Palms in frosty old Canberra

[philinsydney]

I was at Australian National Botanic Gardens recently and noticed that some palms were grown there: Livistona australis, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Linospadix monostachya and Laccospadix australassica. The gardens are on sloping ground, so may be spared some of Canberra's worst frosts, and there is some degree of canopy cover.

Licuala ramsayi and Linospadix minor were safely tucked up in the glasshouse.

[chris.oz]

I was at Australian National Botanic Gardens recently and noticed that some palms were grown there: Livistona australis, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Linospadix monostachya and Laccospadix australassica. The gardens are on sloping ground, so may be spared some of Canberra's worst frosts, and there is some degree of canopy cover.

Licuala ramsayi and Linospadix minor were safely tucked up in the glasshouse.

Surprising. I dont believe I have ever seen any CIDP there. It does get cold in winter -5 would not surprise me.

[JEFF IN MODESTO]

I was at Australian National Botanic Gardens recently and noticed that some palms were grown there: Livistona australis, Archontophoenix cunninghamiana, Linospadix monostachya and Laccospadix australassica. The gardens are on sloping ground, so may be spared some of Canberra's worst frosts, and there is some degree of canopy cover.

Licuala ramsayi and Linospadix minor were safely tucked up in the glasshouse.

Surprising. I dont believe I have ever seen any CIDP there. It does get cold in winter -5 would not surprise me.

I am amazed that Archontophoenix cunninghamiana would survive in Canberra for even one season. I wonder what the secret is?

I was checking the weather stats and the average low mid winter in Canberra is only 31f ( -.5c).... and the average lowest yearly temp of 21f (-6c )

Here in Cali, Kings are damaged by temps just barely below freezing...and killed outright a couple degrees below freezing.

In my garden, they are pretty much the least hardy palms, I have only one of seven that survived 2007's low temp of around 24f.... and it was seriously damaged.

Jeff

[Tyrone]

I wonder if they're still alive. Canberra had a minus 3C a couple of nights ago.

regards

Tyrone

[philinsydney]

I managed to retrieve a few piccies; I thought the camera battery was flat. These were taken yesterday btw

[philinsydney]

Livistona australis

[philinsydney]

a couple of nice Canberra eucalypts; E. mannifera in a Canberra street, and E. maidenii at the Australian War Memorial

[tim_brissy_13]

The Archontophoenix have been there quite a long time. I saw them maybe 4 years ago now, and was surprised they were growing. I think there were a few purpureas as well, and Livistona decipiens are grown there. All of the palms are in a valley on sloping ground, so I guess it is a favourable microclimate.

[Guest Keith in Zone 9]

I wish someone would provide good quality information on the provenance of the Arcontophoenix genus (or even one species). Like S. romanzoffianum, I suspect there are some groups with hardy genes. Members of the Southeast Palm Society (USA) have been selecting extraordinarily hardy Trachycarpus fortunei, and have succeeded in finding some that are reliable in Zone 7 climates (-12 to -15C). I doubt Arcontophoenix will ever be hardy in in Charlotte or Atlanta, but if we could find some for climates with winter temps that fall into the low to mid 20's (-4 to -8C) it'd be a marketable group of palms (even outside of the group that reads these posts).

[Alberto]

I wish someone would provide good quality information on the provenance of the Arcontophoenix genus (or even one species). Like S. romanzoffianum, I suspect there are some groups with hardy genes. I doubt Arcontophoenix will ever be hardy in in Charlotte or Atlanta, but if we could find some for climates with winter temps that fall into the low to mid 20's (-4 to -8C) it'd be a marketable group of palms (even outside of the group that reads these posts).

I have seedlings of bangalows from Urbenville ,a frost hole in New South Wales. I live in hope this will survive long term here and even the the big freezes... According to Benn from NZ, in this town in Australia it freezes very hard every winter.

BTW I have a few seedlings of Linospadix monostachya. How cold hardy is this little palm?

Edited May 25, 2008 by Alberto

[Bennz]

I wish someone would provide good quality information on the provenance of the Arcontophoenix genus (or even one species). Like S. romanzoffianum, I suspect there are some groups with hardy genes. I doubt Arcontophoenix will ever be hardy in in Charlotte or Atlanta, but if we could find some for climates with winter temps that fall into the low to mid 20's (-4 to -8C) it'd be a marketable group of palms (even outside of the group that reads these posts).

