Humic Acid - Enough Organics?

[joe_OC]

So I have been using black lava rocks for mulch for a while now. It was suggested to me to keep mulching, But, I find it difficult with the thick layer of mulch already in place. So, I have been employing humic acid to add organics to the soil. I also add kelp and fish emulsion. Is this enough or do I still need more organics?

Thanks in advance,

Joe

[_Keith]

This is a very interesting question. I did some research on this a while. After I get a few min to review I will reply in-depth. One question in the meantime is what kind of soil did you start with?

[sonoranfans]

My philosophy is that I don't count humic acid as bulk organics because it can be rinsed from soil and or it will decompose and need to be added every 3-4 months. Humic is a great addition to clay or sandy soils along with some mulching. One of the critical functions of organic material is to increase cation exchange capacity in sandy soils, clay soils have a pretty good cation exchange capacity as long as they are not too high in calcium. A second function of organics is to slow excessive drainage, clay doesn't have excessive drainage issues generally, but may have pH issues. There might not be much need for organic material(mulch) in clay soils. Humic acid acts to chelate or stabilize nutrients outside their typically active pH ranges, so its a good safeguard for clay or sand. If pH is too high, sulfur is the best approach for controlling high pH in clay soil. Mulching in areas that get no rain can be very slow or unproductive in getting the organics down into the soil where they can help. Organics that sit on top in a dry environment tend to dry out and blow away. In clay soils that are in a dry environment, soil amendment on planting is my approach and then feed and add humic acid periodically. In my sandy florida soil, annual mulching is quite productive, gets down into the soil and once where it was just sand now has dirt and earthworms.

Edited October 22, 2013 by sonoranfans

[cajuntropics]

IMHO mulch(not rocks) is the best way to increase organic matter in any soil be it sand or clay. After ph, the most critical thing is carbon to nirogen ratio. If you're using a mulch that is high in carbon(wood or wood chips) then you'd need to add extra nitrogen(blood meal,cottonseed meal,etc.). You could use ammonium nitrate but we are talking organics here. Keep in mind also that wood,pine straw,oak leaves,etc. are all acidic and may need extra liming in the future...

[joe_OC]

IMHO mulch(not rocks) is the best way to increase organic matter in any soil be it sand or clay. After ph, the most critical thing is carbon to nirogen ratio. If you're using a mulch that is high in carbon(wood or wood chips) then you'd need to add extra nitrogen(blood meal,cottonseed meal,etc.). You could use ammonium nitrate but we are talking organics here. Keep in mind also that wood,pine straw,oak leaves,etc. are all acidic and may need extra liming in the future...

Hi Cajun,

The rocks as mulch is purely for heat retention and aesthetics. I was mulching with organic compost, 2-3 times a year for over 4 years. My soil is pretty well conditioned now. It is a clay based soil, but drains rather well. Ideally, I would keep mulching with compost, but I got tired of laying down 10 cubic yards at a time, by myself. I will keep my regiment of humic acid / fish / kelp, spraying this combination every quarter. I also use grow more and Apex Palm plus synthetic fertilizer.

[cajuntropics]

IMHO mulch(not rocks) is the best way to increase organic matter in any soil be it sand or clay. After ph, the most critical thing is carbon to nirogen ratio. If you're using a mulch that is high in carbon(wood or wood chips) then you'd need to add extra nitrogen(blood meal,cottonseed meal,etc.). You could use ammonium nitrate but we are talking organics here. Keep in mind also that wood,pine straw,oak leaves,etc. are all acidic and may need extra liming in the future...

Hi Cajun,

The rocks as mulch is purely for heat retention and aesthetics. I was mulching with organic compost, 2-3 times a year for over 4 years. My soil is pretty well conditioned now. It is a clay based soil, but drains rather well. Ideally, I would keep mulching with compost, but I got tired of laying down 10 cubic yards at a time, by myself. I will keep my regiment of humic acid / fish / kelp, spraying this combination every quarter. I also use grow more and Apex Palm plus synthetic fertilizer.

Hello there Joe, I use rocks in some areas myself for the same reason although they also give up some minerals with weathering over time. It sounds like you have a good regiment going, as long as the results are positive. I use mostly the bails of pine straw and also the pine bark nuggets though I'm not sure if you have these availible in your area. To this I add blood meal,bone meal greensand,K-mag and the occasional dose of Carl Pool palm fert. Not too fond of the liquids here as we can get 80 inches of rain in some years!

[MattyB]

Joe, now that you have all that compost down, if you switch to a chunkier mulch it'll last longer and you won't have to put as much down. Compost disappears pretty quickly.

[joe_OC]

Joe, now that you have all that compost down, if you switch to a chunkier mulch it'll last longer and you won't have to put as much down. Compost disappears pretty quickly.

Matt, the rocks are my mulch now. I was just thinking about your advice earlier to keep adding organics.

[Phoenikakias]

My philosophy is that I don't count humic acid as bulk organics because it can be rinsed from soil and or it will decompose and need to be added every 3-4 months. Humic is a great addition to clay or sandy soils along with some mulching. One of the critical functions of organic material is to increase cation exchange capacity in sandy soils, clay soils have a pretty good cation exchange capacity as long as they are not too high in calcium. A second function of organics is to slow excessive drainage, clay doesn't have excessive drainage issues generally, but may have pH issues. There might not be much need for organic material(mulch) in clay soils. Humic acid acts to chelate or stabilize nutrients outside their typically active pH ranges, so its a good safeguard for clay or sand. If pH is too high, sulfur is the best approach for controlling high pH in clay soil. Mulching in areas that get no rain can be very slow or unproductive in getting the organics down into the soil where they can help. Organics that sit on top in a dry environment tend to dry out and blow away. In clay soils that are in a dry environment, soil amendment on planting is my approach and then feed and add humic acid periodically. In my sandy florida soil, annual mulching is quite productive, gets down into the soil and once where it was just sand now has dirt and earthworms.

Tom, you have all my respect!!!!

[MattyB]

Joe, now that you have all that compost down, if you switch to a chunkier mulch it'll last longer and you won't have to put as much down. Compost disappears pretty quickly.

Matt, the rocks are my mulch now. I was just thinking about your advice earlier to keep adding organics.

Oh I see, you have a solid layer of rocks. Yeah, I think what I suggested before is to apply some more fine compost on top and it'll work it's way down and in.

[_Keith]

So, you likely already know that Humic Acids are not fertilizers, Fertilizers are analyzed on the basis of their value of Nitrogen, Phosphorus and Potassium or Potash (N-P-K) plus minors. Humic Acids are analyzed on the basis of their content of humus which is what you get when compost breaks down, kinda. Your combination of Humic acid/fish/kelp (all organic) sounds ideal provided you have proper soil structure (mostly indicated by internal drainage) to create a soil food web. The Humic acid will help with soil structure on clay, too. That food web activity is what breaks all of that stuff down into forms that the palm can use.

In the end it is really all about the palm health and growth. If you have that you are doing it right.