Palms for Orlando

[chad2468emr]

Hi everyone,

I lived in Fort Lauderdale (specifically zone 10b where I was at) for 7 years and could essentially grow just about anything I wanted. I had a pretty extensive collection that pretty much reflected just that. I had to move to NH with my spouse as a result of them finishing up their post doctorate at a VA hospital up here, and I had to give away anything I had in a container prior to leaving, and deal with the fact that I was abandoning everything I had in the ground. 
 

They just accepted a position at the Orlando VA and I’ll be moving back to Florida in August, but I’ve got no idea where the line exists between what can only realistically live in South Florida and what I can get away with growing in Orlando. (9b). 
 

Anything “interesting” that I can grow aside from the usual fare of sabals, washingtonias, Chinese fan palms, dates, and queens? Any tips for someone used to more tropical conditions than I’ll likely find in central Florida? 

 

[NickJames]

  On 4/19/2020 at 7:02 PM, chad2468emr said:

Hi everyone,

I lived in Fort Lauderdale (specifically zone 10b where I was at) for 7 years and could essentially grow just about anything I wanted. I had a pretty extensive collection that pretty much reflected just that. I had to move to NH with my spouse as a result of them finishing up their post doctorate at a VA hospital up here, and I had to give away anything I had in a container prior to leaving, and deal with the fact that I was abandoning everything I had in the ground. 
 

They just accepted a position at the Orlando VA and I’ll be moving back to Florida in August, but I’ve got no idea where the line exists between what can only realistically live in South Florida and what I can get away with growing in Orlando. (9b). 
 

Anything “interesting” that I can grow aside from the usual fare of sabals, washingtonias, Chinese fan palms, dates, and queens? Any tips for someone used to more tropical conditions than I’ll likely find in central Florida? 

 

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Where in Orlando? 

[kinzyjr]

@NickJames asks a very important question.  If you are planning on living within the Urban Heat Island, roughly defined by FL-423 in the North and East, 429 Toll to the west, The 417 Toll Road to the South and East, this thread will be of interest:

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/index.php?/topic/59360-zone-10-palms-in-the-orlando-area-mega-thread/

If you are going to live outside of that area, you'll want stuff that is a little hardier unless you're not worried about losing it in a Jan. 2010 or Jan. 2018 style event.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Chad,

If you live in the Orlando hear island area as stated above, you could grow some varieties of Coconut Palms to maturity there with nuts on them, like the Jamaican Tall, Green Malayan Dwarf, and probably the Green variety of Hawaiian Tall, and Panama Tall too, and possibly the Maypan hybrid also.  P.J here on Palmtalk has a nice healthy robust Green Malayan Dwarf in Orlando with nice size coconuts on it.  You could also grow the Florida Royal Palm, Cuban Royal Palm, various King Palms (Archontophoenix), Foxtail Palms, Pygmy Date Palms, Florida Thatch Palms, Coccothrinax Palms, Paurotis Palms, Saw Palms, Ribbon Palms, Chinese Fan Palms, etc. just to name a few.  I have these in my yard in Corpus Christi, Texas, along with a trunking Green Malayan Dwarf Coconut Palm, a Mexican Tall, and Maymex hybrid Coconut Palms in my yard, and Orlando is a slightly milder wintertime climate than my area, so there is still a lot you can grow there even though it is not South Florida.

[chad2468emr]

Hey everyone, 

I would be staying in Lake Nona, which has FL417 run straight through it, and that sounds like the edge of the heat island according to kinzyjr. I think I would definitely be outside the Urban Heat Island. Not much pavement and urbanization in that area, so I was expecting that. 

It seems there are some cold-hardy palms that are a bit more interesting than the usual fare you see (Queens, dates, washingtonias, etc.) so I'm hopeful I'll be able to experiment a bit! If anything, I can use containers to keep more cold-sensitive palms outside 99% of the time, bringing them inside whenever temperatures are dipping too low for a night or two. 

I don't want to seem too picky, especially since being in NH, the only palms I have right now are a lady palm in my living room and a majesty palm. (I know, I know... I was feeling homesick and found myself at Home Depot for non-plant needs, and impulse-purchased a majesty knowing how poorly they do inside.) I'm going to be thrilled to play around with any type of palm outdoors at all at this point!

