Panama tall vs. Jamaican tall...

[Zeeth]

Just as the title says. Is there a difference that someone can look at the tree and tell which is which? Is one more cold hardy, Ly resistant, taller etc?

[Kostas]

According to Jeff from CR,Panama tall has an open,half circular canopy while Jamaica tall has a full rounded canopy.Both these are my favourite coconut variants and wish i could get them...

[Jeff in Costa Rica]

I've done a little research on this and based on what I have read, the Pacific Tall has a more umbrella-like crown whereas the Jamaican Tall has a full rounded shaped crown. The nuts are also shaped a little differently but I can't remember the differences right now. I met with a guy here in CR that used to be a coconut hybridizer and he used to export the nuts to coconut growing regions. He told me that the Pacific Tall is much more resistant to lethal yellowing than the Jamaican Tall. He is going to come visit me this summer and take me to a place where he knows there are pure Pacific Talls growing.

Kostas, I'm working on getting some nuts shipped out to you. I am going to wait and see if I can get some pure Pacific Talls for you. I'll be in touch with you again in the next couple of months.

[Kostas]

Thank you very much Jeff! Its great to hear from you again and thank you for undertaking this difficult task for me! Much appreciated!

[DoomsDave]

Thank you very much Jeff! Its great to hear from you again and thank you for undertaking this difficult task for me! Much appreciated!

Of course, we all expect you to keep us apprized of what happens . . . . .

[Kostas]

Will do,after all, Cocos is a special genus for most of us!

[Phil]

Jeff,

From the limited knowledge I've gotten from Coconut "specialists", the Pacific Tall is suppose to have more cold hardiness. For those in So Cal who have to try one, I'd search out seeds of the Pacific Tall's.

Phil

[bubba]

The Maypan, which is a commonly grown Coconut here in South Florida, is a hybrid between the Panama Tall and the Maylan Dwarf. The positive is that it is quite tall and resistant to LY. That makes me think Panama Talls are more resistant to LY. Just an uninformed guess.

[Zeeth]

The Maypan, which is a commonly grown Coconut here in South Florida, is a hybrid between the Panama Tall and the Maylan Dwarf. The positive is that it is quite tall and resistant to LY. That makes me think Panama Talls are more resistant to LY. Just an uninformed guess.

From what I've heard, they did some new LY studies and were surprised with the findings. About 90% of Jamaican talls were susceptible, and about 50% Panama talls. The crazy thing was that about 70% of Malayan dwarfs were susceptible, and about 80% of Maypans. No true type Fiji dwarfs were susceptible. So the Panama talls were the second most resistant, next to fiji dwarf.

[bubba]

Along those lines, I have read about a recent resurgence of LY in the Carribean Basin spreading all the way to Guatamala. I have yet to see evidence here in the Palm Beach area but it is a constant item that is lived with. Innoculation seems to keep it to a minimum on the Island. After the 1970's onslaught which was nuclear, it seems discussions from people outside of our area seem to still believe it is wildly prevalent.

[Jeff in Costa Rica]

Jeff,

From the limited knowledge I've gotten from Coconut "specialists", the Pacific Tall is suppose to have more cold hardiness. For those in So Cal who have to try one, I'd search out seeds of the Pacific Tall's.

Phil

Thanks Phil, I've also heard that the Pacific Tall is more cold hardy than the Jamaican Tall. It would be interesting to see if they do any better in So Cal.

[Zeeth]

I recently read that coconuts from Hainan Island, off southern China are the most cold/cool tolerant coconut variety there are. From the source I read, this place had a pronounced cool season, from arctic air blown from the Chinese main land. The source says that other species such as the Atlantic and Pacific tall that are brought to the area die outright from the cool season. Maybe these would succeed in Central florida and do better in So Cal than other varieties. If you look up "coconut" on Wikipedia, the second reference is from "The Coconut Odyssey: the bounteous possibilities of the tree of life" which is where i found this info.

[bubba]

Zeeth, That sounds interesting and logical. Hong Kong, below Tropic of Cancer, has recorded freezing temperatures. Has got to be a cold resistant variety.

[iamjv]

Keith thanks for the interesting tidbit on that link.... just downloaded it and it seems to be loaded with coconut information (135 pages)! Interesting info on those Hainan Island coconuts.... wonder if anyone on the board has ever been to that location???? Jv

[gavilan1]

I was in communication last year with Haikuo Fan of the Coconut Research Institute of Chinese Academy of Tropical Agricultural Sciences (CRI CATAS), about obtaining some Hainan nuts, and he indicated that there was a prohibition against exportation of the seed in place last summer by their Ministry of Agriculture.

I had also discussed obtaining some hybrid nuts developed in a cold region in Veracruz, Mexico, that Cristobal was sourcing. His initial two did not do well (http://palmtalk.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=1;t=5761;hl=cocos+nucifera), and we never resumed discussion about obtaining more. Phyto., nematode, and other possible certs make it a difficult prospect to bring into So. Cal., but well worth attempting.

[Paul The Palm Doctor!]

So Coconut Specialists: Does "Pacific" Tall mean that the South Pacific Region is populated by "Panama" Talls or is this area populated by coconuts different from "Panama" Talls.

No one I've met in Panama calls their palms "Panama" Talls so I'm really confused more now than before. God, this is really freaking me out!

Pablo

[Jeff in Costa Rica]

Paul, based on what I have read, Panama Tall is synonymous with Pacific Tall.

[garrin]

Comparing the crown shapes between so-called "pacific talls" with others, makes me wonder if what we have in Hawai'i is the true pacific tall; their crowns (when not severly over-pruned by the parks people) are usually a complete sphere. Often younger ones wil have a more "umbrella" shape. But we have had so many types introduced here over a couple of centuries that all kinds of mixtures occur in the landscape these days.

[Zeeth]

Comparing the crown shapes between so-called "pacific talls" with others, makes me wonder if what we have in Hawai'i is the true pacific tall; their crowns (when not severly over-pruned by the parks people) are usually a complete sphere. Often younger ones wil have a more "umbrella" shape. But we have had so many types introduced here over a couple of centuries that all kinds of mixtures occur in the landscape these days.

That's very interesting! I've heard of Hawaii tall as a variety, but most other members haven't, so it may or may not be a variety.