worm castings?

[Stevetoad]

Worm castings. has anyone used these with there palms. the people who sell them say there the best thing for plants since water. im a skeptic by nature.

[Gonzer]

Steve,

I was gonna tell you this in your fertilizer post; coffee grounds, lightly tilled into the surrounding soil are a magnet for earthworms. My soil is loaded with grounds from home and work. Sometimes the soil moves like in the movie 'Tremors' due to the amount of worms. Much cheaper way to get your earthworm sh I mean poo, than buying the castings.

[paulgila]

plus they're great on soups & salads!

[MattyB]

Worm castings are great organic fertilizer. Don't use them on potted palms because they are very dense and cause the mix to go gooky.

[Stevetoad]

good info guys, i started using coffee grounds about 2 months ago. i have a ton of worms in my soil so i hope this keeps em happy

[MattyB]

Free coffee grounds are the way to go, budget-wise, and permaculture-wise. Worm castings aren't cheap.

[edric]

Hi Steve, for palms in the ground, but I would not put very much in the mix, for your small tillering Dypsis, but I'm sure you already new that, Ed

[Stevetoad]

Hi Steve, for palms in the ground, but I would not put very much in the mix, for your small tillering Dypsis, but I'm sure you already new that, Ed

i know nothin' about nothin'

[MattyB]

you're gonna want to break the heal off and open it up like the lid to a yogurt container, pour the worm castings inside, and then just throw away the top of the heal, because you really messed it up now and it's worthless. Then take lots of pictures of your palm, because the rate of change is going to be dramatic from here on out.

[edric]

Sorry Matty, I type so slow, all those posts were while I was sitting here typing, Ed

[MattyB]

No need to apologise Ed, you're info is valuable. I was just being snarky to Steve in the meantime.

[Stevetoad]

No need to apologise Ed, you're info is valuable. I was just being snarky to Steve in the meantime.

Sir snarksalot of spring valley

[Gonzer]

to go gooky.

Now THERE'S a classic word! That certain horticultural nomenclature that's not in a book but 'sez it all.

[rprimbs]

good info guys, i started using coffee grounds about 2 months ago. i have a ton of worms in my soil so i hope this keeps em happy

I've heard that you've got to be careful with coffee grounds. I'm a member of the California Rare Fruit Growers club -- even though I haven't been to a meeting in a while -- and there was an article in the monthly magazine about coffee grounds. The author found that the coffee grounds were actually toxic and stunted the growth of plants in pots. Some people argued that they had good results with coffee grounds and others agreed that they were toxic. As he studied it more he found that fresh coffee grounds were toxic but composted coffee grounds were beneficial.

I think that it's probably best to compost them first.

[Stevetoad]

good info guys, i started using coffee grounds about 2 months ago. i have a ton of worms in my soil so i hope this keeps em happy

I've heard that you've got to be careful with coffee grounds. I'm a member of the California Rare Fruit Growers club -- even though I haven't been to a meeting in a while -- and there was an article in the monthly magazine about coffee grounds. The author found that the coffee grounds were actually toxic and stunted the growth of plants in pots. Some people argued that they had good results with coffee grounds and others agreed that they were toxic. As he studied it more he found that fresh coffee grounds were toxic but composted coffee grounds were beneficial.

I think that it's probably best to compost them first.

thats not good! ive been putting them on top of the soil around my palms.... has anyone else heard this before?

[Got Palms]

I've been using them for years with great results, straight from the pot to the ground. Star bucks will give u all thier grounds for free!

[MattyB]

Lay em on top and they break down just like wood chips. Neither of them are good tilled in, but on top is ok

[JANAIY]

I still don't get it:  are earthworm castings good in potted young palms or what should I be using instead to stay away from chemicals and assist my young palms growth?? And what about mycorrhizae ?  I am new to exotic palms  and eager to learn so please be patient

Edited February 7, 2020 by JANAIY

[Darold Petty]

For seedling palms I use fish emulsion and kelp extract in the irrigation water.  This produces great results with Chamaedorea, Dypsis, Howea, and Rhopalostylis from seed.  I use this with each watering and the tiny seedlings are a healthy, dark green. 

[Silas_Sancona]

1 hour ago, Darold Petty said:

For seedling palms I use fish emulsion and kelp extract in the irrigation water.  This produces great results with Chamaedorea, Dypsis, Howea, and Rhopalostylis from seed.  I use this with each watering and the tiny seedlings are a healthy, dark green. 

