Burying pots in ground?

[chad2468emr]

Hi all - 

I’ve always heard this mentioned from time to time around here as a thing people suggest periodically, but I wondered if anyone had any real experience doing it. Did a quick search and couldn’t find any real info outside of a brief mention here or there.

I’m moving into a rental home with a yard as I’ve mentioned a few times (this is undoubtedly NOT be the last question I ask because of it haha) and I wanted to know if burying pots would be way for me to have palms at least LOOK like they’re in-ground but not require me to leave them behind when I leave the rental. I obsessively monitor drainage and soil moisture in my potted palms, and worry that burying in-ground would limit their ability to dry out as fast since the sides of the pots wouldn’t get heat from the sun. I also have 99% of my palms in terra cotta because it wicks moisture from the bottom of the pot and eliminates the perched water table. I feel like that wouldn’t happen if it was in ground and I worry about the physics of it draining if there is more soil or even just sand outside the drainage hole. Does that mean I should put a layer of turface or gravel at the bottom of the hole? Or would that just combine to make standing water + gravel in the hole? Total shot in the dark, but I imagine the soil is likely sand-based where I’m moving if it helps.

Has anyone ever done this successfully? Thoughts? Tips? 

[Silas_Sancona]

Biggest potential issue i'd b concerned with in doing this is the plants rooting into the ground..  esp. there in FL. 

Had this happen to several things myself when i lived there ..and that's from just having stuff sit on top of the soil.  Ants / settling after the rainy season managed to bury a couple things a couple inches deeper and i was surprised at how much -and how quickly- those things had " rooted in " when i went to prep them when moving again.  Would see the same thing w/ any plant material that sat in place for 6+ months at the nursery i worked for also.

Water will go through the soil regardless if buried or not, esp in the sandy soil there..

One thing that might help ( emphasis might.  ..Might actually accelerate root development into the soil ) would be to put a thick layer of gravel ( say 1" -1"+ sized stone ) in the base of the holes  ..and check your plants constantly.

This is perhaps the worst part of having plant collections, and renting  -until you have your own place to plant out stuff..  You want it to keep growing / look good / stay healthy.. but life in a pot only gets you -and the plants- so far.

[sonoranfans]

Naaaah, you'll end up severing lots of roots when you do remove them.  I keep weedmat under my above ground  container to prevent rooting, in ground will be worse as you will not know when the roots have rooted into the ground.  Pots in the ground will also dry cycle slower too due to less head pressure.  Better off to just upsize the pots.  I have buried pots in the ground in the past with the bottom cut out and the side slit to protect young root systems from drying out in sandy soil.  Later after the roots go out the bottom and sides, I removed the pieces.  Some cases I didnt remove the plastic pieces at all.  I worked well, the trees grew well since the bottom was cut out and the roots were free.  I dont see this as an interim method to "grow them better".  Many palms lose the whole root, from trunk to tip when you sever one, it just dies back.  Remember that fully healthy palms have a root system that is big enough to feed the leaves.  You are right though, life in a pot only gets so far.  And that is because the roots are highy underdeveloped when grown in a pot.

[Merlyn]

I thought about this a while back, but have never tried it.  Now that I know some palms are annuals at my house without protection (Chambeyronia, Cocos, L. Grandis, etc) I may think about this again.  Some palms are super-aggressive root growers (like my Gaussia Princeps seedlings), so even a reasonable sized pot would get filled and rooted into the ground really, really fast.  But maybe I'll try stepping up a generic big box store Cocos from a 2/3g into a 7g or 10g.  Then drop it into the ground and see what happens.  Maybe by late November it would fill the pot and root out into the ground...but maybe I could yank it out without too much trouble and move it to the back porch?  I'd imagine that leaving it more than a single season may end up completely rooted into the ground, and of course it wouldn't work with "root sensitive" palms like Sabals or Copernicia.

[chad2468emr]

@Silas_Sancona @sonoranfans @Merlyn

Thank you all for pretty much confirming what I was suspicious of.

Rooting into the ground was something I’d thought of as well. I have anything less than 25 gallons on one of THESE. For my palms in plant beds, they sit on top of them with the stand’s legs pressed into the sand through the bark chip mulch. My patio plants are sitting directly on top of the stands as intended since they’re over cement. I do this to prevent in ground rooting, and also to keep the pot elevated (even if just a littleee bit in the case of the 10 gal + pots) to help with drainage. That has helped, but prior to that I caught a washie rooting into the actual mulch and reaching for the sand when I went to step it up to a 25 gal  

Most of my largest palms are what I’d be wanting to bury, and most are in 15 to 25+ gallon pots at this point so it would be quite the endeavor anyway. (B. alfredii, royal, coconut, teddy, washie, bizzie, cana, more that aren’t coming to mind…) All of those are wild rooty beasts too, so I realize that’s a recipe for disaster. 

Ultimately, I’ve really gotten the hang of pot culture so far and almost everything except 1 or 2 problem children are thriving, so I think I’ll stick to what I’ve got going for a while. The only thing I’m worried about particularly are the pots killing off grass where I stick them in the yard and that bothering the landlord, though I guess a hole would do the same, haha. Maybe I’ll add some brick areas as cheaply as possible or additional plant beds in the back to space them out around on. 

