Can't seem to green up my foxtail

[Jim in Los Altos]

My Wodyetia is gradually putting out leaf number two after being defoliated last winter. It has about six feet of trunk. I have been trying unsuccessfully to get it back to the deep green it once was but so far, no luck. Both leaves and spear are light green but otherwise healthy. I've fed rather heavily with Vigro palm and ixora food, Ironite, epsom salts, and humus/compost and it remains very light green. It gets a deep watering three times a week too.

Any ideas?

[Rusty on Pine Is.]

Jim...i have a few small foxtails that i have been trying to green up, and it takes many months to see results....and i might be off base on this, but don't  leaves discolored due to element and mineral deficiencies  stay that way, the color only improving  in the newer leaves?

[fastfeat]

Patience is a virtue; since I have none, maybe putting a little nitrate nitrogen will help green it up quicker. Don't overdo it, though, esp. to a stressed palm. Nitrates are quicker in cooler soils than urea or ammoniacal forms of nitrogen.

[Walter John]

lots of mulch and water, some manure, that'll do her.

[Johnny]

I would suggest leaving it alone until it produces one good leaf. Good meaning that it is full size - not dwarf or damaged. We sell FertaPlex (8-0-0 with minors) at our nursery that corrects this problem in a couple of days. It will not burn palms/plants if too much is used - you just end up wasting product. Call for more details.

Good Luck,

[gavilan1]

I've just got my young foxtail to survive the defoliation of January 15, having had to manually open a spear to guarantee photosynthesis (the preceding unopened 6' long spear dried out unopened).  It's now throwing a new spear which should open on its own as soon as it is out from the growth point.  I spray watered the crown twice a day to prevent dehydration (after originally treating with fungicide) and the sprinklers water it in the lawn 20 minutes a day every day.  To get the green back, I suggest lots of water, lots of ironite, and patience.  Good luck.  The good weather down here is helping, but Ironite is great at greening up anything (except your patio deck).

[ghar41]

(Jim in Los Altos @ Jul. 30 2007,03:11)

QUOTE

My Wodyetia is gradually putting out leaf number two after being defoliated last winter. It has about six feet of trunk. I have been trying unsuccessfully to get it back to the deep green it once was but so far, no luck. Both leaves and spear are light green but otherwise healthy. I've fed rather heavily with Vigro palm and ixora food, Ironite, epsom salts, and humus/compost and it remains very light green. It gets a deep watering three times a week too.

Any ideas?

Hey Jim!

Glad to hear your Wodeyetia made it through the winter.  Mine made it through January just fine, but by April...it was toast, maybe there was a slight possibility it was alive...but it looks so brutal I'm just not content to have it put out one or two weak fronds...before confronting winter again..

I've tried many here over the years, and have come to some conclusions.  This is based only on my experience here in the central valley.

Wodeyetia has been characterised as a "dry subtropical palm," based on the climatic conditions of it's remote habitat in Austrailia.  Further more, it's soil conditions have been described as decomposed granite, which likely is not heavy in organic material, and warms quickly.  These conditions differ greatly from my area, as I am cold, wet and foggy in the winter...with 12 feet of cold, moisture retaining sandy loam.  IMHO THE ROOTS ROT REGUALARLY HERE, THEN THE PALM SPENDS THE WARM SEASON TRYING TO RECOVER...it's a slow death.

I'm wondering if this could possibly be the case to some degree in your area...although your soil is likely more condusive to winter warming?  Would it be possible to treat the roots in a safe manner (rot or no rot.)?

I've seen many in collections.  The LA area foxtails haven't impressed me a great deal at all...maybe I'm just not seeing the right ones.  The most healthy looking ones I've seen are on the island of Oahu and on the Big Island of Hawaii.... then to a lesser degree some that I've seen in the San Diego area.

Good luck!  I still hold out hope that someone will solve both the Wodeyetia and the Roystonea mysteries here in Northern California and grow these species successfully.  You are certainly in the drivers seat with both.

Oh by the way....could you post a pic?

[iwan]

(ghar41 @ Jul. 31 2007,06:03)

QUOTE

Good luck!  I still hold out hope that someone will solve both the Wodeyetia and the Roystonea mysteries here in Northern California and grow these species successfully.  You are certainly in the drivers seat with both.

