Sabal sp. Tamaulipas Variability

[Glen TX]

I have seven in-ground Sabal sp. Tamaulipas, all reliably sourced.  I've noticed there is quite a bit of variability in these plants.  I live in Brazoria County, where the soil is very deep and rich, so I believe the variability I'm seeing is genetic.

Another curiosity that I've noticed...

Four of the largest and most vigorous plants have been fruiting over the past couple years.  Three of them produce fruit with large seeds, as is described for the variety.   But one plant produces a large number of small seeds, really not noticeably larger than the native Sabal minor in this area.  Oddly, this is also the only one of the plants that looks like it is starting to form any kind of trunk. 

I don't know if the small seed size means that the Sabal sp. Tamaulipas being used for seed sources are crossing with Sabal minor, or if I am just seeing natural variability within Sabal sp. Tamaulipas.

Based on some information I've seen, it sounds like Sabal sp. Tamaulipas is likely the result of a very old hybridization event between Sabal mexicana and Sabal minor, so maybe this hybrid form just has variation in its offspring.

I'm curious if anybody else has seen this variation in seed size, or has any thoughts on the matter.

Thanks!

[Meangreen94z]

Any photos?

[Glen TX]

I think I took some size comparison photographs last year, but I'm not sure if I could find them. 

The plants just look like any photographs of Sabal sp. Tamaulipas posted online.

And the fruits and seeds also just look like the standard Sabal sp. Tamaulipas photographs, except for that one plant.  It's fruits and seeds look like regular Sable minor, maybe very slightly larger.

[ky_palm064]

I'm very interested in this variety (species?) since it would be a zone 6 or 7 trunking palm. Sabals, especially minors, have a lot of variability. Maybe the small seeded one you have is hardier.

[Glen TX]

I'm not sure about the hardiness of these, because my winters are not cold enough to test them.

[PalmatierMeg]

Take and post current photos. We love photos and you will get more enthusiastic and nuanced responses. 

[sashaeffer]

I've had one in the ground for a few years. South facing, right up against foundation of my house. I do protect it every winter and have supplemental heat as well.

 

Zone 5b/6a

Omaha, NE

[Swolte]

Here's mine. A bit under-watered but made it through its first Texas summer in the ground. 

[climate change virginia]

Are these fertile and how fast can they grow? What's the germination rate? Do they trunk and put out lots of leaves? Can they be crossed with a sabal palmetto? Would I need to protect it in a cold zone 8a?

Edited October 27, 2020 by climate change virginia

[climate change virginia]

 

14 hours ago, Swolte said:

Here's mine. A bit under-watered but made it through its first Texas summer in the ground. 

how old is it from seed

Edited October 27, 2020 by climate change virginia

[Swolte]

I believe 3 years old. I got this one from JFGardens last spring and it was definitely a lot smaller then. This is the site (formerly peckerwood, Yucca Do nursery) that did the original collection of this palm in Mexico. This is an odd form of Sabal minor (we don't know what exactly it is, though) as the trunk, when it matures, is not upright but creeping and the leaves are much larger than the S Minor. They reportedly also grow faster. They should be more than fine for zone 8a (PDN even lists them for zone 7b) but I usually protect them anyway the first few years in the ground. 

I may have to drop by JFGardens to pick up some trees mid-November so I can ask then to be sure. May even sneak into the garden to take some pics of more mature specimens, if I remember.

[climate change virginia]

where can i buy seeds for this online

Edited October 28, 2020 by climate change virginia

[NCFM]

37 minutes ago, climate change virginia said:

where can i buy seeds for this online

Plant Delights nursery

[climate change virginia]

17 hours ago, NC_Palm_Enthusiast said:

Plant Delights nursery

I only see the plants not the seeds

[NCFM]

43 minutes ago, climate change virginia said:

I only see the plants not the seeds

They may only have seedlings. You’d probably have better luck finding seeds on eBay 

[climate change virginia]

4 minutes ago, NC_Palm_Enthusiast said:

They may only have seedlings. You’d probably have better luck finding seeds on eBay 

could I email them and ask if I can have seeds

[PalmatierMeg]

On 10/29/2020 at 9:45 AM, climate change virginia said:

could I email them and ask if I can have seeds

Don't bother. PDN doesn't offer seeds at all. eBay is your best bet.

[sashaeffer]

Mine a few years in the ground(see earlier post on thread)

planted next to house, South side.

 

 

[teddytn]

On 10/27/2020 at 12:00 AM, Swolte said:

Here's mine. A bit under-watered but made it through its first Texas summer in the ground. 

Sorry if this is a sore subject, did your tamaulipas make it through last winter?