Fish Tail - Chinese Palms and Seaweed

[Morph]

Hi,

I'm new here but I want to know lots.

I live in New Zealand and my wife and I have built an new place by the beach North of Auckland. In our new garden we have planted lots of palms mostly Queen, a Kentia and some Majestic. Some horrible person tried to steal some by ripping them out of the ground. They weren't sucessful as the majestic they tried for had already made good roots held on but broke off leaving the roots behind, sadly it died of course. But now I have a space and I would love to plant a Fish Tail palm or two. I have read a bit but seemed to find conflicting info. Does anyone know for sure that given a few years that these Fish Tail or Chinese (I think) Palms will grow real big, flower then just die? And become a big problem to remove. Is there a type that donesn't do that?

Is it possible to stop them flowering or just cut the flowers off when they appear (could be a problem to get to the flowers though) to stop them dieing?

Another question is as we are quite near the beach has anyone used seaweed for fertilzer and if they did what did they do. How did they do what they did and was it sucessful. I have a couple of barrels full of a kelpy seaweed soup that have been brewing for a couple of months and would like to get maximum benifit from what seems to be a lovely slippery juice. Any ideas welcome. Do you think my palms would like to drink this stuff?

Thanks

[monkeyranch]

Well I'm 35 years old and considering that Caryotas take 15 to 25 years to flower I'll will get to see 2 to 3 of them flower at best in my life. Unless you plan on living several hundred years, I would think removing a dead one every few decades is not to tedious of a price for such spectacular palms. Try Caryota maxima 'Himalayana' or C. ochlandra, the first being the most cold hardy and both being of smaller stature for fishtales. Not too large of a removal job. If your "Auklandish" location is almost frost free and you want a bigger one try C. obtusa 'N. India' or C. o. 'S. China'. See Rarepalmseeds.com archive for more info. As far as the seaweed goes palms love it (in the form of Maxicrop, Algit Kelp Meal, Nitrozyme, etc.) but the salt must be removed first. I'm not sure how this is accomplished commercially but you know.... try google. Perhaps a couple of phone calls to some manufacturers could be helpful. Most organic oriented producers are philosophically happy to share knowledge furthering organic awareness. Man I wish I could live to see 3 generations of Jubaeas flower. And may the person who tried to steal your palms be reincarnated as a toilet plunger in his next life. HA! I curse thee!

[Walter John]

Hi,

I'm new here but I want to know lots.

I live in New Zealand and my wife and I have built an new place by the beach North of Auckland. In our new garden we have planted lots of palms mostly Queen, a Kentia and some Majestic. Some horrible person tried to steal some by ripping them out of the ground. They weren't sucessful as the majestic they tried for had already made good roots held on but broke off leaving the roots behind, sadly it died of course. But now I have a space and I would love to plant a Fish Tail palm or two. I have read a bit but seemed to find conflicting info. Does anyone know for sure that given a few years that these Fish Tail or Chinese (I think) Palms will grow real big, flower then just die? And become a big problem to remove. Is there a type that donesn't do that?

Is it possible to stop them flowering or just cut the flowers off when they appear (could be a problem to get to the flowers though) to stop them dieing?

Another question is as we are quite near the beach has anyone used seaweed for fertilzer and if they did what did they do. How did they do what they did and was it sucessful. I have a couple of barrels full of a kelpy seaweed soup that have been brewing for a couple of months and would like to get maximum benifit from what seems to be a lovely slippery juice. Any ideas welcome. Do you think my palms would like to drink this stuff?

Thanks

You couldn't give your palms better fertiliser. Try one of the mountain Caryotas (fishtails), C.gigas, C.maxima. and C.ochlandra can take the cold apparently. I believe these are available in Auckland.

[Tyrone]

Hi Morph,

I'm sorry to hear about your idiot palm thieves causing damage. Why won't people just pay a couple of dollars and get there own.

All fishtail palms are of the genus Caryota, and yes they flower and die. Depending on the species and growing conditions, this could be anywhere from 10-40yrs from a seedling. By Chinese Fishtail palm, I believe you are talking about Caryota ochlandra, which is quite cold tolerant, and being near the beach, your winter mins won't be that cold, and that species should tolerate your cool winters in my humble opinion. I know of ones around my area which is a bit warmer than you, and they took 20yrs before they flowered, and then took about 5-6yrs to finish flowering and fruiting and then just be a dead trunk. They would have been 20m tall. They start flowering from the top, then progressively put out flowers lower and lower on the trunk. Once the trunk has exhausted all it's starch, flowering and fruiting stops, and it dies.

I don't think cutting the flowers off will stop it getting old and dying. I think you'd get a dead trunk with no seeds or seedlings, which would be a waste. There is a clumping species, Caryota mitis, which doesn't get too tall, but when a stem flowers and dies you just cut it out like a banana, and the rest of the clump at all various sizes keep growing. However this is quite a tropical species for NZ, but it isn't impossible I would think, if you were a really good grower. They need more heat than Caryota ochlandra to look good and green, and the winter winds may pose a problem especially near the sea. Caryota's hate salt.

Seaweed is very good for palms. I use seaweed extract and fish emulsion on my palms all the time. I've also mulched my mother-in-laws palm garden down on the south coast (similar weather to north NZ) with washed seaweed, and it's doing wonderful things for the garden. I also mixed it all in with cow manure.

Seaweed is good, and I've never used a homemade seaweed tea before, but try and make sure the salt content isn't too high, especially for your Caryota. I'd wash the seaweed in fresh water quite liberally before I would use it on my garden. Do you have that Bull Kelp washing up on your beach? If you were in a warmer climate, I'd tell you to plant a coconut in a big mound of unwashed seaweed. They love it, but you're too cold unfortunately.

On another note, I think a Pritchardia hillebrandii ( Hawaiin Fan Palm) would grow well for you. They don't mind cool sea air with a bit of salt in it.

I hope this helps.

Best regards

Tyrone