Palmtalk on Facebook

[_Keith]

For those on Facebook, just a reminder that it is out there.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Palm-Talk/449928175242?hc_location=stream

[Kris]

thanks keith.

[Ciczi in Sweden]

[DoomsDave]

No Facebook for me, thanks.

[tank]

I just started a Face Book profile posing as Dave, using pictures from palm talk!

Hurray for the internet.

LOL

[Dypsisdean]

Still not ready for primetime if you value your privacy - these two snafus in the last two weeks.

June 21, 2013 - Facebook Says Technical Flaw Exposed 6 Million Users
Facebook has inadvertently exposed six million users’ phone numbers and e-mail addresses to unauthorized viewers over the last year, the company said late Friday.

July 1, 2013 - Norton uncovers Facebook app privacy breach
Security software from Norton exposed a gaping privacy hole in the Facebook for Android app that sends a user’s mobile-phone number across the internet – without consent – to Facebook servers.

[_Keith]

Dean, I understand your choice and respect your decision, but data breaches could hardly be a reason not to use a service like FB, or even Palmtalk. At least on those sites we have the choice of what data we put on them..

Perhaps we should not use big merchants

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/california/25M-californians-Exposed-in-Data-Breaches-214141151.html

Perhaps we should not get health care or health insurance

http://www.hhs.gov/ocr/privacy/hipaa/administrative/breachnotificationrule/breachtool.html

Perhaps we should not stay at hotels

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/26/wyndham-credit-card-breach_n_1628005.html

Or use credit cards at all.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/03/30/technology/credit-card-data-breach/index.htm

We should not serve in the military or file any paperwork with the government

http://www.nextgov.com/health/2011/01/report-military-and-government-data-breached-104-times-in-2010/48265/

Bottom line, data is always at risk, and the more data and the more valuable the data, the more at risk it is. And there have been, and will continue to be data breaches, many of far more valuable information than the picture I put on FB of the palms in my garden.

[DoomsDave]

Trouble is, Facebook combines all of that into one giant conspiracy. They gather, or try to gather, all they can about you, and try to bamboozle you into allowing it to be sold to anyone. Anyone.

Just as bad as banks. Privacy settings? SNORT

[Dypsisdean]

Dean, I understand your choice and respect your decision

Yes Keith - as I do yours.

I have never said don't use FaceBook, only that you should know exactly what you are getting yourself into. Having what you designated as private info getting compromised is only the tip of the iceberg. As Dave alluded to, just having your "private" cell number referenced with anything and everything associated with it, paints a "picture" of your life that you never made the "choice" to share with them.

With tentacles everywhere, just by demanding my cell phone number, before I could hook PalmTalk into their network, they apparently ended up with a dossier of my entire life (and I gave them a fake name) - from the "friends/people" I may know, to the products and services I could use. And I never "posted" one thing. So, you may think "we have the choice of what data" we give them - I would argue that is not so.

In addition, with cookies placed on your machine, the ability to track your cell phone with the apps installed, and the ability to mine "private" info even from the photos you post, they end up with info about your life and habits that the NSA would envy. But since they can be compelled to share it with the NSA....

And when Google admits to hacking into Safari to track Mac users, who knows what else these companies are really doing. I'm sure they would like to install cameras in your home to better "help" you find products and services you would find useful. But now they can track your face across all the photos ever posted on the web anyway - so that's almost as good.

But when potential employers start asking for your FaceBook password - I'll just sum up the entire situation in one word - "creepy."

[Walter John]

I don't get it Dean and others, I am an FB user, I have created Groups and pages, in particular groups for palm genera or locales, and not once did I have to add my mobile phone number, email address yes, same for PT and any other community based forum where you have to log into, but never a phone number. In FB I get the opportunity to bring non palm people into being palm people, at least expose them every now and then to palmy wonders. To each his own, I'm sure Big Brother can tap in wherever and whenever he wants anyway, life's too short.

[Hammer]

or file any paperwork with the government

Now that is something I could support!

Edit: this didn't quote properly. I was trying to quote from _Keith.

Mod Edit: Fixed it for you

[JT in Japan]

I don't get it Dean and others, I am an FB user, I have created Groups and pages, in particular groups for palm genera or locales, and not once did I have to add my mobile phone number, email address yes, same for PT and any other community based forum where you have to log into, but never a phone number. In FB I get the opportunity to bring non palm people into being palm people, at least expose them every now and then to palmy wonders. To each his own, I'm sure Big Brother can tap in wherever and whenever he wants anyway, life's too short.

