Germinating Old Palm Seeds, What Say You?

[sonobeau]

Conventional wisdom tells us that palm seeds along with other "tropical" plants have very short shelf lives. Some must be planted within hours of removal from fruit, but certainly no longer than a couple weeks. Yet, I'm fascinated by research that has been done showing on several occasions, experts in certain scientific fields have been able to revive so called extinct species or seeds from current living species that just happen to be really old by reviving and germinating ancient seeds found in Egyptian tombs and other archaeological sites, some even in the Americas. I have some old seeds laying around(granted not ancient, but certainly past their prime), I'm interested in trying to sprout. I didn't realize how perishable they were when I bought them(no longevity advice was given) I have no way to know how old they were when I received them, but they've been in my possession now for 2-3 years. Have you had success germinating old seed(any kind of exotic seed, not just palms)? What are your tried and true methods?  I've just tried basic soaking and heat so far with no additives and so far NOTHING! Over 1,000 seeds tested so far; don't want to waste anymore if there is a better tried and true method to do this. I'm especially looking for fool proof methods of germinating old/difficult seed that don't involve cutting the seed open. Some swear by tea, some by GA3, some by Miracle Grow, some by hydrogen peroxide and molasses, others by seaweed or kelp or even vitamin water or some combination thereof.  What say you?

[Rickybobby]

If I have fresh seeds I put them in coco and perlite with 92-95 degree heat and usually have no issues with crinita 

[Really full garden]

I think it depends on the species. There is not just one method to cover all species.

I have found the percentage of seed that germinate correlate directly with the age of the seeds. This depends also on how they were stored.

I generally use coco peat with vermiculite. I also use the baggy method. I dust the surface of the mix with Banrot.

[Fusca]

6 hours ago, sonobeau said:

Over 1,000 seeds tested so far; don't want to waste anymore

In the future when you obtain a large quantity of seeds, sacrifice one or two of them before you try to germinate them to see if you received good quality seeds.  Especially important if you are buying from an Ebay source that you aren't familiar with or collecting seeds that have been sitting under a tree for who knows how long.  Take one of the seeds and slice it in half with a sharp knife like @NatureGirl did below with her Zamia seeds.  If you see a white healthy embryo like you see in the bottom of the photo, then you know that the seeds are good and should germinate.  If you buy 1,000 bad seeds it won't matter what method you use to germinate them - you won't likely get much if any success.  So checking on the viability first can save you a lot of time and effort.  Typically the members who sell seeds in this forum are selling good quality, fresh seeds.  They want the buyers of the seeds to get good germination and will offer advice on germination techniques.

 

 

[DoomsDave]

@sonobeau this is actually a very profound and interesting topic!

Thanks for posting, helps get the gummy brain gears turning again.

To quote the girls from "Square Pegs": "One size does not fit all."

Length of viability, in my own limited experience varies a lot by species. In general, I've noted and found that tropical palms tend to lose viability sooner than those from seasonal or desert areas. This is because (in my opinion anyway) tropical habitats are ideal year round for germination so there's no evolutionary disadvantage for a short viability period.

On the other hand, seasonal or desert areas may vary a lot from season to season. And, tropical coconuts sail the world by sea; a coconut in Miami that loses viability a month into a long ocean voyage won't be any advantage either.

There's a whole host of variables and nuances.

For example, Chamadorea radicalis, which comes from a seasonally dry area in Mexico, has seeds that stay viable. I once sprouted some that were about five years old, at least according the label on the jar i had them in. Adonidia, some Dypsis, etc., appear to go bad a lot sooner.

And, "weeds" like Washies, never ever seem to die.

[sonobeau]

 

 

Edited July 18, 2020 by sonobeau

[sonobeau]

1 hour ago, DoomsDave said:

@sonobeau this is actually a very profound and interesting topic!

Thanks for posting, helps get the gummy brain gears turning again.

To quote the girls from "Square Pegs": "One size does not fit all."

Length of viability, in my own limited experience varies a lot by species. In general, I've noted and found that tropical palms tend to lose viability sooner than those from seasonal or desert areas. This is because (in my opinion anyway) tropical habitats are ideal year round for germination so there's no evolutionary disadvantage for a short viability period.

On the other hand, seasonal or desert areas may vary a lot from season to season. And, tropical coconuts sail the world by sea; a coconut in Miami that loses viability a month into a long ocean voyage won't be any advantage either.

There's a whole host of variables and nuances.

For example, Chamadorea radicalis, which comes from a seasonally dry area in Mexico, has seeds that stay viable. I once sprouted some that were about five years old, at least according the label on the jar i had them in. Adonidia, some Dypsis, etc., appear to go bad a lot sooner.

And, "weeds" like Washies, never ever seem to die.

If Washies last forever, maybe you can tell me what if anything I may have done wrong.

[DoomsDave]

2 hours ago, sonobeau said:

If Washies last forever, maybe you can tell me what if anything I may have done wrong.

Sorry if I've said anything to make you feel bad, seriously.

I've always had Washies sprout up for years after we took down trees, and neighbors took down theirs, and I still get the odd pop up now and again. A coyote had eaten some seeds, then pooped them in my yard, and a mini forest came up.

Tough isn't the same as invincible. If you find seeds, and they look hard and solid, and they sink when you drop them in water, plant them. The big thing they have to have, it appears, is both warm temps and a bit of drying off between waterings.

Newer seeds can't hurt; if they're scarce in your area, I can always find some, and I'll be glad to send to you. They'll be "filibusta" mutts, but they'll be Washies.

Hope this helps, and see my PM to you.

[Tasman]

Hello.
I am a beginner when it comes to palm trees.
I have a problem that I need help with. I have bought many seeds of bangalow, and some other Australian palms from queensland 10-11 months ago.
Hadn't had the chance to sow   them last year  because I moved to another place.
Now I finally have time to sow  them.

I kept them in the cellar with temperatures around 17 degrees. I have checked embryos on seeds, looks like they are still alive. 

I want to get as many sprouts as possible and wonder if there is any method that can stimulate old seeds to germinate?

I have read that some people put old seeds in bleach solution to awaken embryos.

Can you give me some advice?
Thanks in advance.