Archontophoenix cunninghamiana help

[geoffc]

I hope you all can be patient with me because I’m new to this. Last February I purchased my first big palm. An Archontophoenix alexandrae about 6 to 8 years old. It was transplanted by the palm farm that I bought it from. I know they grow well in my area because there are a ton of them in the area. It looked beautiful for the first month. Then the fronds started to brown and turned almost a blackish gray. It’s three months later and almost all the original fronds are browning or have specks of brown. I water slowly once a week for about two hours. What should I do? Please help the new guy.

[Alicehunter2000]

As long as you do not have air pockets around your rootball.......I think it is just transplant shock. Looks like you got some healthy new spears. All your original leaves may eventually turn brown and die as the new growth comes on board.

[Bags]

Was the palm from a green or shade house? Alot of times the existing fronds will burn when they are in full sun for the first time and the new fronds will come out looking good. Give it about a year and it should be looking good. Also kings love lots of water. Good luck! Aaron

[Alicehunter2000]

Fine looking palm BTW..........and Welcome to PalmTalk.

[geoffc]

Was the palm from a green or shade house? Alot of times the existing fronds will burn when they are in full sun for the first time and the new fronds will come out looking good. Give it about a year and it should be looking good. Also kings love lots of water. Good luck! Aaron

It was outside, but mostly shaded by other palms. Should I be watering more then once a week? My soil is very sandy and drains well. However it is still moist after about 3 days..

[Creekside]

I hope you all can be patient with me because I’m new to this. Last February I purchased my first big palm. An Archontophoenix alexandrae about 6 to 8 years old. It was transplanted by the palm farm that I bought it from. I know they grow well in my area because there are a ton of them in the area. It looked beautiful for the first month. Then the fronds started to brown and turned almost a blackish gray. It’s three months later and almost all the original fronds are browning or have specks of brown. I water slowly once a week for about two hours. What should I do? Please help the new guy.

Archontophoenix love water, but hate to be dug up and moved. Try watering it thoroughly every day and cutting off those lower leaves. They'll be beautiful when they recover. Welcome to the board!

[Walter John]

I hope you all can be patient with me because I’m new to this. Last February I purchased my first big palm. An Archontophoenix alexandrae about 6 to 8 years old. It was transplanted by the palm farm that I bought it from. I know they grow well in my area because there are a ton of them in the area. It looked beautiful for the first month. Then the fronds started to brown and turned almost a blackish gray. It’s three months later and almost all the original fronds are browning or have specks of brown. I water slowly once a week for about two hours. What should I do? Please help the new guy.

Hi Geoff

Firstly, any transplant, especially of an older plant like yours, will take a circle of seasons (at least 12 months) to begin looking close to normal. The palm will toss it's leaves to put power into the roots.

Secondly, transplanting outside warm soil seasons will negate the process, you should always transplant in growing times like late Spring to late Summer.

Third, it is best to use seaweed extract solution to the rootball area and even to the leaves at regular intervals for the first few months, this aids the rooting process and helps get over the shock of transplanting.

[Tyrone]

Everything Wal said is totally correct. You have it planted in sand, and as I come from an extremely sandy area I will say this. Your palm will be impossible to overwater. Archontophoenix are all river bank dwellers, some almost growing in the river. Also the soils where these come from although free draining are very rich in humus and often volcanic in origin. So keep the water up, use seaweed and fish emulsion extracts a great deal, and give the soil a nice good amount of manure and compost which will encourage worms which will transport the goodies down into the soil structure. If you do this and keep it moist, your palms will take off at the fast rate Archontophoenix should.

Best regards

Tyrone

[geoffc]

I hope you all can be patient with me because I’m new to this. Last February I purchased my first big palm. An Archontophoenix alexandrae about 6 to 8 years old. It was transplanted by the palm farm that I bought it from. I know they grow well in my area because there are a ton of them in the area. It looked beautiful for the first month. Then the fronds started to brown and turned almost a blackish gray. It’s three months later and almost all the original fronds are browning or have specks of brown. I water slowly once a week for about two hours. What should I do? Please help the new guy.

