Supremely Sabal!

[MarkbVet]

Here's a sampling of various Sabal palms that I've recently obtained.  Most should be hardy here in zone 8.   I've re-potted into larger pots when they arrived; awaiting warmer weather and sun to make 'em grow!   Hopefully these pics will post in correct sequence, with close up of name and then pic of whole plant.  Two w/o visible names are Sabal palmetto var. "lisa" (tall, thick/fused leaves), and S. minor (last pic).  

[NCFM]

Will be interesting to see which does best for you there in the PNW.  Keep us posted!

[BeyondTheGarden]

I'm green with envy

[Las Palmas Norte]

Some real beauties there!

[MarkbVet]

45 minutes ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

Some real beauties there!

Hoping they show some growth while in pots the next 3 years... can't wait to get them in the ground eventually!

[RJ]

I have found the real kicker for sabal growth is warm nights. Here when we see the nights stay above 65-70 they really kick in. Not sure if you ever get that up in the PNW or not but that’s at least my experiences. That and ample water. 

[teddytn]

8 hours ago, MarkbVet said:

Hoping they show some growth while in pots the next 3 years... can't wait to get them in the ground eventually!

Those will be absolute monsters in 3 years!

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

1 hour ago, teddytn said:

Those will be absolute monsters in 3 years!

Sabals don't grow too fast in the PNW like @RJ they really love those warm nights 

T J 

[steve617]

Very nice

[WSimpson]

There's a Minor up on Salt Spring Island near Vancouver and it is interesting  to see it , but it never seems to get any bigger every time a new picture is posted of it . I haven't seen a picture of it in several years so maybe it kicked into gear . 

You are further south so you should have better success there . Keep us posted on how well they do .

Will

Edited March 28, 2022 by Will Simpson

[Chester B]

4 hours ago, RJ said:

I have found the real kicker for sabal growth is warm nights. Here when we see the nights stay above 65-70 they really kick in. Not sure if you ever get that up in the PNW or not but that’s at least my experiences. That and ample water. 

This is what I think is going on as well.  I feel like when we get warm nights you really see the difference.  Generally speaking in summer our nights are in the upper 50s and low 60s, but this seems to be shifting and like last summer most nights in the 60's and many close to 70. 

Now that I have Sabal seedlings growing inside my house they have been growing at a pretty good pace.  The room they are in stays pretty warm - around 70 at night and upper 70s during the day.  So I plan to grow them inside as long as possible before they get planted.  I find the bigger they are the better they grow in my climate.

[Chester B]

@MarkbVet I really like the look of that bermudana.  But I am very interested to see how quickly the mexacana grows.

Great looking palms.

[MarkbVet]

3 hours ago, Will Simpson said:

There's a Minor up on Salt Spring Island near Vancouver and it is interesting  to see it , but it never seems to get any bigger every time a new picture is posted of it . I haven't seen a picture of it in several years so maybe it kicked into gear . 

You are further south so you should have better success there . Keep us posted on how well they do .

Will

Most of the ones I picked were in part because they grow faster than S. minor... but heat, water, fertilizer will be key factors.  Not sure they'll grow great until they're in the ground in So. Oregon in a few years... it's hotter/sunnier there, and even though it's dry (so temps drop at night) it still will be warm enough in the day time to avoid really cool nights.   Should be better weather for these than in the Portland area where I'm at now.    For now, I'll try to keep them happy and take what growth I can get. At least they're not seedlings! 

[MarkbVet]

6 hours ago, teddytn said:

Those will be absolute monsters in 3 years!

Oh I hope so... but yeah, here their growth tends to be slower,  will take anything I can get.   Lots of heat 'n water in summer, we'll see what the next 6 months does for them. 

[Fallen Munk]

7 hours ago, teddytn said:

Those will be absolute monsters in 3 years!

Haha!  I've got a Sabal minor that has been pushing the same leaf for two seasons.

[teddytn]

17 minutes ago, Fallen Munk said:

Haha!  I've got a Sabal minor that has been pushing the same leaf for two seasons.

That’s insane! Lol 

[teddytn]

2 hours ago, MarkbVet said:

Oh I hope so... but yeah, here their growth tends to be slower,  will take anything I can get.   Lots of heat 'n water in summer, we'll see what the next 6 months does for them. 

