Why you should not bother plant Pritchardia pacifica in FL

[redant]

Mine has been in the ground sometime before 2009/10 cold, it actually survived and I gather it will survive this year as my lowest has been around 40. This is what you get for the next several months, it will look great by October, just in time for anther clobbering. 

[palmsOrl]

I would still go for it Doug. But then I like to zone-push to the extreme.

Heck, I had an 8 foot Areca catechu in the ground in Winter Park for a couple years.  I wrapped it in layers when it got below 45F.  It was my pet project, or one of them.

[quaman58]

That's too bad, they're such a beautiful palm. So, forgive my terrible geography, but would you guys be considered South, or Central Florida?

[Steve Mac]

Mmmm, that's why I had to give my potted one away that I grew inside from seed, to a Northerner.

They do look great in Fiji. 

[bubba]

A few:

[sonoranfans]

Doug, do yoyu think its cold or too much wet? Is pacifica 10a, 10b?

[DoomsDave]

As far as I know, all of the South Pacific Pritchardtias hate California and Florida (except far far south Florida, including the Keys). Just too cold too much of the time. The Hawaiian species are a much better bet, though they're not quite as pretty. Al least what people say.

[PalmatierMeg]

I have 3 P. pacifica. They grow fast and are gorgeous half the year. But when temps fall below 50F the leaves shrivel and turn brown. Their foliage is that cold sensitive even though the palm heart takes down into the 30s. By summer they are coming back into their glory. I am tempted to cut them down but still hesitate. I have smaller P. remota and P. thurstonii that still look great in Feb.

[bubba]

One more from Key Largo:

[bubba]

The two further up are at ANS Garden/WPB. I cannot locate pictures of stunted but extremely well-maintained Pritchardia pacifica in northern Jupiter Island...

Edited February 5, 2021 by bubba
Mistake

[bubba]

One more from Lake Worth. Some have speculated that this was a Hawaiian but the tag said Pritchardia pacifica and there were numerous edgy specimens:

[redant]

19 hours ago, quaman58 said:

That's too bad, they're such a beautiful palm. So, forgive my terrible geography, but would you guys be considered South, or Central Florida?

I'm kinda the last stop on the S. Fl train I'd say, so North S. FL

[redant]

2 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

Doug, do yoyu think its cold or too much wet? Is pacifica 10a, 10b?

To cold, It's Been very dry winter. Happens every year. They are a 10b I believe

[redant]

41 minutes ago, PalmatierMeg said:

I have 3 P. pacifica. They grow fast and are gorgeous half the year. But when temps fall below 50F the leaves shrivel and turn brown. Their foliage is that cold sensitive even though the palm heart takes down into the 30s. By summer they are coming back into their glory. I am tempted to cut them down but still hesitate. I have smaller P. remota and P. thurstonii that still look great in Feb.

I have a bunch of other varieties as well and they all look fine. This one is not in a prominent location so I let it go. If it dies though I would not replace it.  Mines in deep shade so It's super slow growing.

Edited February 5, 2021 by redant

[redant]

14 minutes ago, bubba said:

One more from Lake Worth. Some have speculated that this was a Hawaiian but the tag said Pritchardia pacifica and there were numerous edgy specimens:

I live adjacent to a huge unspoiled natural area, which means I get no heat island effect. I'm always several degrees colder then even Indiantown Rd in Jupiter.

[bubba]

Some more information regarding this specimen in Palm Beach County, Fl.:

PritchardiaPacifica.pdf

[redant]

5 hours ago, bubba said:

Some more information regarding this specimen in Palm Beach County, Fl.:

PritchardiaPacifica.pdf 657.06 kB · 9 downloads

Wow a 20 year old one in caloosa, which is colder then me. That ones seen plenty of cold.

[bubba]

Bump

[Mr.SamuraiSword]

Had to make this.