Archontophoenix love water, but hate to be dug up and moved. Try watering it thoroughly every day and cutting off those lower leaves. They'll be beautiful when they recover. Welcome to the board!

Is it common to cut the fronds off? I have been afraid to. Thinking that I might shock the palm more. I was told they were self cleaning. Also when does the browning around the shaft fall off?

[Walter John]

I hope you all can be patient with me because I’m new to this. Last February I purchased my first big palm. An Archontophoenix alexandrae about 6 to 8 years old. It was transplanted by the palm farm that I bought it from. I know they grow well in my area because there are a ton of them in the area. It looked beautiful for the first month. Then the fronds started to brown and turned almost a blackish gray. It’s three months later and almost all the original fronds are browning or have specks of brown. I water slowly once a week for about two hours. What should I do? Please help the new guy.

Archontophoenix love water, but hate to be dug up and moved. Try watering it thoroughly every day and cutting off those lower leaves. They'll be beautiful when they recover. Welcome to the board!

Is it common to cut the fronds off? I have been afraid to. Thinking that I might shock the palm more. I was told they were self cleaning. Also when does the browning around the shaft fall off?

Yes it is common to cut the fronds off by at least one third, at least.

[Bags]

I am sure Wal know a lot more about palms than me but I have read that you should not cut off green fronds as the palms use them for Photosynthesis. When you remove the green fronds you are esentially decreasing the palms ability to make its own food. I would like to hear from someone smarter than me on this(thats almost everyone) Aaron

[surgeon83]

Is it common to cut the fronds off? I have been afraid to. Thinking that I might shock the palm more. I was told they were self cleaning. Also when does the browning around the shaft fall off?

Cutting off the dead, brown fronds won't hurt anything. Like trimming our toenails or cutting our hair. In fact, the crownshaft portion of the lowest fronds looks brown (like you mentioned), so you may be able to just grab the frond at the base and pull the whole thing off with leaf base and all at this point. I never wait until my "self-cleaning" palms clean themselves; as soon as the leafbase starts detaching, I pull it off to reveal the clean, fresh crownshaft underneath. As soon as you do it once, you will understand what I mean.

I concur with everyone else- water once a day, not once a week. By the end of the summer it should look much better, after a new crown of fronds grows.

EDIT: watering for 2 hours might not be necessary, depending on how slow it is. I would think you'd be fine dumping 3 gallons of water on it (over a minute or so) per day. Mine never got quite that much and look pretty darn good.

Edited May 8, 2008 by surgeon83

[Walter John]

I am sure Wal know a lot more about palms than me but I have read that you should not cut off green fronds as the palms use them for Photosynthesis. When you remove the green fronds you are esentially decreasing the palms ability to make its own food. I would like to hear from someone smarter than me on this(thats almost everyone) Aaron

The above statements are correct for an established ongoing growing plant, but we're talking about transplanting palms, in which case the removal of leaves reduces water loss from transpiration. It's also a good idea to tie the rest of the leaves bound style to resist the winds.

You can't put the cart in front of the horse and you can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you get what you need.

[Tyrone]

You can cut any parts of the brown stuff away as already mentioned. Be careful just wrenching the lower section connected to the trunk. If it has died prematurely due to transplant shock, it may hold on to it's old lower leaf sheath section (crownshaft) rather tightly. You can remove it, but you may have to cut it very carefully with a sharp implement making sure that you don't cut any living tissue on the leaf underneath. If you just pull it off, you may tear living tissue away from the trunk further damaging it, and leaving it for fungus and bacteria to infect it.

If it was mine, I'd do this. I'd cut the brown leaves off leaving the lower section attached. I'd water it like crazy, with fish and seaweed extracts, especially getting the extracts over the leaves for easy assimilation by the plant because the roots aren't that efficient yet. Then I'd wait until the brown sheath is ready to come off. As the trunk expands a bit due to growth it will start to break away by itself. When you see it doing this at some time in the future, give the crownshaft section a light pull. If it starts coming away from the trunk then it's ready to come off. If it still wants to hang on leave it until it's ready. That way you don't scar the trunk or damage it. I'm certain your palms will look fantastic in a few months time with some TLC.