Four of my six in 15g pots of cactus mix are toast (trunks collapsed) and the other two have greenish spears that aren't moving.  They saw 30F in my garage during the big freeze.  One odd morning of 28F pretty much defoliated them a few weeks after the big freeze.  They looked alive until the temps warmed (as Glenn described).

I don't think I will subject my 1g seedlings to a similar fate.  Time to send them to a warmer home.

[tanetahi]

It was never going to be easy, trying to grow a tropical palm from a hot coastal area of north Queensland (Cape Melville, 14° S), in warm-temperate north California, but on top of that, Wodyetia bifurcata is nutritionally particularly temperamental - even here, a few hundred kilometres south of its natural habitat. It can thrive on both acidic, gritty granitic soils and lateritic clays ultimately derived from basaltic lava, but some soil factor often leaves it chlorotic, irrespective of the soil type. Here are three shots of them around Mareeba that I've just taken this evening, showing a range of shades of yellow through to deep green. In plenty of cases you can see bright yellow ones in a garden on one side of a road, and healthy green ones on the other side. I don't know what the cause is, but its obviously something about the soil that varies over very short distances. Caryota mitis is nearly always chlorotic here, too.

[Jeff Wilson]

Jim, I've had this problem. Let's see if memory serves. I used an Iron-Meg fertilizer loaded with minors to green one up that started putting out mottled fronds and slight yellowing on the lowermost fronds. Pretty sure this fertilizer came from Florikan in Sarasota, FL which is a SE US company....of course no help to you out west. Fairly sure it was Iron that did the trick, though. Even stained the driveway....but, you know, the palm came first, and I painted the driveway. I can't find the analysis on Florikan's website. I've never used Ironite. Why do they call it that, by the way? It does not have enough iron!!!! Well, I just went completely overboard with the Iron-Meg, things worked out, problem solved.

[ghar41]

(Jeff Wilson @ Aug. 02 2007,16:57)

QUOTE

Well, I just went completely overboard with the Iron-Meg, things worked out, problem solved.

Interesting.

Jim, Ive never treated mine for iron chlorosis or treated them heavily with minors...have you?

Also...Jeff, what does the Meg stand for in Iron-Meg?

[cfkingfish]

Yellowing of fronds are most common Potassium-Magnesium deficiencies (not frizzle top which is a Maganese deficiency). K-Mag is a Lesco? product (Pot-Magnesium) I think, but Florikan has their own version of it, I forget what it is called.

If the plant is still recovering from the freeze and is hobbling, I would use something a bit more comforting such as kelp or fish emulsion. These are low in N-P-K numbers but have micros. I tell people it is like giving vitamins to a plant as opposed to steroids. You wouldn't give children dying of starvation a cheeseburger...it works the same way.

[osideterry]

Back to the original question... "am I forgetting something?"

Only that foxtails barely make it in California except in Zone 10b. There are exceptions, but my guess is the nicest ones you see here were planted big. I'm in 10a, and I know if I were to buy 10 Florida foxtails at Home Depot, and plant them tomorrow, it would take 2-4 years for them all to die a very slow death. They would start with 5 leaves, and every year they would lose 2 leaves and add 1. Eventually they would experience 27-28F and 100% defoliate. Reviving a foxtail in 9b-10a California that has a spear and no leaves is tough.

[Jim in Los Altos]

(osideterry @ Aug. 02 2007,23:21)

QUOTE

Back to the original question... "am I forgetting something?"

Only that foxtails barely make it in California except in Zone 10b. There are exceptions, but my guess is the nicest ones you see here were planted big. I'm in 10a, and I know if I were to buy 10 Florida foxtails at Home Depot, and plant them tomorrow, it would take 2-4 years for them all to die a very slow death. They would start with 5 leaves, and every year they would lose 2 leaves and add 1. Eventually they would experience 27-28F and 100% defoliate. Reviving a foxtail in 9b-10a California that has a spear and no leaves is tough.