[palmsOrl]

On 2/5/2021 at 12:18 PM, redant said:

To cold, It's Been very dry winter. Happens every year. They are a 10b I believe

The Bedrock's Guide to Landscape Palms (I believe this is word for word the correct title), the book I learned of this palm from as a kid, actually stated both P. Pacifica and P. thurstonii as zone 11 palms.

-Michael

[chinandega81]

So I have a question...growers are saying they get damage below 50. However, I have seen a few around Miami this winter in areas in the same microclimate as me and I know they have been in the 40s at least 10 times this winter. We have had cool days as well...yet the palms don't have any of the damage like others have shown. I'm wondering if the damaged palms in the pics saw more low 40s? On more occasions? I realize they are marginal here and in colder years I would experience the same damage as well. I certainly don't want mine to look "bad" for half of the year....well this thread bummed me out but maybe it's a good reality check.

[redant]

42 minutes ago, chinandega81 said:

So I have a question...growers are saying they get damage below 50. However, I have seen a few around Miami this winter in areas in the same microclimate as me and I know they have been in the 40s at least 10 times this winter. We have had cool days as well...yet the palms don't have any of the damage like others have shown. I'm wondering if the damaged palms in the pics saw more low 40s? On more occasions? I realize they are marginal here and in colder years I would experience the same damage as well. I certainly don't want mine to look "bad" for half of the year....well this thread bummed me out but maybe it's a good reality check.

I'm colder then those areas for sure. I'm by a huge state park so no heat island effects for me. This years damage is far worse then last year. December while not extremely cold had lots of cool/cold night

[PalmatierMeg]

I've had an 11a winter so far and see what I got from it? This species is a prime example of cold sensitivity and cool sensitivity. Why so many people who try to grow palms don't get those concepts, I don't know. Has praying to the palm fairies done anyone any good?

Like @redant's, my winter, while not bitterly cold so far, has been abnormally cool with night after night in the 40s and days in the 60s have wreaked havoc on our Pp. There is a reason why this species is hard to find in SFL. No nursery wants customers screaming in like war eagles because their summer glorious Pp look like garbage in Feb.

It doesn't bother me if someone fills his whole yard with Pp. But he should know he'll be paying for them long after Visa is paid off. If you want the proverbial FL "Perfect Yard" people who move here seek, better place the Pp in the back 40.

[redant]

23 hours ago, PalmatierMeg said:

I've had an 11a winter so far and see what I got from it? This species is a prime example of cold sensitivity and cool sensitivity. Why so many people who try to grow palms don't get those concepts, I don't know. Has praying to the palm fairies done anyone any good?

Like @redant's, my winter, while not bitterly cold so far, has been abnormally cool with night after night in the 40s and days in the 60s have wreaked havoc on our Pp. There is a reason why this species is hard to find in SFL. No nursery wants customers screaming in like war eagles because their summer glorious Pp look like garbage in Feb.

It doesn't bother me if someone fills his whole yard with Pp. But he should know he'll be paying for them long after Visa is paid off. If you want the proverbial FL "Perfect Yard" people who move here seek, better place the Pp in the back 40.

My daughter and her husband do landscape installations. My daughter being the brains of the 2, she does the designs, asked me about Pp for a customers yard. What you said is pretty much what I told her, the customer will be very unhappy come winter.

[paquicuba]

On 2/4/2021 at 12:38 PM, redant said:

Mine has been in the ground sometime before 2009/10 cold, it actually survived and I gather it will survive this year as my lowest has been around 40. This is what you get for the next several months, it will look great by October, just in time for anther clobbering. 

You're definitely doing something horribly wrong or you got a weak sport. Mine is just 5 years-old and it's 3x that size. I'm as far inland as you can get in Broward county. Last winter it went down to 37 degrees and to the low 40s this winter. Yes, my Pacifica gets some spotting on the old fronds, but I remove them in March and by June it looks phenomenal. I just took a picture of mine, like right now and it shows some top fronds with no cold damage whatsoever. The other picture is the same palm back in June 2020. 