Best regards

Tyrone

[realarch]

Sounds familiar, planted a boxed A. cunninghamiana a few years back that had been in the container way too

long. The bottom fronds did turn brown and I cut them off at that point. The trunk on mine looks the same as yours,

inconsistent ring spacing and irregular thickness I'm assuming from being in the container too long and getting stressed.

A couple of years later one of the trunks atrophied and died, but the other two seem to be healthy and have been growing

like crazy. I'll have to get a current photo of the twins.

It's watered regularly on an irrigation system and deep watered during hot dry conditions, but basically it's been easy to take care of. I do keep the bottom fronds pruned somewhat for better access on the patio. The soil was amended with humus and it does drain well. I probably should fertilize more, but I do talk to it a lot.

The topic referes to cunninghamiana, but you say it an alexandrae. Looks like cunninghamiana. From what I've been reading on the board, alexandrae isn't as cold hardy and doesn't do as well in SoCal, but I don't know that for sure.

I've attached an older photo and you can see the similarities.

Tim

[doubravsky]

Geoff,

Where in SoCal are you located? How far inland will really influence water needs for these guys. I'm in Riverside, and I've found that here, in full sun, they like a lot of regular water. I've planted triples out from full sun 24" boxes grown in Vista, and they still burn pretty good the first year.

If you're worried about their growth and health, make a mark on the spear and a corresponding mark on the nearest fron with a sharpie, and watch to see if the spear is growing. You'll find that they grow pretty quick, opening a good 4-5 spears at least during a growing season.

Feel free to cut off brown leaves. With the leaf bases, wait until they're good and brown, and starting to separate from the trunk. Then they come off pretty easy. If you pull them off when they're still pretty well attached or green, the scar on the trunk will be bigger, and if the trunk is damaged it could invite fungus.

Be patient.. within a year or two they'll look really good! Then, you can use the shade they provide to add a whole bunch of understory palms!!!!!!

[geoffc]

Sounds familiar, planted a boxed A. cunninghamiana a few years back that had been in the container way too

long. The bottom fronds did turn brown and I cut them off at that point. The trunk on mine looks the same as yours,

inconsistent ring spacing and irregular thickness I'm assuming from being in the container too long and getting stressed.

A couple of years later one of the trunks atrophied and died, but the other two seem to be healthy and have been growing

like crazy. I'll have to get a current photo of the twins.

It's watered regularly on an irrigation system and deep watered during hot dry conditions, but basically it's been easy to take care of. I do keep the bottom fronds pruned somewhat for better access on the patio. The soil was amended with humus and it does drain well. I probably should fertilize more, but I do talk to it a lot.

The topic referes to cunninghamiana, but you say it an alexandrae. Looks like cunninghamiana. From what I've been reading on the board, alexandrae isn't as cold hardy and doesn't do as well in SoCal, but I don't know that for sure.

I've attached an older photo and you can see the similarities.

Tim

Yes you are correct it is a A. cunninghamiana. I was in such a rush that I wrote incorrectly. How much did you actually water? Everyday, other day, hours etc.. I'm really lost. As of right now I'm watering once a week from a slow hose for about two hours. Is this enough in you opinion?

[geoffc]

You can cut any parts of the brown stuff away as already mentioned. Be careful just wrenching the lower section connected to the trunk. If it has died prematurely due to transplant shock, it may hold on to it's old lower leaf sheath section (crownshaft) rather tightly. You can remove it, but you may have to cut it very carefully with a sharp implement making sure that you don't cut any living tissue on the leaf underneath. If you just pull it off, you may tear living tissue away from the trunk further damaging it, and leaving it for fungus and bacteria to infect it.