I just checked your summer temps. I don’t know why I assumed you were farther south.  Might have been all your agaves and yuccas!!! I’ll partially amend my statement. They’ll be junior monsters by then lol. If you can get those black pots in full sun it’s game over, the soil temps in the pot will far surpass soil temps in ground much further south. You’ve clearly got a green thumb!! 

[teddytn]

@everyone I like a good gentleman’s bet. If @MarkbVet will oblige us and give us an update at the end of the season. I’ll bet 2 new leaves for all except the minor, 1 new leaf for that. Bermudana may have an edge there too

[Fallen Munk]

1 hour ago, teddytn said:

That’s insane! Lol 

Yes it is.  My Jubaea has tripled in size since then and I'm hoping that S. minor frond finally opens this year.

[Chester B]

My minors do 2.5-3 fronds per year in ground.  Most other Sabals about the same so I'm not seeing a big difference. 

Lousiana so far is a slow one for me,  they probably do 1-1.5/year.  I know its not typical of what most people report.

One uresana I have does 1 frond per year (in ground 2 summers), the other which I only planted last year did 3.  Not sure what's up with that.

This year, will be year 3 for many of the Sabals I have so hopefully some good growth.

Two more new ones for me to go in the ground this year.

Pic 1 Sabal rosei

 

 

Sabal Birmingham

Edited March 29, 2022 by Chester B

[MarkbVet]

3 hours ago, teddytn said:

@everyone I like a good gentleman’s bet. If @MarkbVet will oblige us and give us an update at the end of the season. I’ll bet 2 new leaves for all except the minor, 1 new leaf for that. Bermudana may have an edge there too

Sure thing!  

[MarkbVet]

13 hours ago, RJ said:

I have found the real kicker for sabal growth is warm nights. Here when we see the nights stay above 65-70 they really kick in. Not sure if you ever get that up in the PNW or not but that’s at least my experiences. That and ample water. 

Agreed!  We're not hot/humid in general when you get west of the Rockies... so night temps will drop.  Having the Sabals in a summer greenhouse (I'm debating) can allow for warmer/humid nights... whereas my Jubaea and Brahea type plants will probably be outside in full sun/drier conditions in summer.  I'll be getting a small greenhouse for over-wintering anyway, so might try the Sabals in it all year.  Likely will experiment with some in, and some outside, and compare growth rates ('cause that's how I roll!).  

[BeyondTheGarden]

I've found that there seems to be an inverse correlation between heat and humidity.  During summer, the greenhouse will stay about 10 degrees warmer than ambient air temp (with vents open and a fan running), but the humidity drops down below 30%, when it's ~60% outside.   This summer, I'm going to see if shade cloth will help rectify this.  Maybe if the vents don't open so much the humidity will stay higher.  

Even without vents and fans, the temp sensor hanging on a Syagrus, on the SW wall of my house facing the sun, the temps will be several degrees hotter than the temp sensor located back in the woods.  But humidity is lower.  I still don't have a good grasp of this yet.  

[MarkbVet]

3 hours ago, Jesse PNW said:

I've found that there seems to be an inverse correlation between heat and humidity.  During summer, the greenhouse will stay about 10 degrees warmer than ambient air temp (with vents open and a fan running), but the humidity drops down below 30%, when it's ~60% outside.   This summer, I'm going to see if shade cloth will help rectify this.  Maybe if the vents don't open so much the humidity will stay higher.  

Even without vents and fans, the temp sensor hanging on a Syagrus, on the SW wall of my house facing the sun, the temps will be several degrees hotter than the temp sensor located back in the woods.  But humidity is lower.  I still don't have a good grasp of this yet.  

Humidity (and temp) readings can be affected by various factors, including air movement, sun hitting the sensors, etc.  For readings to be accurate, the gauges need to be in total shade and not in a direct air current/draft.    Direct sun hitting the thermometer will give us falsely high temp readings every time, and may also dry out a humidity gauge.  Moving air increases evaporation, which depending on how the humidity gauge works, may cause lower readings.   In a greenhouse, lots of venting will tend to cause lower humidity levels (you're releasing the hot/humid air to the outside); closed structures will have higher humidity (provided there's a source of moisture within the habitat-- such as open containers of water, a spray misting device, etc).   The challenge (as you alluded to) is having a greenhouse closed enough in summer to promote more humidity, without it being excessively hot.    

[MarkbVet]

18 hours ago, Chester B said:

My minors do 2.5-3 fronds per year in ground.  Most other Sabals about the same so I'm not seeing a big difference. 

