Bismarckia nobilis - trunk diameter

[Nakheel1412]

Hi,

I would like to plant 2 bismarckias in two different spots, but I have one limitation for both : the trunk must not grow larger than 1 meter in diameter (3.3 feet), otherwise it will push against concrete ;

Any idea on how big the trunk of a Bismarckia can get?
(Thanks in advance !)

Edited December 11, 2017 by Nakheel1412

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Ive seen a few that were around 28-30" at the base. The trunks were about 24". 

[Nakheel1412]

Excellent, thanks a lot @TexasColdHardyPalms !

[Tampa Scott]

Made me go out and measure the base diameter of my largest and oldest and the diameter comes in at 48.5" 

[Nakheel1412]

Ouch !

That's a bit more than what I actually have of space (43.3") :/

Do you think it would stop increasing in base-diameter if it was to reach concrete or would it break the concrete?

(Thank you for taking the time to go out and measuring the diameter, @Tampa Scott, that's really nice of you, and much appreciated !)

Edited December 11, 2017 by Nakheel1412

[steve99]

Here are some pics of my biggest Bizzy.  The tape measure is opened out to show one metre (1000mm)  Trunk circumference at the base is 3.6m (141. inches or 11.75 ft}

Edited December 12, 2017 by steve99

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Those are Monsters!!! What's the average?

[Nakheel1412]

@steve99 : Wow, when they get big, they get reaaaaaaaaaaally big !

Thanks a lot for the detailed measuring, really nice of you, that's much appreciated !

[PalmatierMeg]

Bismarckia is not a palm for confined spaces. Have you considered a blue Latan (Latania lontaroides)? Blue crown like a Bizzie but with a much skinnier trunk. Downside: it is also slower growing.

[Matthew92]

Monster Bismarckia at Leu Gardens in Orlando. Tallest I have ever seen. Unfortunately I didn't get a close up of the trunk base.

[Nakheel1412]

@PalmatierMeg @Opal92 Thanks a lot for the answers !

I won't plant Bismarckias at those spots, and choose something else ;

[sonoranfans]

Because this palm gets so big above ground, you should let the roots breathe with lots of room to grow.  Like in a sailboat, stability in wind depends on forces countering the wind down low and compact roots are not going to work as well.  I've seen some of these planted in wet rocky soil in miami that were 25" tall that moved noticeably when I pushed at the trunk, kind of scary to be able to move the crown with a push.  Not sure they survived high winds since then, I wouldn't want those wobbly trees near my house or in my yard lest they fall on something/someone.  If the palm gets big above ground, it'll need strong roots to stabilize and deep roots and wide will be stronger.  Planting near concrete slab may stunt the palms growth above and help fix that, but if not give it room to fall.  

[Nakheel1412]

@sonoranfans Yes that's definitely something I should have considered, ironically I gave a similar advise to someone who had planted a Phoenix canariensis on a raised bed next to his concrete swimming pool, thanks a lot for the reminder !

Do you think a Brahea armata/Syagrus romanzoffiana/Archontophoenix alexandrae would fit nicely in such a spot, or should I go for something even thinner? (like a Livistona australis?)

[sonoranfans]

I think Brahea armata would be fine, doubt it will ever get to a 40" trunk, but it could get to 30".   B. armata would likely love morocco and grow to a gorgeous specimen appearance with a little care.  Crowns arent so big on armatas, half a bizzie or even smaller.  I would avoid planting the others in morocco, they wont like the hot desert climate.  I grew syagrus R in the Arizona desert,  they really need lots of water and fertilizer and they aged poorly.  I tried a few Achrontophoenix, too dessicating(heat/sun/dry) for them in direct sun.

[Kris]

Dear Omar,

Can you post still of the proposed ste where you intend to plant the palm. Our Bizzy is also growing in a very cramped up area..one side we have the compound wall made of baked clay bricks and on the other side we have the pathway.That is their is less than 4 feet of free space for the palm.But in its place we have a tall growing coconut tree since its nuts were dropping in our neighbours place where its a parking lot.So safety reasons we had to cut it down,In its place we had planted this bizzy palm.Which has just 3 foot of trunk.I will post stills with measurements for you to have an idea how big it is at the moment.

And members like Meg and Tim had given you right suggestions but i want to see that growing area of yours.You state the concrete it should be cement structure,Since concrete is used in water tanks and building foundation only.

Okay let's have the visuals..

Pathway and palm tree,clay brick for scale :

Palm and the compound wall :

Overall trunk size in feet :

Its less than 2 meters :

...

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Kris

[Kris]

The distance between the wall and the pathway is just less than 4 feet :

Love.

Kris.

 

[Nakheel1412]

Hi @Kris !
Thanks a lot for your help !
Here's the situation :

I've covered the dirt with cardboard in order to prevent anything from growing there (Salpichroa origanifolia in particular, that has invaded a big portion of my garden and that I have failed to eradicate for now), still you can guess what's going on :

On top of the soil, a concrete slab has been poured-in-place + the foundations of the wall (that I'm going to re-paint, sorry for the poor deco lol), leaving a "gap" to plant stuff ;

Under the concrete slab, there is only soil from our side, but on the side of the wall, the foundations go a bit deeper ; Have a look at the right part of the pic', it's not fully covered, you can see what's going on ;

What do you think? I'll probably plant a Brahea armata there instead of a bismarckia to avoid future problems

Edited December 15, 2017 by Nakheel1412

[Kris]

Hi,

Seeing your house structure in the back.I would recommend only Dwarf palms or clumping palms.Since Brahea,Bismarckia or Blue latania will easily break the pathway tiles in course of time.

My recommendations will be Med fan palm,Med fan ver. cerifera,P.Roebelenii,Medemia Argun,Sabal Minor,Serenoa Repens silver form,Raphis palm,Brahea Decumbens,Copernicia Alba,Copernicia Cowellii,Dypsis Decaryi,Pseudophoenix palms...

For more visuals visit the link given below,You can have a visuals of the trunk size of most of palms that i have mentioned above and decide.

 http://www.palmpedia.net/wiki/Category:PALM_GENERA

And for seeds in small quantities to buy here's a link :

http://rarepalmseeds.com/small.shtml

Love,

Kris.

 

[Nakheel1412]

Actually this wall isn't part of the house, it's an enclosure wall (around 3m high (120in) I would say) ;

 

Thanks a lot for the advice anyway, Kris !

Edited December 15, 2017 by Nakheel1412