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Cold Front 2015 - Surprise!


gsytch

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A pretty amazing shot of record-setting cold up north in Mississippi. My weather station in Natchez bottomed out at 17.8 this morning. That ties for a ten-year low along with last winter. Difference is that last year was embedded in a long-term period of day-and-night below-freezing temps with snow, ice, you name it. This dropped right out of the north and the axis of the high was apparently somewhere over extreme north Louisiana, so the cold shot went down the east side of that spot. Southern Louisiana only went to low 20s, but New Orleans was mid-20s in town. Up in Oxford, MS (between Memphis and Tupelo) it was 7F when I looked this morning (their low was 6F), and which was identical to the temp in Minneapolis at the same time...to give you an idea. The cold seems to moderate east of Apalachicola even for tomorrow as the high drifts east...I guess it will either relax or lift northward. But now there is freezing rain and sleet in the forecast tomorrow a.m. for the coastal areas of Louisiana spreading up through most of the state and in the lower SW triangle of Mississippi for tomorrow a.m.

We're feeling chilly down here in the Keys, but with a low this morning of 61F, can't really complain, other than for the north wind...

Michael Norell

Rancho Mirage, California | 33°44' N 116°25' W | 287 ft | z10a | avg Jan 43/70F | Jul 78/108F avg | Weather Station KCARANCH310

previously Big Pine Key, Florida | 24°40' N 81°21' W | 4.5 ft. | z12a | Calcareous substrate | avg annual min. approx 52F | avg Jan 65/75F | Jul 83/90 | extreme min approx 41F

previously Natchez, Mississippi | 31°33' N 91°24' W | 220 ft.| z9a | Downtown/river-adjacent | Loess substrate | avg annual min. 23F | Jan 43/61F | Jul 73/93F | extreme min 2.5F (1899); previously Los Angeles, California (multiple locations)

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mnorrel- Interesting info, thanks for the updates. I'm always fascinated how everyone else is doing during one of these cold spells. One thing I've learned is that websites like weather.com and accuweather are way off from my own personal readings at home. According to those websites, they said my area would get down to 17. My temperatures gauges show a low of 12. Do you also find a discrepancy that ranges this much in your weather station/gauges compared to these weather websites? I suppose it all depends on location, microclimates, etc... But my home readings are never, ever the same as any of the weather website readings, rarely even close.

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mnorrel- Interesting info, thanks for the updates. I'm always fascinated how everyone else is doing during one of these cold spells. One thing I've learned is that websites like weather.com and accuweather are way off from my own personal readings at home. According to those websites, they said my area would get down to 17. My temperatures gauges show a low of 12. Do you also find a discrepancy that ranges this much in your weather station/gauges compared to these weather websites? I suppose it all depends on location, microclimates, etc... But my home readings are never, ever the same as any of the weather website readings, rarely even close.

Your home readings are of course the most important for your plants, but at the same time you need to remember to have a very accurate, radiation-shielded gauge placed in the correct location and height above ground. I use a VantagePro2, which is a certified gauge that can be used for continuous upload to weather services. These can be easily purchased online, and you register as a Citizens Weather station with NOAA and then are given a unique identifier/call-sign for your station. Your temperature, wind, and whatever other data you meter are uploaded to NOAA (though they don't use it in their official forecasts or reporting info on the main weather service site), and to whatever other services you register with (e.g., Wunderground, WeatherBug, et al.) If you're not familiar with it, you need to be looking at Weather Underground and their WunderMap, which shows you every official as well as registered personal weather station around the globe. it is continually updated with "live" info and you can compare the temps over very narrow areas in real time, sometimes with very surprising results. IMHO it is well worth the money to invest (around $600 usually) in such a piece of equipment and sign up with these services. Plus, you are providing a valuable service to others who can benefit from your station's data. I have used one for ten years and I feel it has provided invaluable information to me.

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Michael Norell

Rancho Mirage, California | 33°44' N 116°25' W | 287 ft | z10a | avg Jan 43/70F | Jul 78/108F avg | Weather Station KCARANCH310

previously Big Pine Key, Florida | 24°40' N 81°21' W | 4.5 ft. | z12a | Calcareous substrate | avg annual min. approx 52F | avg Jan 65/75F | Jul 83/90 | extreme min approx 41F

previously Natchez, Mississippi | 31°33' N 91°24' W | 220 ft.| z9a | Downtown/river-adjacent | Loess substrate | avg annual min. 23F | Jan 43/61F | Jul 73/93F | extreme min 2.5F (1899); previously Los Angeles, California (multiple locations)

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My yard..........Ground Zero.......almost want to quit this nonsense....growing palms

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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My yard..........Ground Zero.......almost want to quit this nonsense....growing palms

I'm sorry to hear that.

