I have a Bismarckia Nobilis in my back garden that is currently about 7 1/2 feet tall. It was planted about 2 years ago from a 15 gallon container. It is located below 2 power lines. The lower line is simply an AT&T line that is a little behind the palm, can probably be easily moved and is safe to touch. So I am not to bothered about that one. But the higher line is an FPL (Florida Power & Light) line that passes directly over the spear of the palm. The FPL line is currently about 6 feet above the top of the spear.

The questions I have are:

1) How many years do you think I have before the palm grows into the FPL line? I was thinking that if the palm was to grow 1 1/2 feet per year in overall height, then that would be about 4 years before the top of the spear starts to touch the line, so add 1 year onto that for when the crown of the palm really starts to really interfere with the line, would be about 5 years in total. Does that sound about accurate?

2) Will it be possible to prune the palm so that the leaves will not interfere with the line? This may be rather difficult seeing as the line passes directly above the spear, if it was a foot behind the spear (as the other line is) I would imagine it would be easier?

3) Do you think I will have no choice but to cut down the palm or bury the power line when it starts to grow into the line?

4) Have other people have similar problems like this? The amount of palms I see in my neighborhood that are growing directly under power lines makes me suspect that perhaps this is not as big of a deal as I am making out....

 

Photos are attached:

 

How fast it grows depends on your climatic conditions.

But I havr a question what have you planned for this bismarkia ?

Are you going to transplant or when it hits the power line allow the power company to cut it down ?

What surprises me is how you missed the power line while planting this palm.And most bismarkia do not transplant well as they hate disturbing their roots.

Kris.

Yes it is funny because usually I am pretty good at looking at the long term implications of where I plant my palms. This was one of the first ones I planted and perhaps I was a little inexperienced then. I remember when I planted it that I had purposefully tried to make sure it was a foot in front of the lower line. But maybe the upper line was so high up that I didn't care too much, I don't even remember concerning myself with the higher line at all at the time I planted it. I probably thought that it would not be a concern for something like 10 years. But now I know that the Bismarcks are fast growers.

As for #3, you have a choice: Bury the power line (deep) in the ground! And in this case #1, 2 (), and 4 are of no concern.

A 220 volt line is not good for you or the palm.  Your power company may trim it, and it will not be to your liking.  But they are ones with the easement.  Cannot tell from the pic of there is a 7KV primary above the 220v line; it is the one at the end of a crossbar at the very top of the pole.  This one can kill you quite easily.  The current can easily travel down things like green bamboo culms, palm fronds, etc.   If you're lucky, you'll only get knocked on your ass (I speak from experience).  Or you can pay a couple thousand to have the lines buried.  In general, the higher the line, the more dangerous it is.

40 minutes ago, Phil Stager said:

A 220 volt line is not good for you or the palm.  Your power company may trim it, and it will not be to your liking.  But they are ones with the easement.  Cannot tell from the pic of there is a 7KV primary above the 220v line; it is the one at the end of a crossbar at the very top of the pole. 

No the bottom line is an AT&T line that is just 8 feet from the ground (for AT&T Uverse internet and tv service) , the higher line is the FPL line that is most likely the 220v line you are talking about, it is about 15 feet from the ground.

Edited July 19, 20169 yr by GMann

52 minutes ago, GMann said:

No the bottom line is an AT&T line that is just 8 feet from the ground (for AT&T Uverse internet and tv service) , the higher line is the FPL line that is most likely the 220v line you are talking about, it is about 15 feet from the ground.

It would appear that these are the service lines to your home, from the utility's pole, in which case it is your responsibility to maintain typically.  I personally wouldn't want to deal with a Bismarckia under my power lines.  I dealt with the undergrounding issue when I remodeled the home I'm in.  Because I was on a corner, and the phone provider came in from a different side of the house, I had 3 sets of lines crisscrossing my property to the house (power, phone and local cable provider).  I opted to underground all of them, entering the property from one point and am very happy I did.  Now the only lines I deal with are phone lines along one side of my property.  That overhead line runs along my property line for feeding other homes in the neighborhood, but not mine.  Undergrounding will remove constraints on other plantings for you, because even if you remove the Bismarckia, what will you put under it next time?  Just an added thought, think of how large and heavy a Bismarckia frond is, and imagine what one dropping on your power line would do.  It will end up ugly sooner or later if you keep the lines there.

1) 3-4 years at most.

2) If meristem/spear is located directly below the high voltage line, FPL will probably lop it off, killing the palm. Back in 2010 I planted my dwarf spicata coconut with an eye for the power lines. What I hadn't figured was that its fronds are 20-25' tall and flutter close to the lines in the wind. LCEC notified me they were going to trim a couple of my fronds. I begged them not to take the center. They did not but my palm has a noticeable gap on the north side.

