastic and deeply ribbed unlike a fortunei.  I planted mine out a few weeks back.

I do have one sold to me as Takil that came from Cistus a few years back but now they are thinking it probably isn't one.  I personally think its a "princeps green" or also known as "nova".  I have seen some of their adult specimens and that seems to be the best match.  The one I have is only about 4' overall height but does not resemble a typical fortunei.

Real Takil are so hard to find and I think most of us have never actually seen a real one before, so have little to compare to.  

Gary Gragg down in the Bay area, seems like he has some

 

There is one in Washington:

 

[Jimhardy]

I agree its probably Nainital but there are a lot of true Takil out there

thanks in part to our friends in Europe,they have been available for a while now(maybe 10 years)

in the correct form but you do have to do your research to make sure you know what you are getting.

Seeds have been available for a while and one of the differences in Fortunei and Nainital is that as

seedlings Takil is a 2 ridger and Fortunei/Nainital has 4 ridges on the first "leaf".

I do recall watching that video recently and I do believe he has the right palm there.

I don't recall if he talks about the ligules or not????

I have a small one out in the garden

 

[Ben G.]

2 minutes ago, Jimhardy said:

I agree its probably Nainital but there are a lot of true Takil out there

thanks in part to our friends in Europe,they have been available for a while now(maybe 10 years)

in the correct form but you do have to do your research to make sure you know what you are getting.

Seeds have been available for a while and one of the differences in Fortunei and Nainital is that as

seedlings Takil is a 2 ridger and Fortunei/Nainital has 4 ridges on the first "leaf".

I do recall watching that video recently and I do believe he has the right palm there.

I don't recall if he talks about the ligules or not????

I have a small one out in the garden

 

I certainly not an expert either Jim, but I have three small trachycapus from a reputable source that are supposed to be takil. Tighter fiber on the trunk and shorter ligules are two characteristics that are supposed to be indicative of takil. Mine are fairly small still, but they seem to all hold true to the tight fiber and short ligule description.

[Chester B]

1 hour ago, Ben OK said:

I certainly not an expert either Jim, but I have three small trachycapus from a reputable source that are supposed to be takil. Tighter fiber on the trunk and shorter ligules are two characteristics that are supposed to be indicative of takil. Mine are fairly small still, but they seem to all hold true to the tight fiber and short ligule description.

Unfortunately these characteristics are not exclusive to takil so I wouldn’t be using them as the primary methods of identification. 
 

Nainital - tight fibers and ligules but this is a small specimen. 

[Chester B]

My other one sold as Takil which I’m thinking is actually princeps green/nova. Neat fibers and no ligules yet  

 

 

[Jimhardy]

You can see the same features in Manipur and Oreophilus,maybe Nanus...I don't remember and my

Princeps is not mature enough to tell- my Latisectus also has tight fibers on the trunk BUT 100%

Naintal DOES NOT have these features.

Also,any small palm like that (Trachycarpus)can have "tight" fibers because it hasn't been around long

enough for them to tatter.

Edited July 9, 2022 by Jimhardy

[Jimhardy]

Chester

That second one is interesting, tight fibers but hiding behind a petiole

is a stretched out ligule...so,very interesting palm for sure...is it getting pretty much full sun?

It also appears to be getting some heavy fluff (tomentum) near the top of the trunk so really a fascinating palm

for sure...do you recall where you got it?  There is a place in San Fran area (I think) called Golden Gate palms

and they do have some large Takil they got seeds from but unfortunately (literally) un-Fortunei-ately haha

there may have been(and was)  some cross pollination there----bummer!

[BeyondTheGarden]

I'm guessing you got that from Raintree?

[RJ]

My takil grew sideways for awhile. Princeps didn’t do that at all for me. None of the ones pictured here look like the takil I have . 

[Las Palmas Norte]

2 hours ago, RJ said:

My takil grew sideways for awhile. Princeps didn’t do that at all for me. None of the ones pictured here look like the takil I have

My T. ukhrulensis is growing rather obliquely in a 15 gal. pot.

[Jimhardy]

8 hours ago, RJ said:

My takil grew sideways for awhile. Princeps didn’t do that at all for me. None of the ones pictured here look like the takil I have . 

Except for the one in Gary's video...

 

Also...I have seen the SFH trait, curved trunk or tromboning in every Trachy (although not as common in Princes etc)

except Martianus and Latisectus...maybe also Geminisectus (but I have only grown one of those)

[RJ]

3 hours ago, Jimhardy said:

Except for the one in Gary's video...

 

Also...I have seen the SFH trait, curved trunk or tromboning in every Trachy (although not as common in Princes etc)

except Martianus and Latisectus...maybe also Geminisectus (but I have only grown one of those)

Wasn’t counting Gary’s video, I’ve seen them before so honestly didn’t click on them 

I’ve  seen other trachy  creep as well,   none have to the extent of my takil . 
 

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by RJ

[N8ALLRIGHT]

Here's my lil' creeper,he took it on the chin this winter. Got him from Phil,all the fronds got fried these are the new ones from this season, maybe 4 or 5 by the end of the season? Need to up my protection game, still he's tough

[WSimpson]

I have a Nainital that was sold as a Takil . Very robust palm . I want to get a Takil . I wish I had years ago , but it's hard to know what you are getting .

Will

 

Nainital below :

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Will Simpson

[Jimhardy]

It would seem the only way to be sure would have been to get seeds and see if they

come up with the skinny long first 2 ridger leaf or 4 like Four-tunei.

On small palms its hard to tell the features for a while until they grow up

and get tomentum etc.....my Manipur is a serious side winder too and I think the

Oreophilus out there in the garden is the same if I recall correctly.

[WSimpson]

Thanks Jim .

I would hope that by now  , with more mature plants around , that there should be respectable places that could assure buyers of what they are getting . I really missed the chance when PDN was selling them . I trust them to sell me the real deal . 

Will

[Fallen Munk]

I got one from Raintree labeled as takil.  Pretty sure it's nainital. 

[Jimhardy]

hopefully this link works...great pics of the correct "ligules" and of the fiber of select Trachys.

 

http://159.89.159.153/pages/orientation/palmate-ligule.html

[NWpalms@206]

True takil (Gary gragg original source)… stiffer, deeper, evenly divided, glaucous backs… but the most identifiable feature, is the fuzz/tomentum that froths out of the crown, also has spikes/teeth on base of petials. Overall more erect, with bigger fronds. As well as the sideways trunk growth, and much tighter trunk fibers. This is compared to fortunei as just by my own observations. I have multiple all displaying same traits. 

[Jimhardy]

Nice!

[WSimpson]

17 hours ago, Jimhardy said:

hopefully this link works...great pics of the correct "ligules" and of the fiber of select Trachys.

 

http://159.89.159.153/pages/orientation/palmate-ligule.html

Thanks Jim .

That was informative  . 

Will

[Luis Arroyo]

On 7/8/2022 at 1:07 PM, MRB1192 said:

Hey All - 

I picked up the palm below last weekend from a local nursery. It was labeled Trachycarpus Takil. The gentleman who sold it to me said it is more than likely Trachycarpus Nanital, which I'm equally excited about because I'm looking forward to one day having a beefy Trachy. 

Curious if anyone out there actually has a true, mature Takil? From my conversation with the seller of my palm, he was saying he thinks most (if not all) specimens marketed as Takil do not actually end up being Takil. 

Your palm is most likely  Fortunei var. Nainital.

Takil seedlings have very long narrow "V" shaped fronds when young. Not the attractive bonsai look of Wagnerianus & Nainital. Here's my Trachycarpus Takil