Wal, it could be that you're not yet using a smartphone to access FB. If you were, as many of us are, a phone number is required (I believe).

For me the bottom line with all social interaction online, even if you don't want anyone knowing about that bankruptcy in the 90s, someone does. Even if you don't want marketers knowing your online shopping habits, they do. The smaller stuff is up to you: If you don't want your wife and friends knowing you're a fool-around cad, don't put up snaps of you and the girlfriend in Aruga for the weekend. If you don't want people knowing you're a palm freak or a closet cat-lover, don't talk about palms or cats. But if people knowing that stuff doesn't really matter, then go ahead and enjoy life. And engage with others, even online.

JT

[Dypsisdean]

I don't get it Dean and others, I am an FB user, I have created Groups and pages, in particular groups for palm genera or locales, and not once did I have to add my mobile phone number, email address yes, same for PT and any other community based forum where you have to log into, but never a phone number. In FB I get the opportunity to bring non palm people into being palm people, at least expose them every now and then to palmy wonders. To each his own, I'm sure Big Brother can tap in wherever and whenever he wants anyway, life's too short.

Wal, it could be that you're not yet using a smartphone to access FB. If you were, as many of us are, a phone number is required (I believe).

For me the bottom line with all social interaction online, even if you don't want anyone knowing about that bankruptcy in the 90s, someone does. Even if you don't want marketers knowing your online shopping habits, they do. The smaller stuff is up to you: If you don't want your wife and friends knowing you're a fool-around cad, don't put up snaps of you and the girlfriend in Aruga for the weekend. If you don't want people knowing you're a palm freak or a closet cat-lover, don't talk about palms or cats. But if people knowing that stuff doesn't really matter, then go ahead and enjoy life. And engage with others, even online.

JT

How about your political and religious views, or involvement in political or religious organizations? I worry that some government agency might use that info to target people that have opposing political persuasions. But I'm probably being too paranoid.

[_Keith]

Dean, you have every right to be paranoid. I am too, but at this point, and assuming that at any point we only know a small portion of what is actually being collected and by whom, I am just not sure there is any point to being paranoid any more. If it was ever digital on FB, PT, in a credit card transaction or any electronic transaction, if you got a drivers license, bought property, got a permit, logged onto a website, used a phone, cable company, or ISP, well I could go on forever, but if it was ever digital, multiple parties both commercial and governmental have it and are saving, tracking and using it. My only prayer at this point is that they only use it to try to sell me something.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

No, please, don't take PalmTalk to Facebook! Facebook is a locked in platform like Apple. Keep PalmTalk an independent forum. Anytime a service is free, there's a reason why it's free - they are collecting your personal data and selling it. There's no free lunch.

Please keep PalmTalk out of Facebook!!! It's fine as it is.

[_Keith]

No, please, don't take PalmTalk to Facebook! Facebook is a locked in platform like Apple. Keep PalmTalk an independent forum. Anytime a service is free, there's a reason why it's free - they are collecting your personal data and selling it. There's no free lunch.

Please keep PalmTalk out of Facebook!!! It's fine as it is.

Axel, PT is not migrating to FB, but there is already a PalmTalk page on Facebook. Any successful group today cannot ignore social media, but also on social media there is no forced participation.

And you are right that on FB, Gmail, or any other free site you are not the customer, you are the product. I personally see nothing wrong with that, so long as everyone is aware. These free services offer things that most could not afford, nor would be willing to pay for.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

No, please, don't take PalmTalk to Facebook! Facebook is a locked in platform like Apple. Keep PalmTalk an independent forum. Anytime a service is free, there's a reason why it's free - they are collecting your personal data and selling it. There's no free lunch.

Please keep PalmTalk out of Facebook!!! It's fine as it is.

Axel, PT is not migrating to FB, but there is already a PalmTalk page on Facebook. Any successful group today cannot ignore social media, but also on social media there is no forced participation.

And you are right that on FB, Gmail, or any other free site you are not the customer, you are the product. I personally see nothing wrong with that, so long as everyone is aware. These free services offer things that most could not afford, nor would be willing to pay for.

I am curious, who runs the PalmTalk page on Facebook?