3) I believe burying the lines isn't within your power and FPL sure won't do it for one homeowner to save a very common palm or any other reason. Burying power lines is very expensive. People of aesthetic tastes fight with LCEC all the time about ugly power lines in Cape Coral and almost always lose - except in the so-called "historic district", if a former Yankee-sucker land scam can have one. New neighborhoods can plan for underground utility lines but if you already have power poles & lines you are probably out of luck.

4) People planting large trees under power lines is a huge problem. In the battle of trees vs power lines the trees lose big. In Cape Coral, LCEC has contract tree trimmers drive the city cutting away at any plant they think menace power lines. Other people's planting mistakes ended up in my yard as free mulch.

Moving a Bizzie that large is probably impossible given how root sensitive they are. If you don't want to take it out yourself, wait for FPL to do it for you - unless they want to slap you with a humongous bill for the outrage. Then do it yourself. Many people, me included, have no idea how massive these palms get until you see them in person. And unlike a coconut, this palm has no give whatsoever. I don't have to worry about my Bizzie and power lines anymore. Native palm weevils killed it off.

1 hour ago, PalmatierMeg said:

3) I believe burying the lines isn't within your power and FPL sure won't do it for one homeowner to save a very common palm or any other reason. Burying power lines is very expensive.

Burying power lines from the main pole that supplies the neighborhood to your home isn't cheap, but is completely within the individual's rights here in Southern California.  You have to have the trenching inspected, and plans approved, but it is actually encouraged on remodels here.  I wanted to underground mine, but wouldn't have had a choice.  The main lines run across the street parallel with the street.  I had to pay to bring the lines down from a pole, the trenching and placement of the conduit across the street and to my panel.  So if you are interested in exploring it, contact your power company to find out their parameters.  Based on what Meg is saying about the growth rate in Florida, you have a couple of years to then budget for the expense if that is something you think you may want to do.

Best option would be to transplant it while it may stand a chance of survival. Worst case, you buy a new palm .... far less expensive than having your lines buried or having issues with it later.

Cheers, Barrie. 

11 minutes ago, Tracy said:

Burying power lines from the main pole that supplies the neighborhood to your home isn't cheap, but is completely within the individual's rights here in Southern California.  You have to have the trenching inspected, and plans approved, but it is actually encouraged on remodels here.  I wanted to underground mine, but wouldn't have had a choice.  The main lines run across the street parallel with the street.  I had to pay to bring the lines down from a pole, the trenching and placement of the conduit across the street and to my panel.  So if you are interested in exploring it, contact your power company to find out their parameters.  Based on what Meg is saying about the growth rate in Florida, you have a couple of years to then budget for the expense if that is something you think you may want to do.

Interesting and certainly worth checking out in FL. However, this is Fl...... Fun fact and example of what mindset we deal with here: Back in the late 00s, LCEC built itself a fancy and modern new headquarters in N. Ft. Myers. Great a/c - no heating system at all. "Wait, but it's FL!" you say. Then came the winter of '09-10. Days of highs in the 40s to 50s and nights down to freezing. My house had heat, LCEC's headquarters had no heat. "So," you say, "employees could bring in space heaters." Except the electric company had not provided its headquarters with enough power to support any space heaters without blowing the place up. Would you trust these people with the fate of a prized Bizzie?

9 hours ago, GMann said:

I remember when I planted it that I had purposefully tried to make sure it was a foot in front of the lower line.

That's funny, considering the 20+ foot wingspan of a mature bizzy. 

In my neighborhood I saw someone plant a CIDP 12 inches away from a house, in a planted under the eave. It certainly looked cute there while it was tiny, but not for long.

There are a few near my house that i've been watching for years. 

 

This is a photo from 3 years ago... still below the lines

 

 

Here is the same one today. Hard to see the lines in the pic but they are running right through the leaves. 

 

 

Another that was below the lines a few years ago, but is now taller

 

 

I do not know if they have had issues with these palms growing into the lines, but I see them simply trimming them occasionally. 

Plant anohter Bizzie away from the wires.

Then pray for the first.

Top photo:  See line at the top of the pole going into the transformer; that's the 7KV primary.

Second photo:  hard to tell what's what at the top

Third photo: See those three lines at the top across the street; not sure how many KV but enough to fry you to a crisp.

Fourth photo: Looks like regular 220 V into house and a 110V street light

The most dangerous powerlines are the uninsulated ones on the street!  You don't want your palms to come anywhere near those lines.

The black insulated line that runs to your house will not electrocute you -- it is wrapped around a steel cable to give it extra support.  The black plastic coating protects you from a shock.  It is probably a 100 amp line.  Older houses, like mine, have a 60 amp line.  If you were determined enough to pay an electrician you could probably move the mast head -- on your house -- and the line (Your electric utility company would be the actual ones moving the line)

Edited July 20, 20169 yr by rprimbs
clarity

Adam,

Nice visuals and I can imagine now how big this palm can grow.