I have seedlings of bangalows from Urbenville ,a frost hole in New South Wales. I live in hope this will survive long term here and even the the big freezes... According to Benn from NZ, in this town in Australia it freezes very hard every winter.

BTW I have a few seedlings of Linospadix monostachya. How cold hardy is this little palm?

All I can say is that visiting NNSW about 15 years ago a month or so after a particularly nasty frost (-8C in some areas) I saw a lot of dead A.cunninghamiana and alexandrae in the Nimbin/Lismore/Kyogle area, as well as totally defoliated mangos etc, but the Urbenville palms were undamaged despite being a naturally colder place.

My brother-in-law records the air temps for the Tenterfield Shire people at Urbenville every day, the place gets some real cold, -5C most years. It is also hot a lot of the time. I don't know if this provenance is truly any more or less cold tolerant than any other, but it would be a good place to start. Higher altitude again in frost hollows around Urbenville would be a better bet still. A little further south, some frost hollow areas around Casino have natural stands of these palms in very frosty spots, that are otherwise very hot.

My in-laws place at Urbenville is the only place I have ever seen icicles hanging off second storey balcony, with bangalow palms growing nearby.

[Tyrone]

[Alberto]

delete

Edited May 26, 2008 by Alberto

[monkeyranch]

Perhaps Tyronne's or Bennz's in-laws would like to supplement their income gathering some seeds for sale. I would buy 2k real quick like. Also maybe some seeds of those Syagrus rom., Copernicia alba, and Acrocomia totai which grow with Butia yatay in frosty areas Alberto has cited could find their way to the mail? Are there hardier Jacarandas or Chorisias in their company? Bauhinia affinis? I got $$$ and seeds for trade. (albeit crappy US$, ok I'll get you Euros, etc. first.) Humor aside, the PalmTalk member form an impressive network which could facilitate some hardiness improvements.

[Tyrone]

Monkeyranch, Unfortunately I am about 4000km away from Urbenville. Have you tried Archontophoenix maxima? They seem very cold tolerant, though others may now say they actually aren't. It's a bit hard because I don't drop below freezing here.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Bennz]

Perhaps Tyronne's or Bennz's in-laws would like to supplement their income gathering some seeds for sale. I would buy 2k real quick like. Also maybe some seeds of those Syagrus rom., Copernicia alba, and Acrocomia totai which grow with Butia yatay in frosty areas Alberto has cited could find their way to the mail? Are there hardier Jacarandas or Chorisias in their company? Bauhinia affinis? I got $$$ and seeds for trade. (albeit crappy US$, ok I'll get you Euros, etc. first.) Humor aside, the PalmTalk member form an impressive network which could facilitate some hardiness improvements.

I'm a bit closer than Tyrone, but still got 2200kms of open ocean to cross to get there!

My sister and brother-in-law are not palm people, I got bro-i-l to collect seed for Alberto as a special favour. He has just bought a new farm, so maybe he might be interested in some cash, but I suspect it would need to be a lot to make him feel it was worthwhile. When collecting seed for Alberto he had a couple of close calls with brown snakes, which are kind of nasty (ie you get a few hours to either get to hospital or say goodbye to loved ones).

I will probably be in the area late this year, or possibly not until next year. If this year it will probably be too late for seed, but if next year I could probably get some. I've been thinking it might be a good idea to trial this provenance here as a comparison to the more common southern forms in this country. I suspect the provenances from S NSW are much better naturally suited to my climate as they are consistently much cooler but without any real frost, like my climate here. For some of us cool tolerance will always be more important than cold tolerance.

[HASNZ38S]

Got loads of bangalows growing in Hamilton NZ where frosts are common (typically get -5C nights in winter although unlike Camberra snow is unknown. Camberra is at relative altitude compared to 38m above sea level in Hamilton but the cold temperatures would not be too dissimilar I wouldn't think but with much reduced humidity in Camberra.

our record night was -9.9C (lowest of any major NZ city and we are only an hour south or auckland but inland away from the moderating effects of the ocean), although I personally cannot recall a night below -7C and I've been here since 1998. 

https://www.niwa.co.nz/sites/niwa.co.nz/files/import/attachments/summary.xls

Here's a photo taken today of some in a more sheltered location but there are many in more open positions including one at my family's place that is almost 10m tall. Max temp this winter has only been just shy of -4C (most mild winter on record thus far).