If it was mine, I'd do this. I'd cut the brown leaves off leaving the lower section attached. I'd water it like crazy, with fish and seaweed extracts, especially getting the extracts over the leaves for easy assimilation by the plant because the roots aren't that efficient yet. Then I'd wait until the brown sheath is ready to come off. As the trunk expands a bit due to growth it will start to break away by itself. When you see it doing this at some time in the future, give the crownshaft section a light pull. If it starts coming away from the trunk then it's ready to come off. If it still wants to hang on leave it until it's ready. That way you don't scar the trunk or damage it. I'm certain your palms will look fantastic in a few months time with some TLC.

Best regards

Tyrone

I really appreciate the advice. I have purchased the fish and seaweed extracts, but how often should I apply in and how much? Also how should I apply it? As I am watering and also how should I apply it to the fronds? Thanks again..

[geoffc]

Fine looking palm BTW..........and Welcome to PalmTalk.

Thank you..

[_Keith]

Nothing much to say after all of the advice above, other than welcome to PalmTalk. It is always nice to make another new friend, in my case, and a whole bunch of new friends, in your case.

I think you will find this community unlike any other you have run across, online or otherwise. I know I was never made to feel so at home, so fast, and by so many people.

[steve 9atx]

geoff

Let me ask you a silly question. From your photo, it almost looks like they planted your palms in the container in the ground.

Tell me it ain't so. If so, you're gonna have to pull it out and cut the pot off before you replant. If they're still in the container

all the advice you received above will go for naught.

Steve

[geoffc]

Nothing much to say after all of the advice above, other than welcome to PalmTalk. It is always nice to make another new friend, in my case, and a whole bunch of new friends, in your case.

I think you will find this community unlike any other you have run across, online or otherwise. I know I was never made to feel so at home, so fast, and by so many people.

thibodeaux.. I know a few of you name sake out here in so cal... Wonder if there is any relation..

[geoffc]

geoff

Let me ask you a silly question. From your photo, it almost looks like they planted your palms in the container in the ground.

Tell me it ain't so. If so, you're gonna have to pull it out and cut the pot off before you replant. If they're still in the container

all the advice you received above will go for naught.

Steve

LOL.. I know I'm new, but I'm not that lost. I'm assuming your thinking that because of the ring around the palm? I actually put that because I plan on planting sod in the future and want to keep it away from the palm base. It's only 6 inchs deep and it also helps me keep my watering in check. I really appreciate your help..

[Tyrone]

Geoff, keep us posted on how it all goes.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Walter John]

I really appreciate the advice. I have purchased the fish and seaweed extracts, but how often should I apply in and how much? Also how should I apply it? As I am watering and also how should I apply it to the fronds? Thanks again..

Every 2 weeks apply to the space on the ground covered by the crown of leaves and get up on a step ladder and spray over the leaves as well. Do this for 2 to 3 months and drink a beer after each application.

Follow the extract dosage per water on the bottle or container it came in and Bob's your uncle.

[Tyrone]

I'd give it fish and seaweed in a watering can every day for at least a fortnight. I gave my coconut that treatment every day from mid Nov until mid April and it loved it.

best regards

Tyrone

[Walter John]

I'd give it fish and seaweed in a watering can every day for at least a fortnight. I gave my coconut that treatment every day from mid Nov until mid April and it loved it.

best regards

Tyrone

Coconuts live by the sea Tyronne, I'd be mindful of too much extract, end up looking like Grant Hackett after a 10 k swim

[Frank]

I had the same issue.

 I had my irrigation water checked.

It had 1,300 ppm of salt.

 I switched it to city water& the issue disappeared.

Frank

New Smyrna Beach, FL

[BayAndroid]

On 5/7/2008 at 8:19 PM, Walter John said:

 

Hi Geoff

 

Firstly, any transplant, especially of an older plant like yours, will take a circle of seasons (at least 12 months) to begin looking close to normal. The palm will toss it's leaves to put power into the roots.

 

Secondly, transplanting outside warm soil seasons will negate the process, you should always transplant in growing times like late Spring to late Summer.

 

Third, it is best to use seaweed extract solution to the rootball area and even to the leaves at regular intervals for the first few months, this aids the rooting process and helps get over the shock of transplanting.

I like this.. I have some palms I'm planning to plant out soon.