Agree w/ Darold,  Fish emulsion/ Kelp extract work great for youngins,' and even older seedlings..  I also add stuff like Alfalfa, crab/shrimp/oyster shell, etc when fertilizing things.. Here, been adding leaf litter i collect when i trim our mesquites in late May/June to potted stuff also with some pretty good results thus far.. Has worked great as a seed cover also.

Last year, i ended up doing what i'd call an "accidental experiment" and applied some diluted, liquid palm fert i had to a few of my Sabal maurittiiformis i'd stepped up into 3gal pots, just to give them a spring boost.. Intended to feed all 4 but ran out before i gave the last one some food.. Needless to say, the 3 i used the liquid fert on burned badly over the summer, even though they all sit under shade cloth, all summer, right next to each other.

All of mine also stay outside, fully exposed to the elements all winter ( No direct sun where they sit this time of year. ) Right now, the 3 that were fertilized w/ the chemical stuff look terrible.. Might loose one. While we've had some cold mornings this year, very little frost, especially where they are situated on the patio. All 3 suffered pretty nasty additional damage. Single one i didn't feed w/ that stuff looks a lot better, even slowly pushing growth atm.. Same w/ the 2 com pots of other seedlings that sit just inside my shade house. All of them are nice and green and haven't suffered any damage either over the summer or during winter. Did not use that stuff on them. I noticed some burn on other stuff i'd used the same fert on over the summer also.

Lesson?.. While already adhere to it 95% of the time, No more using anything synthetic, even for a boost ..sticking solely w/ organics.. Proof of how they've worked for me is clear as daylight.

As far as using Coffee or Tea grounds, Matty has the right idea, best use for them is in the garden, though i do occasionally sprinkle some in w/ potted  things with no adverse effects.. Same w/ worm castings..  Interesting side- note, have read some recent debates over just how "beneficial" adding worms actually is. In some parts of the country, doing so may cause more harm than good.

As far as adding Mycos to potted stuff? i do, and have had decent results when i have.. As always however, individual results will vary, especially if you use synthetic ferts later on, or rely heavily on city water for irrigation.. Chlorine can kill beneficial bacteria.  You can add them in w/ stuff planted in the ground but most soils are going to contain plenty of Mirco-flora already. So you could be wasting money adding more.

[Big Eye]

2 hours ago, Darold Petty said:

For seedling palms I use fish emulsion and kelp extract in the irrigation water.  This produces great results with Chamaedorea, Dypsis, Howea, and Rhopalostylis from seed.  I use this with each watering and the tiny seedlings are a healthy, dark green. 

I've recently started foliar feeding with kelp emulsion on the young ones in pots. Could I also use that mix to water them as well or would that be too much fertilizer in one sitting? Sorry if it sounds like a lame question but I don't want to over do it. Thanks!

[Darold Petty]

For me it is easier just to mix in the irrrigation water. 

[JANAIY]

8 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Agree w/ Darold,  Fish emulsion/ Kelp extract work great for youngins,' and even older seedlings..  I also add stuff like Alfalfa, crab/shrimp/oyster shell, etc when fertilizing things.. Here, been adding leaf litter i collect when i trim our mesquites in late May/June to potted stuff also with some pretty good results thus far.. Has worked great as a seed cover also.

Last year, i ended up doing what i'd call an "accidental experiment" and applied some diluted, liquid palm fert i had to a few of my Sabal maurittiiformis i'd stepped up into 3gal pots, just to give them a spring boost.. Intended to feed all 4 but ran out before i gave the last one some food.. Needless to say, the 3 i used the liquid fert on burned badly over the summer, even though they all sit under shade cloth, all summer, right next to each other.

All of mine also stay outside, fully exposed to the elements all winter ( No direct sun where they sit this time of year. ) Right now, the 3 that were fertilized w/ the chemical stuff look terrible.. Might loose one. While we've had some cold mornings this year, very little frost, especially where they are situated on the patio. All 3 suffered pretty nasty additional damage. Single one i didn't feed w/ that stuff looks a lot better, even slowly pushing growth atm.. Same w/ the 2 com pots of other seedlings that sit just inside my shade house. All of them are nice and green and haven't suffered any damage either over the summer or during winter. Did not use that stuff on them. I noticed some burn on other stuff i'd used the same fert on over the summer also.

Lesson?.. While already adhere to it 95% of the time, No more using anything synthetic, even for a boost ..sticking solely w/ organics.. Proof of how they've worked for me is clear as daylight.