Lousiana so far is a slow one for me,  they probably do 1-1.5/year.  I know its not typical of what most people report.

One uresana I have does 1 frond per year (in ground 2 summers), the other which I only planted last year did 3.  Not sure what's up with that.

This year, will be year 3 for many of the Sabals I have so hopefully some good growth.

Two more new ones for me to go in the ground this year.

Pic 1 Sabal rosei

 

 

Sabal Birmingham

Nice S. rosei!   Interested to see how hardy it is here.   Birmingham may grow reallly slowly....  good luck with these!

[oasis371]

Bermudana is my very favorite Sabal, you won't be disappointed. Actually, the ONLY palm native to Bermuda, every other one was brought in, sometimes at great expense, because some people need to see coconut palms for some reason.

 

 

 

Edited March 29, 2022 by oasis371

[Alex Zone 5]

Man I'm really jealous of that Bermunada, these are impossible to find....I do have one that is rather rare sabal Cherokee.  

Yeah to report on these later this year. Thanks

[MarkbVet]

What does Cherokee look like?   Have to look that one up...  

[Sabal King]

Great collection.  I have about 200+ Sabals (many of the ones you have posted here) planted, and adding many more this year.  Like your collection, and really wish more people planted Sabals, especially the many dozens of Minors that are available..

[Alex Zone 5]

18 hours ago, MarkbVet said:

What does Cherokee look like?   Have to look that one up...  

Looks like any other Sabal it's said to be as hardy as mc curtain. Mine is only a few straps so far. I believe it's a minor just from another ecotype..

[MarkbVet]

2 hours ago, Alex Zone 5 said:

Looks like any other Sabal it's said to be as hardy as mc curtain. Mine is only a few straps so far. I believe it's a minor just from another ecotype..

Yes it's a variety of Sabal minor that grows in Cherokee County in northeastern Alabama. In what is a USDA zone 7b location, according to the latest USDA plant hardiness map, temperatures have dropped as low as -24°C (-11°F).  It's in the northernmost part of S. minor's natural range.  The assumption is that this makes these plants very cold hardy.  Otherwise they seem to resemble other S. minors, as you said.   But it's likely a winner and will be hardy for you!!   :-)

[Sabal King]

I just planted a S. Rosei a few weeks ago and actually given the size of yours I think we got some of our sabals from the same source!  Curious to see how it does for you over by you.. I've got 4x S. Lisa, 2x S. Bermudana, 2x. S. Uresana and a whole lot more but that is what's in Sabal Row over here.  I'm hoping the S. Rosei can do well long-term here.  I don't know of anyone else around me that has one.  It is rated as a zone 8a palm, so here's hoping!

I've also actually put a S. Causarium in the ground last spring and mine came from genetics that handled 12F for multiple hours.  We had a very icy, cold, and lousy year and it brown a bit on the strap leaves, BUT the middle spear is rocking and rolling and moving very quickly, and it's green so I am thrilled.  We can never predict a deep freeze like we got two winters ago, but by and large for our zone, I think everything I have will do just fine in the long run.  Keep u posted.

[MarkbVet]

11 hours ago, tlow said:

I just planted a S. Rosei a few weeks ago and actually given the size of yours I think we got some of our sabals from the same source!  Curious to see how it does for you over by you.. I've got 4x S. Lisa, 2x S. Bermudana, 2x. S. Uresana and a whole lot more but that is what's in Sabal Row over here.  I'm hoping the S. Rosei can do well long-term here.  I don't know of anyone else around me that has one.  It is rated as a zone 8a palm, so here's hoping!

I've also actually put a S. Causarium in the ground last spring and mine came from genetics that handled 12F for multiple hours.  We had a very icy, cold, and lousy year and it brown a bit on the strap leaves, BUT the middle spear is rocking and rolling and moving very quickly, and it's green so I am thrilled.  We can never predict a deep freeze like we got two winters ago, but by and large for our zone, I think everything I have will do just fine in the long run.  Keep u posted.

I've got S. uresana too, just didn't get a pic because it's got one rather scraggly leaf... it's trying to push another one out, maybe by this spring/summer it will look better.  Definitely bluish though!    I don't have a S. rosei; that pic was from @Chester B.    I might try one at some point, especially if it survives for him lol (we live in same area).   :-)