Osideterry,

 You're right. Every Florida grown foxtail I've tried has eventually died. All within three years. The one remaining foxtail on my property was sprouted and grown to five gallon size in SoCal. I planted it in 2001 on a south facing garage wall with concrete and flagstone near its base, probably the warmest area of my landscape. It has prospered there until last winter's freeze which toasted off all seven healthy fronds. This summer has been a mild one without much real heat (low 80s by day and low 60s at night every day) which may be a factor. I'm really hoping it has three decent fronds before cool weather in late fall sets in.

[Jose]

I would try epsom salts but you tryed that old remedy already. This is going to sound funny but I use to dig holes around my palms and dump dead fish in there. I problem with that don`t let the neighbors cat see you.

My palms loved the fish fertilizer, Just like popeye loves spinach.

[TimHopper]

Foxtails grow fast here in florida, but not until the major heat kicks in. When spring comes around, I give my foxtails a boost with foliar spray feeding because I think they are taking up very little from the roots during cool weather. I mix a custom liquid concoction of Peters fert. which has a fair amount of miors, chelated minor elements, and a little liqiud iron. I spray the foliage on all of my smaller palms from mid-april until mid-june about every 2-3 weeks. It really helps to get them greener and healthier while waiting on the benefit of warmer weather. Tim

[Jeff Wilson]

(ghar41 @ Aug. 02 2007,21:50)

QUOTE

(Jeff Wilson @ Aug. 02 2007,16:57)

QUOTE

Well, I just went completely overboard with the Iron-Meg, things worked out, problem solved.

Interesting.

Jim, Ive never treated mine for iron chlorosis or treated them heavily with minors...have you?

Also...Jeff, what does the Meg stand for in Iron-Meg?

Not exactly sure what the "meg" part stands for in Iron-Meg. Always wondered that myself. The fertilizer is basically one of Florikan's complete minors fertilizers, and was recommended to me by my friends, John and Faith Bishock as a good minors catch all type fertilizer for palms. I think it worked well, but there are so many minors in this particular fertilizer that there's no certainty as to what worked and what didn't. I sometimes use Lesco's K-Mag (Sulfate of Potash of Magnesia) as mentioned above for potassium deficiency in Cuban Copernicias ala baileyana, macroglossa...that's another issue though.  

Back to the palm on topic - Wodyetia bifurcata - I'd probably blend some K-Mag from Lesco with a minors' fertilizer with a good ratio of Iron (Fe) and Manganese sulfate. I use weird concoctions of mixes when I do find that there's a deficiency, and so far it's worked out for the best. My 5 Wodyetias have never been cold damaged yet....knock on wood....but usually if the soil's too cold from a colder than average winter and even when warmer weather comes back, you'll find some deficiencies, usually from the lack of uptake of Manganese (cold induced,) which results in stunted/dwarfed fronds, though it is always self-correcting in my experience, at least here in Florida where temp's are currently above 89F-95F for the majority of the day from May up until the first cold front in late November.

[osideterry]

I started 4 years ago with 3 foxtails from Evergreen Nursery ($60 each) and 3 from Home Depot ($40 each). The HD ones all died within 2 years. By last fall I was down to one lone survivor, pictured below. On the left is last November, on the right you see it in January. (That gigas has pushed a perfect leaf, and a long new spear after 100% defo'.) The lone foxtail's single spear pushed 6 inches, started to open, and then stopped moving for 4 months. A couple of weeks ago I pulled the spear out, and then hauled it's carcass to the curb. I would only try again of someone gave me a California grown version, and then I'd keep it in a pot.

[Davidl]

Iron was the problem with mine also. I tried everything else and nothing helped. I fertilized with regular fertilizer at the same time as adding iron. Worked good for me.osideterry that looks like cold damage and if it is california foxtails will do the same. Im not saying there might not be a difference but I dont think they will be that much more cold hardy because they are grown there.

[osideterry]

My point was more about watching them die one at a time for 4 years, just to have the last one nailed by cold. I bought 6 of them because my Betrock guide said they were fast growers. Their speed (and overall health) seems to be more determined by how much heat and humidity they get. It's the first week of August, and my daily high temps are in the low 70s. Most of the year my humidity is under 25% and can hang around 5% during a Santa Ana. I'm not sure any amount of fertilzer and micronutrients can make up for my climate.

[Davidl]

Yes I think you are right. Those conditions can not be good