It looks like you lost the competition.

Edited by Jimbean

Brevard County, Fl

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David, the concept of palm growing down here is not the problem. The problem is that we all want the look of more tropical palms. All kinds of palms are fine in cold shots like this.... Sabals, phoenix, trachys butias etc. but that's not the look we are after!

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David, I've been in your shoes before. There's nothing anyone here or anywhere can tell you to make it better. That said, spring is around the corner and you'll get back out there with renewed vigor. It's in your blood now. Make some changes where needed and try again.

Tampa, Interbay Peninsula, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10A

Bokeelia, Pine Island, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10B

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Oh lovely, low tomorrow morning of 34 with possibility of freezing rain tomorrow morning, then turning to rain. And the morning after that a low of 29. Almost like last winter all over again.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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It looks like you lost the competition.

I was saying that on the lighter note. I was not trying to rub it in or anything.

Brevard County, Fl

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Oh lovely, low tomorrow morning of 34 with possibility of freezing rain tomorrow morning, then turning to rain. And the morning after that a low of 29. Almost like last winter all over again.

Yeah I saw that. That will make things interesting.

Brevard County, Fl

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David,

I know how you feel, when I had my palm collection in St Pete in the 80's I wanted to give up many times as a lot of us can remember how bad the 80's were in terms of severe freezes. But every time I would lose something, which was a lot, I would just replant. I just could not get a coconut to trunk, and I was there 9 years as I would just lose them. Remember it's just a hobby and you can only do what you, and enjoy it while you can as life it too short as it is.

Lived in Cape Coral, Miami, Orlando and St. Petersburg Florida.

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David,

I know how you feel, when I had my palm collection in St Pete in the 80's I wanted to give up many times as a lot of us can remember how bad the 80's were in terms of severe freezes. But every time I would lose something, which was a lot, I would just replant. I just could not get a coconut to trunk, and I was there 9 years as I would just lose them. Remember it's just a hobby and you can only do what you, and enjoy it while you can as life it too short as it is.

I bet it seems really funny to see the huge Jamaican talls at Kopsick after you had so much trouble with them for an entire decade.

Keith 

Palmetto, Florida (10a) and Tampa, Florida (9b/10a)

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Yes Keith I agree, I was about 5 miles inland from Kopsick and I remember when those coconuts were planted as I was one of the people working on Kopsick at the time.

Lived in Cape Coral, Miami, Orlando and St. Petersburg Florida.

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mnorrel- Interesting info, thanks for the updates. I'm always fascinated how everyone else is doing during one of these cold spells. One thing I've learned is that websites like weather.com and accuweather are way off from my own personal readings at home. According to those websites, they said my area would get down to 17. My temperatures gauges show a low of 12. Do you also find a discrepancy that ranges this much in your weather station/gauges compared to these weather websites? I suppose it all depends on location, microclimates, etc... But my home readings are never, ever the same as any of the weather website readings, rarely even close.

Just as in Real Estate , Location , Location , Location .

Years ago , on a 5 acre property that I owned , I did a temperature survey on a cold January morning .

It was still and stable , and at about 6:30 am , I found 10 deg difference on that one property.

Each town or area generally has only one officially reported station . You just have to know your own

microclimate.

Here in Daytona Beach , the official station is at the main airport. That location is not representative for

80% of the town .

I enjoy using the Private Weather Stations on The Weather Underground . They're a good way to see the

range of conditions in an area , and can help to focus on your own microclimate.

I have seen as much as 17-20 deg difference from my micro to the NWS at the airport. At those times , I am

warmer for the Low , and colder for the High . Overall diff averages about 3 deg. It's 2 miles from me but

away from the water , and west of a ridge in a type of area that the old time weathermen used to call

" the pockets and mucklands".

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My yard..........Ground Zero.......almost want to quit this nonsense....growing palms

David.. It looks as though it was a very dry event.. I just looked at your dewpoints and they are below 10F. I understand you are near the coast but your humidity is also very low as well.

