How often, and how much, do you water in Southern California (San Diego)

[xxxSDESDExxx]

I am really having a lot of trouble figuring out how to determine how much I need to be watering my outdoor plants. I have a drip irrigation system installed and am very confused on how much I should be watering each plant -- I believe I drowned some of my Foxtail palms that I dug up and removed so I don't want to make this mistake with my other plants -- I also don't want to under water. What I want to know is, how long do I water these plants, and how many gallons of water should I be providing to each plant? I am asking the experts here for help since I am so unsure whether I'm watering too much or too little. I live in the 92126 zip code if that helps. I found this one web-site's recommendations http://www.florida-palm-trees.com/watering-palm-trees/and they say the general rule is to water as many gallons as the plant's container size -- I think 25 gallons of water for a 25 gallon plant is just a little much lol. I found another site http://www.palmsonline.com.au/flex/tips-for-growing-magnificent-foxtail-palms-wodyetia-bifurcata/18/1 saying to water twice a month in Summer and once every six weeks in Winter........ Really? I know that's an Australian site and their climate is different, but that seems like not nearly enough.

Type of plants that I have and whether they're in the ground or not:

- I have two King Palm trees that are recent transplants that are between 15-20 feet tall that are in the ground. (Planted in clay/sand/cactus & palm mix)

- I have one approximately 6 ft tall Foxtail Palm planted in the ground. (Planted in clay/cactus & palm mix)

- I have 2 double pygmy date palms that are currently in 25 gallon containers and I'm getting ready to plant them in the ground (these plants are fairly large). (Will be planted in clay/sand/cactus & palm mix)

- I have 1 single pygmy date palm that is currently in a 25 gallon container that I'm getting ready to plant in the ground. (Will be planted in clay/sand/cactus & palm mix)

- I have 3 single 15 gallon pygmy date palms that were transplanted into decorative 20 gallon pots -- they will remain in these pots unless you guys recommend that I move them (Planted in cactus & palm mix)

- I have 2 15 gallon bougainvilleas that are still in their original pots. (Has original soil it came with).

Edited May 8, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[quaman58]

David, it's a bit of a tough question to answer. My front yard has raised retaining walls & holds a lot of the water, whereas my backyard slope is tough to keep well hydrated. Most of the palms in the front could probably do well with 3-4 gallons a week spread out over 3 watering days on drip. The back requires twice that much & will still never get that perpetually damp condition that makes palms grow like crazy. You have to experiment with your conditions to find out what works best. Also, certain palms do better with varying degrees of water; Pygmies love water, but will grow okay with less if they have to. Same with Foxtails. Palms like Butias & Chamerops require little once established, other palms require a lot of always available water. So it will be somewhat species specific as you plant other palms in the future. Hope this helps a bit.

Bret

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Here are some pics. Some of the plants are in the ground, while others aren't yet. I will also be moving some plants from their current location -- I mainly wanted to give you guys a picture of the slight slope in the front yard, and the size of the plants. I'm going to be removing the lawn edging, which I put down prior to mulching the entire front yard. My wife wanted 3 huge pygmy date palms, even though I thought those were more appropriate for a larger property -- maybe I'll move one to the back (back yard is flat)

Edited May 8, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[xxxSDESDExxx]

The second picture is a few weeks ago before I got the 3 large pygmy date palms, the 2 king palms, and the 2 birds of paradise. The pygmy date palm which is seen in several pictures is just sitting in a hole at the moment. On Monday I'm going to be moving it to one of the corners near the street, since I think it's too much to have where it is in the picture. Also, that smaller palm in the corner is a Foxtail that's been hanging on -- it's the only one that survived out of 3 and my wife wants it gone since it's so small

[Gonzer]

First thing I'd do is lose the red mulch and replace it with natural wood mulch.

[Ben in Norcal]

Then I'd lose some of the pygmy dates...there's so many species you can grow there! You need to introduce your wife to some of those.