[paquicuba]

On 2/10/2021 at 9:09 AM, chinandega81 said:

So I have a question...growers are saying they get damage below 50. However, I have seen a few around Miami this winter in areas in the same microclimate as me and I know they have been in the 40s at least 10 times this winter. We have had cool days as well...yet the palms don't have any of the damage like others have shown. I'm wondering if the damaged palms in the pics saw more low 40s? On more occasions? I realize they are marginal here and in colder years I would experience the same damage as well. I certainly don't want mine to look "bad" for half of the year....well this thread bummed me out but maybe it's a good reality check.

Mine looks amazing I would say between April and December. Last year it got infected with Palm Leaf Skeltonizer, but it had nothing to do with winter. 

[redant]

17 hours ago, paquicuba said:

You're definitely doing something horribly wrong or you got a weak sport. Mine is just 5 years-old and it's 3x that size. I'm as far inland as you can get in Broward county. Last winter it went down to 37 degrees and to the low 40s this winter. Yes, my Pacifica gets some spotting on the old fronds, but I remove them in March and by June it looks phenomenal. I just took a picture of mine, like right now and it shows some top fronds with no cold damage whatsoever. The other picture is the same palm back in June 2020. 

Mines in deep shade, which was a mistake as they clearly enjoy sun.

[paquicuba]

4 minutes ago, redant said:

Mines in deep shade, which was a mistake as they clearly enjoy sun.

Gotcha! That makes sense. They truly are sun lovers. 

Just take a look at my babies back in 2016

[chinandega81]

Just to update this thread, I planted a 3 foot Pritchardia pacifica against all advice about 1 year ago. This past winter, we had a string of 2 cold days and nights, the highs barely touched 60 for two days in a row and the lows were around 40 with wind.  One of those days was cloudy to make it worse. For reference, this was cold enough, long enough, that there were many dead iguanas in my area. Coconuts even cracked open and fell prematurely shortly after, mango flowers were aborted as were their small fruits. My Noni and Breadfruit trees had burned leaves on tender, new growth. It was the coldest I had seen in several years and a good test for cold tolerance. We are approximately one month away from the cold snap, so cold damage has had enough time to manifest.

My Pritchardia p. was planted in a full sun location, no overhead protection or any large buildings or plants to block a north wind. 

With that said, it came through with flying colors. It looks the same as it did prior to the cold spell (healthy). I have kept it well watered and fertilized consistently. It is now 4 feet tall and suffered zero burn. It has minor spotting, but it isn't overly noticeable unless you look for it. Perhaps it will become more noticeable as the fronds age.

I don't know if my tree did better due to it being young and vigorous or just dumb luck. I will see over the coming winters how it handles the cold, but it certainly seems less finnicky than other ultra tropical trees in my yard.

The other local Pritchardia p. I have observed in my area look great as well. I also saw the ones at Fairchild and they look healthy. Perhaps they have been cross bred with thrustoni to be more cold hardy? Regardless, based on what I have observed, I am optimistic that they can do quite well locally, especially considering I am in a colder part of Miami.

[DoomsDave]

On 2/9/2021 at 12:20 PM, Mr.SamuraiSword said:

Had to make this.

Ja, strong like bull! Even ven' he bathes . . . .

[DoomsDave]

On 2/10/2021 at 8:54 AM, PalmatierMeg said:

I've had an 11a winter so far and see what I got from it? This species is a prime example of cold sensitivity and cool sensitivity. Why so many people who try to grow palms don't get those concepts, I don't know. Has praying to the palm fairies done anyone any good?

Like @redant's, my winter, while not bitterly cold so far, has been abnormally cool with night after night in the 40s and days in the 60s have wreaked havoc on our Pp. There is a reason why this species is hard to find in SFL. No nursery wants customers screaming in like war eagles because their summer glorious Pp look like garbage in Feb.