Overall it looks like this was a very quick event at any rate. I would be watering right now to try and replace the water from the dry wind. Desication could be from water loss and not actual freeze damage...

Your yard is awesome..

Edited by SailorBold

wxBanner?bannertype=wu_clean2day_cond&pw

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David, hopefully on a brighter note, how did everything do under your pool screening?

Zone 9b (formerly listed as Zone 9a); Sunset 14

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Thanks everybody....just griping...It will be fine...on the big stuff, last year already culled out the weaklings. Just hate to see damaged fronds again for the whole summer. Still early, but it appears that outright deaths will be minimal and probably on some of the smaller stuff.

Jimmie, yes....very dry cold winds, something you know a lot about. We are expected to get rain this weekend and light freezes tonight and tomorrow night....so maybe water on Sat. or Sun. if no rain. Or do you think it is wise to water sooner if freezes are expected for the next two nights....this might be a good topic for discussion. Thanks for the yard complement even though its hard to look at, at the moment. Spring will bring new life.

Yes, the private weather stations are great...use them for several nearby locations.

No worries JimBeam....didn't take it wrong.

Ray.....understand....replaced queens with Mules and C. alba's with Brahea "clara" ..... will see if it was a good move after this winter.

Yes, would have hated the 80's from what you old timers have said.

Shirley.....think it did ok....the tarp took a beating from the wind and kind of slid back off the water on the front....hopefully it still stayed above freezing under there.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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You know the good thing about these cold spells is that you get to see what is hardy at what temperature and what is not.

Brevard County, Fl

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David, hang in there, I feel your pain... we went through a scare here two weeks ago as well...

I'm wondering about your pool area - it looks like that's where your most tender stuff is at. It looks somewhat enclosed - would a gas patio heater make any difference there? If it helps to elevate the temps just a few degrees by keeping it going through the night, it might at least help the most tender species... But it may not work so well with the winds, I don't know.

qualty_stainless_steel_gas_patio_heater_

Edited by Pando
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You know the good thing about these cold spells is that you get to see what is hardy at what temperature and what is not.

Yep, I even left a few test plants unprotected here and there.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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As long as it doesn’t get to cold, this is a good time to see where your microclimates are located and take avenge of those special places.

I’ve noticed this winter that some of my warmest spot have been where I would have never guess.

Even some of my overhead canopy places got colder than some place that are open. Real eye opener. But than again not every winter is the same here.

Really surprised with some of the lows I’m seeing inland in the S.E. … doesn’t look like it will stay around to long.

We had all are cold spells back in Nov. and December. Don’t what to see anymore this winter. :innocent:

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Pando ...got two little electric oscillating space heaters under there. They have been running for about 24 hours now. They are a big help in keeping the temps up. Got Dypsis cabadae and C. macrocarpa as well as some smaller plants like Licuala dasyantha and Dypsis ambositrae? Licuala grandis and some other stuff.

Expecting upper 20's tonight ....no wind......below freezing for 12 hours....brrr

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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David, the concept of palm growing down here is not the problem. The problem is that we all want the look of more tropical palms. All kinds of palms are fine in cold shots like this.... Sabals, phoenix, trachys butias etc. but that's not the look we are after!

Troipicdoc, I like your perspective

Carlsbad, California Zone 10 B on the hill (402 ft. elevation)

Sunset zone 24

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Pando ...got two little electric oscillating space heaters under there. They have been running for about 24 hours now. They are a big help in keeping the temps up. Got Dypsis cabadae and C. macrocarpa as well as some smaller plants like Licuala dasyantha and Dypsis ambositrae? Licuala grandis and some other stuff.

Expecting upper 20's tonight ....no wind......below freezing for 12 hours....brrr

David, I'm wishing you and everyone else who is experiencing this cold snap in Florida, Louisiana ETC the very best!! We just went through our cold snap here in California last week and was a bit stressful for allot of people here.

Carlsbad, California Zone 10 B on the hill (402 ft. elevation)

Sunset zone 24

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mnorell- That's a lot of money, but I could definitely see myself investing in something like that in the future. The thing that gets me though is the number of temperature variances in different places of a yard. The scientist in me would want to install at least a few! Thanks for the invaluable insight. I looked up the VantagePro and will do a little more research. I'll stick with the medieval AcuRite temperature gauges, for now (Haha).