[DoomsDave]

I don't get it Dean and others, I am an FB user, I have created Groups and pages, in particular groups for palm genera or locales, and not once did I have to add my mobile phone number, email address yes, same for PT and any other community based forum where you have to log into, but never a phone number. In FB I get the opportunity to bring non palm people into being palm people, at least expose them every now and then to palmy wonders. To each his own, I'm sure Big Brother can tap in wherever and whenever he wants anyway, life's too short.

Wal, it could be that you're not yet using a smartphone to access FB. If you were, as many of us are, a phone number is required (I believe).

For me the bottom line with all social interaction online, even if you don't want anyone knowing about that bankruptcy in the 90s, someone does. Even if you don't want marketers knowing your online shopping habits, they do. The smaller stuff is up to you: If you don't want your wife and friends knowing you're a fool-around cad, don't put up snaps of you and the girlfriend in Aruga for the weekend. If you don't want people knowing you're a palm freak or a closet cat-lover, don't talk about palms or cats. But if people knowing that stuff doesn't really matter, then go ahead and enjoy life. And engage with others, even online.

JT

How about your political and religious views, or involvement in political or religious organizations? I worry that some government agency might use that info to target people that have opposing political persuasions. But I'm probably being too paranoid.

You're not being paranoid. Read the link below. It's rather sobering, especially for people who visit Thailand to see the palms.

http://www.voanews.com/content/thai-court-jails-american-for-royal-insult-online-135238478/149265.html

"A court in Thailand has for the first time jailed an American citizen for insulting the Thai monarchy in blog postings made from the United States. U.S. authorities have called the two-and-a-half-year prison sentence "severe" and expressed concern about a string of recent prosecutions involving freedom of expression.

"Thailand’s criminal court Thursday found American citizen Joe Gordon guilty of insulting the Thai monarchy, a serious offense punishable by up to 15 years in prison.

"The court sentenced him to five years in prison, reduced to two years and six months because he changed his plea to guilty in hopes of leniency.

"Gordon was arrested in May for allegedly translating parts of a locally-banned book about the Thai monarch and posting them online.

Although he was born in Thailand and also goes by the Thai name Lerpong Wichaikhammat, Gordon became a naturalized U.S. citizen and lived there for decades."

This looks like some serious [fecal material]. Note that Mr. Gordon didn't insult the king himself. He just translated a book written by someone else who, prosecutors said, insulted the king.

This gives me pause, guys. Keep your "The King is [expletive]" tee shirts and buttons at home.

[Kim]

No, please, don't take PalmTalk to Facebook! Facebook is a locked in platform like Apple. Keep PalmTalk an independent forum. Anytime a service is free, there's a reason why it's free - they are collecting your personal data and selling it. There's no free lunch.

Please keep PalmTalk out of Facebook!!! It's fine as it is.

Axel, PT is not migrating to FB, but there is already a PalmTalk page on Facebook. Any successful group today cannot ignore social media, but also on social media there is no forced participation.

And you are right that on FB, Gmail, or any other free site you are not the customer, you are the product. I personally see nothing wrong with that, so long as everyone is aware. These free services offer things that most could not afford, nor would be willing to pay for.

I am curious, who runs the PalmTalk page on Facebook?

There are a number of Admins from the membership here who respond to questions and contribute content.

Edit: For those who don't do FaceBook, the PalmTalk page on FB currently features photos of the Palmetum of Santa Cruz, Tenerife, with links to PalmTalk threads on the subject of its imminent opening. The FaceBook presence is intended to increase awareness of the International Palm Society worldwide.

[Darold Petty]

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/09/20/100920fa_fact_vargas?currentPage=all

I would never trust this person to do the right thing with other person's information.

[Dypsisdean]

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/09/20/100920fa_fact_vargas?currentPage=all

I would never trust this person to do the right thing with other person's information.

Darold - Agreed - And to clarify a comment Wal made.

To each his own, I'm sure Big Brother can tap in wherever and whenever he wants anyway, life's too short.

I was suggesting a difference should be recognized between personal data that is mistakenly sent out over the internet to millions of people due to errors and/or inadequate oversight/safeguards (as in the articles I linked to), and personal data that hackers have to work at to access, or that is subpoenaed by authorities.

[palmmermaid]

I don't provide correct information about me personally on FB. I don't post about us being away unless someone is staying at our home. I delete items from my page after a month. I unlike people I find annoying. I don't accept every - even most - friend requests. And I certainly don't post any pictures I may regret later! Once it is on the internet it is there forever!