[BigFrond]

You will need to water more initially to get the palms going. King loves lots of water, and clay is the best for them. Foxtail will do not like clay in the winter. Pygmies do not require lots of water. They're almost indestructible. However, if you want them to look good, they will need more water. It's good to have one or two kings when you start out for the quick cover. However, they grow fast and produces lots of frond liter. I would grow more Chambeyronia macrocarpa. They will be much better in the long run. I have way too many kings and would like to chop them now.

Yeah, you should replace the pygmies because they are quite nasty if you get prick by their long thorns. Also, you should lose that red plum tree. I will get big and the roots are quite invasive, plus the leaf liter in the fall is "turrible". You should grow some clumping dypsis like baronii or penbema because the do well in full sun in SD.

[trioderob]

not at all - we just got 1.5 " o' rain ...............

Edited May 8, 2015 by trioderob

[xxxSDESDExxx]

First thing I'd do is lose the red mulch and replace it with natural wood mulch.

LOL. I figured I'd try the color and if I didn't like it that it would lose it's color soon enough anyway

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Then I'd lose some of the pygmy dates...there's so many species you can grow there! You need to introduce your wife to some of those.

I agree. I was like, please stop with the pygmy date palms that are this size. Our yard is not big enough to handle that many of them, plus where is the variety -- I agree.

Edited May 8, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[xxxSDESDExxx]

You will need to water more initially to get the palms going. King loves lots of water, and clay is the best for them. Foxtail will do not like clay in the winter. Pygmies do not require lots of water. They're almost indestructible. However, if you want them to look good, they will need more water. It's good to have one or two kings when you start out for the quick cover. However, they grow fast and produces lots of frond liter. I would grow more Chambeyronia macrocarpa. They will be much better in the long run. I have way too many kings and would like to chop them now.

Yeah, you should replace the pygmies because they are quite nasty if you get prick by their long thorns. Also, you should lose that red plum tree. I will get big and the roots are quite invasive, plus the leaf liter in the fall is "turrible". You should grow some clumping dypsis like baronii or penbema because the do well in full sun in SD.

I agree on the red plum tree lol. It was added last year before we decided to start getting palms. I don't want to kill it, but I definitely don't want it in the front yard.......

I will look into your other recommendations -- I don't know what a lot of the palm trees actually are so I thank you guys for giving me recommendations on other palms/plants that will work and look good with my situation.

Edited May 8, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[xxxSDESDExxx]

David, it's a bit of a tough question to answer. My front yard has raised retaining walls & holds a lot of the water, whereas my backyard slope is tough to keep well hydrated. Most of the palms in the front could probably do well with 3-4 gallons a week spread out over 3 watering days on drip. The back requires twice that much & will still never get that perpetually damp condition that makes palms grow like crazy. You have to experiment with your conditions to find out what works best. Also, certain palms do better with varying degrees of water; Pygmies love water, but will grow okay with less if they have to. Same with Foxtails. Palms like Butias & Chamerops require little once established, other palms require a lot of always available water. So it will be somewhat species specific as you plant other palms in the future. Hope this helps a bit.

Bret

So back to the water question, as opposed to my ugly mulch color and too many giant pygmy palms lol. I am mixing all purpose sand with the existing clay and a palm/cactus mix -- using about 1/4 to 1/3 the amount of sand as the other stuff -- when planting. I'm going to keep the two king palms that I have, the small Foxtail, the 3 potted pygmy date palms, and maybe one of those giant pygmy date palms in the front yard.

How much water should I be giving those potted pygmy date palms?

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Right now I have two 2-gallon emitters providing water to each potted pygmy. I was watering every 2nd day, but recently changed it to every 5th day. I think I'll put it back down to every 2nd or 3rd day. Also, I only have it watering for about 25 minutes or so each time -- I'm guessing I should increase that time since the plants probably aren't getting that deep water they need. One other thing I noticed, is the soil is very well draining for the potted pygmies because the water comes out of the base of the pot pretty quickly, so I'm thinking of changing to four 1-gallon emitters so that it doesn't rush out as fast.