[NickJames]

  On 4/20/2020 at 3:22 PM, chad2468emr said:

Hey everyone, 

I would be staying in Lake Nona, which has FL417 run straight through it, and that sounds like the edge of the heat island according to kinzyjr. I think I would definitely be outside the Urban Heat Island. Not much pavement and urbanization in that area, so I was expecting that. 

It seems there are some cold-hardy palms that are a bit more interesting than the usual fare you see (Queens, dates, washingtonias, etc.) so I'm hopeful I'll be able to experiment a bit! If anything, I can use containers to keep more cold-sensitive palms outside 99% of the time, bringing them inside whenever temperatures are dipping too low for a night or two. 

I don't want to seem too picky, especially since being in NH, the only palms I have right now are a lady palm in my living room and a majesty palm. (I know, I know... I was feeling homesick and found myself at Home Depot for non-plant needs, and impulse-purchased a majesty knowing how poorly they do inside.) I'm going to be thrilled to play around with any type of palm outdoors at all at this point!

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You could be in a decent microclimate depending on proximity to some of the lakes through there. I can’t think of anything planted off top of mind through there that was interesting. 

[Jimbean]

Normally you can get a good idea of what is possible to grow based on what is currently growing in the neighborhood, but since we have had three really good decades, with the exception of 2010, I think it is a bit deceptive.  Like mentioned above, there are certainly micro-climates throughout Florida, and Orlando is no exception.  The inner suburbs are somewhat warmer, and there are elevation changes and lakes to consider as well.  How much of a difference these all make are debatable on this forum.  

My take on it is that anything that is zone 9B is probably a good marker.  9A is bulletproof, 9B is reasonably hardy, and if you want to zone push, try zone 10A.  Orlando hit a record low of 18F in 1899, and 19F in 1989.  In more rural areas it can get colder; I had a family member who lived in Christmas, which is about 20 miles east of Orlando, which according to him, got down to 13F in 1989.  In normal years and in most locations in east central Florida, expect generally 28F to 32F, and severe winters down to 20F to 25F.  

[Oviedo_z10b_lol]

If you’re in lake Nona, you’ll be pretty close to MB Palms: a wholesaler specializing in palms that will sell to individuals, as long as you know what you want (ie: no tourists lazily perusing his inventory). Check his PlantAnt page. A lot of what he sells is hardy here. 
 
Beccariophoenix Alfredi is a pretty bulletproof coconut lookalike, although it gets much bigger/thicker. I have archontophoenix cunninghamiana and alexandrae in the ground here. Also arenga engleri does well in a shady spot.
A lot of the common tender palms (adonidia, hyophorbe) available AT the BBS will make it a few years between cold snaps. Just approach them as “annuals” and be ready to rip and repeat in the event of frost  

And welcome to central florida. You’re here just in time for the oppressive heat of our stagnant summers. Remember that nice breeze in Broward county?... doesn’t happen here. Cheers!

[Merlyn]

I was just thinking what Oviedo_z10b typed.  MB Palms is around the corner from the Lake Nona medical complex, and he grows a LOT of unusual palms.  He's fine with people stopping by to purchase specific items, but not so much with lookie-lous just wanting to come browse.  If you are down in the SE side you are warmer than I am on the NW side, so in general you'd have a better chance with some of the marginal species.  I'm growing Arenga Engleri, Pinnata & Micrantha, Allagopera Arenaria & Caudescens, Attalea Cohune & Phalerata, Archontophoenix Alexandrae, B. Alfredii, Bismarckia, Caryota Gigas &  Mitis, Chambeyronia (several types), Coccothrinax Argentea Barbadensis & Crinita, Copernicia Baileyana, Macroglossa, Prunifera & Fallaensis, Dypsis Leptocheilos & Pembana, Keriodoxa Elegans, Livistona Fulva & Mariae & Speciosa, Sabal Mauritiiformis & Causiarum, and a bunch of other common species.  I also have some Jubaea x Butia from Patrick, Dictyosperma Rubrum, Brahea Clara & Nitida, Gaussia Princeps and Elaeis Guineensis still to plant somewhere.  I'm borderline 9a/9b so in a bad year I'll probably lose some of the ~130 palms I have in the ground and ~120 I have in pots.  But to me that's an acceptable risk.

If you want to get a good idea of what you can grow there, stop over at Leu Gardens and tour the grounds!  The microclimate there is pretty favorable for palms, but if they can grow it, you've got a good chance too!