Bill- Very interesting stuff. That's fascinating- 10 degree differential. I dont even see that difference in my area. I'm in a cold sink and about 2 miles up the road is a large lake. Just now, for instance, it was 7 degrees warmer near the lake than where I was. But a 10 degree difference on a plot of land like you had is crazy. Columbia uses their airport as well for the official weather station. It's positioned at a really low elevation and generally there is not a whole lot around it that would create even the slightest urban heat effect (or whatever it's called). So it's usually colder as well. A fellow palm guy in my area told me about wunderground not too long ago as well- It's a lot closer in accuracy to my readings.

And it's funny you bring up the real estate reference... I've recently began a house search. Going to be even more difficult to try to find a place at the right elevation and hopefully, as close to a body of water as possible!

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I hit 46 Thursday morning. I'm at 63 right now (Friday 3:00 am) so not too bad. This front moved quickly.

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Pando ...got two little electric oscillating space heaters under there. They have been running for about 24 hours now. They are a big help in keeping the temps up. Got Dypsis cabadae and C. macrocarpa as well as some smaller plants like Licuala dasyantha and Dypsis ambositrae? Licuala grandis and some other stuff.

Expecting upper 20's tonight ....no wind......below freezing for 12 hours....brrr

David, I'm wishing you and everyone else who is experiencing this cold snap in Florida, Louisiana ETC the very best!! We just went through our cold snap here in California last week and was a bit stressful for allot of people here.

Thanks Josh. It sucks, be we have definitely seen worse. With a little luck, this may be the last we see of sub-freezing temps this year.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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briefly hit a low of 22 for bout 5 minutes on Pcola beach Thursday morning and when the winds calmed the island effect took hold last night keeping temps above freezing. Left out a few 5 gal Pseudophoenix sargentii, a 7 gal Kentiopsis oliviformis a 15 gal Beccariophoenix alfredii and a few 5 gal Dypsis decipiens. The things I freaking do in the name of science.... my small planted out D. ambositrae is the only palm as of now that I can see will defoliate.

Edited by Xhoniwaters1

Tyler

Coastal Zone 9a

''Karma is a good girl, she just treats you exactly how you treat her"

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You know the good thing about these cold spells is that you get to see what is hardy at what temperature and what is not.

I prefer to think of my garden as a palm torture chamber. That way I sleep good at night knowing a job well done.

Ed in Houston

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Lol

30 low this am...its. moving on out

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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We bottomed at 36 this morning, but they are calling for a wet 30 tomorrow morning.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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Keith are you buying that forecast? We were forecast for 30 this AM, and only went to 36.

I am guessing, hoping we'll come in at 32 or higher. It would be nice to not have ice in the crowns. Although at this point, even 30 would not really have an impact. All of the tender stuff is melted down from the 24 degree night. It would be nice to not have ice in the crowns.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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It's going to get colder, apparently.

Have a nice weekend.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/winter-storm-freezes-much-of-us/ss-BBhAzRI#image=12

I'm NOT gloating, still inspecting for damage on my babies . . . . :badday:

Let's keep our forum fun and friendly.

Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or lost profits or revenue, claims by third parties or for other similar costs, or any special, incidental, or consequential damages arising out of my opinion or the use of this data. The accuracy or reliability of the data is not guaranteed or warranted in any way and I disclaim liability of any kind whatsoever, including, without limitation, liability for quality, performance, merchantability and fitness for a particular purpose arising out of the use, or inability to use my data. Other terms may apply.

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Keith are you buying that forecast? We were forecast for 30 this AM, and only went to 36.

I am guessing, hoping we'll come in at 32 or higher. It would be nice to not have ice in the crowns. Although at this point, even 30 would not really have an impact. All of the tender stuff is melted down from the 24 degree night. It would be nice to not have ice in the crowns.

Just raised projected low to 31. COME ON, JUST 2 MORE DEGREES.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

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Tuscaloosa, Alabama.

Single digits, from MSN.com

post-208-0-01632800-1420829805_thumb.jpg

Let's keep our forum fun and friendly.

Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or lost profits or revenue, claims by third parties or for other similar costs, or any special, incidental, or consequential damages arising out of my opinion or the use of this data. The accuracy or reliability of the data is not guaranteed or warranted in any way and I disclaim liability of any kind whatsoever, including, without limitation, liability for quality, performance, merchantability and fitness for a particular purpose arising out of the use, or inability to use my data. Other terms may apply.

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Current forecast has us between 30-33 for tonight and dry.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

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