I have four 2-gallon emitters around the Foxtail palm and am thinking of putting the same number of emitters of the same 2-gallon capacity around the King palms.

Edited May 8, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[xxxSDESDExxx]

You will need to water more initially to get the palms going. King loves lots of water, and clay is the best for them. Foxtail will do not like clay in the winter. Pygmies do not require lots of water. They're almost indestructible. However, if you want them to look good, they will need more water. It's good to have one or two kings when you start out for the quick cover. However, they grow fast and produces lots of frond liter. I would grow more Chambeyronia macrocarpa. They will be much better in the long run. I have way too many kings and would like to chop them now.

Yeah, you should replace the pygmies because they are quite nasty if you get prick by their long thorns. Also, you should lose that red plum tree. I will get big and the roots are quite invasive, plus the leaf liter in the fall is "turrible". You should grow some clumping dypsis like baronii or penbema because the do well in full sun in SD.

I want to thank you for this post and for the information you provided in it Awesome recommendations on the plants as well. I do really like the Chambeyronia macrocarpa but I have no idea what I should pay for a 15-20 gallon (I prefer something larger that's instant gratification). I see them on Craiglist for $300.00 for 15 gallon which seems like a lot -- not sure it really is worth that but who knows.

[Sabal Steve]

You will need to water more initially to get the palms going. King loves lots of water, and clay is the best for them. Foxtail will do not like clay in the winter. Pygmies do not require lots of water. They're almost indestructible. However, if you want them to look good, they will need more water. It's good to have one or two kings when you start out for the quick cover. However, they grow fast and produces lots of frond liter. I would grow more Chambeyronia macrocarpa. They will be much better in the long run. I have way too many kings and would like to chop them now.

Yeah, you should replace the pygmies because they are quite nasty if you get prick by their long thorns. Also, you should lose that red plum tree. I will get big and the roots are quite invasive, plus the leaf liter in the fall is "turrible". You should grow some clumping dypsis like baronii or penbema because the do well in full sun in SD.

I want to thank you for this post and for the information you provided in it Awesome recommendations on the plants as well. I do really like the Chambeyronia macrocarpa but I have no idea what I should pay for a 15-20 gallon (I prefer something larger that's instant gratification). I see them on Craiglist for $300.00 for 15 gallon which seems like a lot -- not sure it really is worth that but who knows.

There are a lot of growers in North/Northeast San Diego County that have very competitive prices on palms.

You live in a pretty prime part of San Diego, and should be able to grow all sorts of exotic palms.

[Matt in OC]

Right now I have two 2-gallon emitters providing water to each potted pygmy. I was watering every 2nd day, but recently changed it to every 5th day. I think I'll put it back down to every 2nd or 3rd day. Also, I only have it watering for about 25 minutes or so each time -- I'm guessing I should increase that time since the plants probably aren't getting that deep water they need. One other thing I noticed, is the soil is very well draining for the potted pygmies because the water comes out of the base of the pot pretty quickly, so I'm thinking of changing to four 1-gallon emitters so that it doesn't rush out as fast.

I have four 2-gallon emitters around the Foxtail palm and am thinking of putting the same number of emitters of the same 2-gallon capacity around the King palms.

Depending on your soil, this seems like a lot for your Foxtail. They like water, but hate soggy cold feet. Just my opinion. I've found they are pretty tricky for me.

[rsproule]

For me, the best way to know if I am watering the right amount is too stick my fingers in the soil in between watering days. For the majority of palms the the soil should be moist, but not mucky or dry. If it's moist the soil will stick together when you squeeze a handful of it. Adjust your irrigation until you get the right level of moisture. Mixing clay with sand is not recommended. It seems like it would be a good idea, but apparently it is not. Google "should I mix clay with sand". Here's one of many articles on the subject: http://patwelsh.com/wpmu/blog/soils/never-add-clay-to-sand-or-sand-to-clay.