It doesn't bother me if someone fills his whole yard with Pp. But he should know he'll be paying for them long after Visa is paid off. If you want the proverbial FL "Perfect Yard" people who move here seek, better place the Pp in the back 40.

Florida is almost, but not quite tropical, except maybe the Keys, from my limited observation. Hawaii still has them beat, by just a bit.

[redant]

22 hours ago, DoomsDave said:

Florida is almost, but not quite tropical, except maybe the Keys, from my limited observation. Hawaii still has them beat, by just a bit.

by a lot 

[bTL]

On 3/4/2022 at 12:33 PM, DoomsDave said:

Florida is almost, but not quite tropical, except maybe the Keys, from my limited observation. Hawaii still has them beat, by just a bit.

wrong. south florida is 1000 percent tropical. refer to all areas shaded in blue 

[Johnny Palmseed]

@bTL First of all, why are you so angry? Second, while you are correct in your statement “florida is a large state with multiple climates”, people like redant have lived here for a long time and are speaking relatively for their area. To say that south Florida is 1000 percent (what is that anyway - more than 100%?) tropical is erroneous as only a small portion is actually in the blue. And where do you draw a line of demarcation to define south Florida? Most people would probably consider Fort Myers to be south Florida but it is clearly in the green subtropical section. And areas that are blue but are adjacent to green are not immune to the effects of winter cold fronts. Hawaii has cold fronts but they are not like Florida cold fronts which are much drier and can easily pull the temps down much lower than in a state surrounded by an ocean. Just because a source has classified an area as something tropical doesn’t really mean anything other than a guideline. The statements made above regarding Hawaii having Florida beat are correct simply because the range of high/low temperatures for Hawaii are smaller than in Florida. 

[DTS]

9 minutes ago, Johnny Palmseed said:

@bTL First of all, why are you so angry? Second, while you are correct in your statement “florida is a large state with multiple climates”, people like redant have lived here for a long time and are speaking relatively for their area. To say that south Florida is 1000 percent (what is that anyway - more than 100%?) tropical is erroneous as only a small portion is actually in the blue. And where do you draw a line of demarcation to define south Florida? Most people would probably consider Fort Myers to be south Florida but it is clearly in the green subtropical section. And areas that are blue but are adjacent to green are not immune to the effects of winter cold fronts. Hawaii has cold fronts but they are not like Florida cold fronts which are much drier and can easily pull the temps down much lower than in a state surrounded by an ocean. Just because a source has classified an area as something tropical doesn’t really mean anything other than a guideline. The statements made above regarding Hawaii having Florida beat are correct simply because the range of high/low temperatures for Hawaii are smaller than in Florida. 

I'm not sure if this is true or not, but doesn't a true tropical climate never get below 32 degrees?

[flplantguy]

You need to chill out. This forum is not a confrontaltional one and if thats your style maybe find a new one?  The people here are can have their opinion on this worn out subject, anger and being nasty on here wont change that. It will just alienate you, get you blocked, or banned. Try to be less intense on the forum and you may get better results, especially about opinions from a two year old forum.  I wont have this place become what other forums have, and i dont think the major posters on here will either.  Its up to you, just a thought.

[Zeeth]

This forum is a friendly place, please try to be polite to other users. 

[kinzyjr]

We'll let the map stand and just freeze this one in time.  Our appreciation for the folks who maintained their professionalism cannot be overstated.  Posting the map was fine as it supports a different point of view.  Becoming combative, insulting, and obtuse toward other posters is not fine.  Thread locked pending further review by @PALM MOD.

[PALM MOD]

On 12/17/2024 at 12:53 PM, kinzyjr said:

We'll let the map stand and just freeze this one in time.  Our appreciation for the folks who maintained their professionalism cannot be overstated.  Posting the map was fine as it supports a different point of view.  Becoming combative, insulting, and obtuse toward other posters is not fine.  Thread locked pending further review by @PALM MOD.