As far as using Coffee or Tea grounds, Matty has the right idea, best use for them is in the garden, though i do occasionally sprinkle some in w/ potted  things with no adverse effects.. Same w/ worm castings..  Interesting side- note, have read some recent debates over just how "beneficial" adding worms actually is. In some parts of the country, doing so may cause more harm than good.

As far as adding Mycos to potted stuff? i do, and have had decent results when i have.. As always however, individual results will vary, especially if you use synthetic ferts later on, or rely heavily on city water for irrigation.. Chlorine can kill beneficial bacteria.  You can add them in w/ stuff planted in the ground but most soils are going to contain plenty of Mirco-flora already. So you could be wasting money adding more.

Thank you for your detailed input! 
What about the brand you are using. It’s quite a lot out of there , difficult to chose. 
Is it combined and how should I measure it for 1 gallon pots and up. 
With 8-2-12 fertilizer I am always afraid to use too much and I have used it only with my lipstick palm every 4 month. 
Now I have lots of seedlings of Joey palms, Sabinaria and Licualas repotted in 1 gallon pots and would like to use organic stuff because for me that’s the right thing to do. Those chemical fertilizers are just the same as medicines for us and I stopped taking them myself since 20 yrs. Doctors have never seen me since 2003. So that talks for itself! 

[Silas_Sancona]

1 hour ago, JANAIY said:

Thank you for your detailed input! 
What about the brand you are using. It’s quite a lot out of there , difficult to chose. 
Is it combined and how should I measure it for 1 gallon pots and up. 
With 8-2-12 fertilizer I am always afraid to use too much and I have used it only with my lipstick palm every 4 month. 
Now I have lots of seedlings of Joey palms, Sabinaria and Licualas repotted in 1 gallon pots and would like to use organic stuff because for me that’s the right thing to do. Those chemical fertilizers are just the same as medicines for us and I stopped taking them myself since 20 yrs. Doctors have never seen me since 2003. So that talks for itself! 

You're welcome,

Have used a few.. and yes, lol there are many choices.. My personal favorite are products produced under the "Down to Earth" label. Like them because i can buy individual ingredients like Oyster Shell, Azomite, and/ or Shrimp / Crab Shell Meal.  Also a big fan of E.B. Stone products, though i'm not sure they're available there in Florida.. Their Sul-Po-Mag is a great product, Or should i say, have had good results using it,  ..and not just for palms.. There are other great brands to look into as well..  A good plus regarding organic ferts is in many cases, you're less likely to burn your plants of you apply a little too much. Results may not be as apparent as quickly but ..you don't need to have a great eye to know when your plants are healthy..

When it comes to fertilizers, i try my best to gain as much insight about where particular plants ..or groups of plants originate and adjust what i apply that knowledge as best as i can.. While many palms might thrive on a simple fert. formula, others planted nearby which might naturally grow on Limestone in say Cuba or somewhere in S.E. Asia might not.. they may respond adversely to too much.. or not enough of X element in that same fertilizer. In some cases, apply say Phosphorus to certain plants from Australia or South Africa, even once, and they'll be dead/ near death within a couple weeks.. others like Plumeria or Hibiscus may glut themselves on it and look great now, awful and weak later on..

As far as how its applied.. I'll usually mix up a few individual ingredients in a bucket and apply say a couple teaspoons full to a gallon plant, spread in a ring closer to the edge of the pot, vs. dumping a couple piles near the base of the plant. I try to follow what is suggested on the box, though not always.. A good example of this: My Plumeria get a 1/4th cup dose of higher Phosphorus fert, and maybe some Oyster Shell meal / Bat or Bird Guano in say March, none the rest of the year.. while i'll apply half a cup of mix of Alfalfa / Crab Shell Meal and Sul-Po-Mag to them 3 times a year..  maybe some Epsom Salt once or twice a year as well.  Right now all my stuff is in containers so it is easy to fertilize. In the ground, how much is applied might be different. Most stuff i have planted doesn't want much if any extra fertilizer. What organic material is blown into the yard and sifts down through the gravel is usually enough.



 

[JANAIY]

Thank you very much. This will help me to get a step further. I will do my research on individual needs of my exotics and apply rather less than too much to seee the outcome.  Still very confusing but I will research myself into it one step at a time. Let’s see if I can get those products here and than go from there. You are a big help!! Thanks again. I will update