In some ways clay is great, It holds nutrients & water. For planting I mix 2 parts clay with one part high quality black planting soil (I use "San Diego Select" from A1 Soils, a local soil & mulch yard). I also add a little gypsum & perlite. This makes it soft enough for the new roots to penetrate, and it has decent drainage. In general I find it harder to grow healthy plants in San Diego than in Northern California. I think it may the lousy hard water we have.

[Josh-O]

Then I'd lose some of the pygmy dates...there's so many species you can grow there! You need to introduce your wife to some of those.

agreed!!!

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Then I'd lose some of the pygmy dates...there's so many species you can grow there! You need to introduce your wife to some of those.

agreed!!!

If I had my way, the three large pygmy date palms that she wanted would be gone........... The yard is just too small to have that many

Edited May 9, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Right now I have two 2-gallon emitters providing water to each potted pygmy. I was watering every 2nd day, but recently changed it to every 5th day. I think I'll put it back down to every 2nd or 3rd day. Also, I only have it watering for about 25 minutes or so each time -- I'm guessing I should increase that time since the plants probably aren't getting that deep water they need. One other thing I noticed, is the soil is very well draining for the potted pygmies because the water comes out of the base of the pot pretty quickly, so I'm thinking of changing to four 1-gallon emitters so that it doesn't rush out as fast.

I have four 2-gallon emitters around the Foxtail palm and am thinking of putting the same number of emitters of the same 2-gallon capacity around the King palms.

Depending on your soil, this seems like a lot for your Foxtail. They like water, but hate soggy cold feet. Just my opinion. I've found they are pretty tricky for me.

So if I'm going to run them on same drip irrigation timer as all the other palms, I should change some of the 2-gallon emitters to 1-gallon maybe?

[xxxSDESDExxx]

For me, the best way to know if I am watering the right amount is too stick my fingers in the soil in between watering days. For the majority of palms the the soil should be moist, but not mucky or dry. If it's moist the soil will stick together when you squeeze a handful of it. Adjust your irrigation until you get the right level of moisture. Mixing clay with sand is not recommended. It seems like it would be a good idea, but apparently it is not. Google "should I mix clay with sand". Here's one of many articles on the subject: http://patwelsh.com/wpmu/blog/soils/never-add-clay-to-sand-or-sand-to-clay.

In some ways clay is great, It holds nutrients & water. For planting I mix 2 parts clay with one part high quality black planting soil (I use "San Diego Select" from A1 Soils, a local soil & mulch yard). I also add a little gypsum & perlite. This makes it soft enough for the new roots to penetrate, and it has decent drainage. In general I find it harder to grow healthy plants in San Diego than in Northern California. I think it may the lousy hard water we have.

Thank you very much for this information. I will avoid mixing the sand with the clay in the future and instead use soil amenders such as perelite or gypsum in the future.

[xxxSDESDExxx]

Any more thoughts on the water? If you're in San Diego (or in any similar climate)

1) How many drip emitters would you put around each plant, and at what flow rate?

2) How long would you run the drip irrigation system? 20 minutes, 45 minutes, 1 hour, or something else?

3) How often would you water? Every 3rd day, every 2nd day, once a week, or something else?

=====================================================================

Reminder of what I have and updated since I put the large pygmies into the ground.

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Type of plants that I have and whether they're in the ground or not:

- I have two King Palm trees that are recent transplants that are between 15-20 feet tall that are in the ground. (Planted in clay/sand/cactus & palm mix)

- I have one approximately 6 ft tall Foxtail Palm planted in the ground. (Planted in clay/cactus & palm mix)

- I have recently transplanted 2 double pygmy date palms that were in 25 gallon containers (these plants are fairly large). (They were planted in clay/cactus & palm mix)

- I have recently transplanted a single pygmy date palm that was from a 25 gallon container (It was planted in clay/cactus & palm mix)

- I have 3 single 15 gallon pygmy date palms that were transplanted into decorative 20 gallon pots -- they will remain in these pots unless you guys recommend that I move them (Planted in cactus & palm mix)

- I have 2 15 gallon bougainvilleas that are still in their original pots. (Has original soil it came with).

Edited May 14, 2015 by xxxSDESDExxx