Thanks again!! 

[chad2468emr]

  On 6/15/2021 at 3:31 PM, Silas_Sancona said:

This is perhaps the worst part of having plant collections, and renting  -until you have your own place to plant out stuff..  You want it to keep growing / look good / stay healthy.. but life in a pot only gets you -and the plants- so far.

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Bingo!! Haha hit the nail on the head. I’m glad I can take them with me right now and glad that I can move them around as their needs dictate, but MAN… I can’t wait to purchase a house so I can get these puppies into the soil! I’m up to 25 gallon pots for a lot of them, and they should be relatively okay for another year, but after that I may need to start getting creative…

[chad2468emr]

  On 6/15/2021 at 5:23 PM, Merlyn said:

Maybe by late November it would fill the pot and root out into the ground...but maybe I could yank it out without too much trouble and move it to the back porch?  I'd imagine that leaving it more than a single season may end up completely rooted into the ground…

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I bought a 10 gal coconut last fall and potted it up to a 17 ish gallon pot. Even through the winter (though I hauled it inside any time temps went <50°F) it managed to completely fill that pot to the point it was pushing itself up and out of it by making more roots. It now lives in a 25 gal and it will be weathering this coming winter outdoors. (Though I’m sure I’ll be protecting it) Way too heavy to move now. Coconuts are the most tempting palms to try this with, I’d imagine, but from my experience their roots grow SO fast that it isn’t sustainable. 

[Silas_Sancona]

  On 6/15/2021 at 9:00 PM, chad2468emr said:

Bingo!! Haha hit the nail on the head. I’m glad I can take them with me right now and glad that I can move them around as their needs dictate, but MAN… I can’t wait to purchase a house so I can get these puppies into the soil! I’m up to 25 gallon pots for a lot of them, and they should be relatively okay for another year, but after that I may need to start getting creative…

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I think it had been said that, for the most part,  palms can stay in a given container a little longer than some other things.. Even if this isn't the most optimal option.  At the nursery i'd worked at in Sarasota, we had numerous things that had been sitting " on the racks " -as i nicknamed some of the tree lines- for a few years.. Palms seemed happiest.  Obviously, there is a limit, ..but think you should be good for a year or two before potting up or considering another option.. 

If for some reason it takes longer than that to reach the point where you'll have somewhere you can plant them out,  can always donate to somewhere you'll be able to visit often.  Something that sits in the back of my mind w/ stuff i'm growing / will be growing before having my own place to dig.

[Merlyn]

  On 6/15/2021 at 9:04 PM, chad2468emr said:

Coconuts are the most tempting palms to try this with, I’d imagine, but from my experience their roots grow SO fast that it isn’t sustainable. 

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Yeah, that's what I was afraid of...it's probably not like a Hyophorbe that can live in a 10g pot for a decade just fine.  Maybe it might work with some Licuala, since they seem to be ok in pots for years.  At least that's been my experience with Grandis.

[Chester B]

I always considered trying pot in pot.  Bury the same size pot and then place your potted plant into it, easy to slide in and out and contains the roots.  I'm not sure how this will work though since I've never done it.  By having the pot in the ground it adds some stability to the roots from a temperature perspective and I have to assume this is a positive thing.

[iDesign]

  On 6/17/2021 at 5:39 PM, Chester B said:

I always considered trying pot in pot...

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I'm doing this with a few smaller palms, but as I'm also just experimenting I'd love to know whether it's a good idea or not.

My setup is to have the plant in an appropriate sized pot, and then that pot goes in a larger pot with gravel below the pot and on the sides. Then I bury the big pot in the ground. I'm not saying this is what you SHOULD do, as I've only recently done it and haven't yet seen the results. I also only need to have these plants in the ground for a year or so (while waiting for their final destination to be ready). I'm subscribing to this thread to learn from others whether that was a good idea or not.

[Johnny Palmseed]

I have done this numerous times and it has not worked out perfectly but it can work depending on the length of time in the spot and type of palm. As said, the roots will find a way out and I have had to basically cut the roots at the exit point and hope for the best. I have done this with other plants that have not fared well. A gardenia rooted into the ground and was so well rooted with thick, woody roots that it did not survive the transplant. My advice would be to root prune the plants occasionally in order to keep it from becoming too dependent on roots which are going to have to be removed in the future.

[96720]

They root in very quickly I like to dig a hole and set a palm in it to see how well it will do in that spot in just a few weeks it is rooted in if you were leaving it very long you may just have to leave it for the next renter 

[wimmie]

Is getting a special caveat in your rental agreement an option?

[Allen]

Stealth in ground, short pots can be buried partially in a raised bed then wood mulch or my favorite, pine needles to disguise pot.  

[rprimbs]

George Sparkman used to do it with Encephalartos that he was going to sell.  But he didn't do it with palms.  I've tried it with fruit trees in garbage cans and I now wonder if there is any real advantage to doing that.  The set back is pretty major when you eventually dig it out to move it into the ground in a permanent location.