Love,

Kris. 

5 hours ago, velutina said:

 

I do not know if they have had issues with these palms growing into the lines, but I see them simply trimming them occasionally. 

 

Looks to me that the lines going through the bizzy are communication lines - copper phone lines, cable tv, fiber, etc. Probably why they're still going through that tree.

Insulated electrical service wires would look thicker and wouldn't be bunched up like that on that pole in the last image.

Move it while is still on time, they will easily top it off.

I am with Richard, pay someone to move the lines out of the palm's immediate canopy. Here in Greece we can call and pay the company to move a pole or lines or call an electrician to move the house lines. I have a Washingtonia that was planted to pass close by the lines but leaned towards the house lines and will probably have to move them in the coming year or two

13 hours ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

 

Edited July 20, 20169 yr by GMann

I have looked into burying the line, but it is pretty complicated because the trench would have to go around a patio and a large tree, it would probably cost over $3,000 in total, all this to save a Bismark palm that I bought  2 years ago for about $50. It has grown into a beautiful palm though. Sigh...

10 hours ago, rprimbs said:

If you were determined enough to pay an electrician you could probably move the mast head -- on your house -- and the line (Your electric utility company would be the actual ones moving the line)

Moving the masthead would be a half measure, moving it in one direction would cause the line to go over the pool (not allowed), and the other way it could only be moved about 2 feet to the edge of the house, which would make the line about 1 foot further away from the palm, so it would be spending a lot of money for not much benefit.

13 hours ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

 ...you buy a new palm .... far less expensive than having your lines buried or having issues with it later.

Cheers, Barrie. 

Yes, this seems like the most reasonable and cost effective thing. Enjoy the Bizzie for the next 4 years and then when it gets too big just chop it down and plant something else adjacent to where it was. The remaining roots from the old Bismarck will actually be a benefit because they will help restrict the newly planted palm from growing so huge so that they have less chance of ever interfering with the powerline. Are there any nice blue colored Bismarck substitutes that never get higher than 16 feet?

Edited July 20, 20169 yr by GMann

You might be able to sloooowy root prune it over the course of a year....maybe it would survive a transplant...ask Ken. 

Look into the blue latan. Some of them look similar to silver Bizzies but with less bulk. Downsize is they are slower growing, more cold sensitive and get taller than 16'. Cold-wise, they should make it in Hollywood.

I love the Blue Latan, I already have one in my front yard, which is already 5 feet tall and not yet turned blue. Slower growing is actually a good thing in this scenario.

Dude, take the palm down. It's hurricane season. I was surprised how many large Bismarkias in the Miami area were leaning or down after Katrina/Wilma. Even their deep rooting didn't save them. 

 

If those are only communication lines, I say leave it. If power lines, plant another Bismarkia in a less problematic location. The nice thing is that they're beautiful at any size, especially in South Florida where they always look perfect.

16 hours ago, velutina said:

Another that was below the lines a few years ago, but is now taller

Do you have the address for this one? I wanted to take a look at it on Google street view, usually they have historic photos going back a few years.

call Ken Johnson and have him move the tree

https://goo.gl/maps/8xvRR5tr4pN2

Edited July 20, 20169 yr by velutina

Insulated power lines at the top, communications lines at the bottom. I'd say this bizzy will probably be OK there. If it was across the street underneath the live wires it would be cut down.

Edited July 20, 20169 yr by Pando

Looks like a similar scenario for the OP, but I'd try to move it while it's still small.

Another one in the neighborhood I didn't notice until today. 

 

Wow, those palms hang all over those lines. Power companies here won't tolerate that because we get so many hurricanes and violent thunderstorms. Just the action of strong winds blowing the trees around would rip every line down, perhaps the poles with them. What a mess. And Bizzie fronds are rigid and heavy - deadly weapons in 80 mph winds.

Exactly.  In coastal TX we have tree pruners working year round to keep trees off the power lines to prevent damage during hurricanes.  If it's a palm, they will top it and kill it, and they don't ask your permission first.  

My bizzie fell over in storm winds at the size yours is. We propped it up, staked it and it never even missed a beat. I don't know why you couldn't transplant it now while it's small. That said, mine is near quite near communication lines too and my mother bitches at me all the time about it. But I'm leaving it there as it was a memorial palm for a BF I lost to cancer.

Bismarckias suffered a lot of wind damage in the Melbourne, Florida area from the two hurricanes in 2004.  The winds weren't that high.  Many palms will recover well when propped up after wind.  Fairchild's palm propping after the 1992 hurricane was quick, heroic, and a whopping success, even with no irrigation water available. 

In 2004, one small botanical garden chainsawed its fallen palms.  Bad.  

The answer is simple, it will die at the hands of an amateur arborist.  Don't get me wrong, a professional arborist would kill it too, it is just that power companies don't tend to hire them.