NAME THIS PALM

[Jeff Searle]

Today,because it rained all day,I had loads of extra time on my hands. Well I recieved a phone call from another "palm junky"and we talked for nearly 1 1\2 hous on all aspects of palm related things. And one subject that came up was how does a palm recieve a common name. (By the way, this is a no-picture thread,so everyone can easily reply with your opions).

   Example, the common Teddy Bear Palm,Dypsis leptocheilos has beautful reddish brown tomentose all over the crownshaft. Seems like a good name to me. Does anyone know who gave it it's name? Another palm, The Bottle Palm has a swollen trunk base, therefore looking like a bottle. Great name.  Chambeyronia macrocarpa from New Caledonia is now referred to as The Flame Thrower. This palm has only become popular over the last 10-12 years, and has become one of the "must haves" in our collections. But...this palm never had a common name until only a few years ago. So, who started the common name, Flame Thrower? Sure was'nt me. For that matter, I can't claim credit for any common names!  The most recent common name that has been talked about hear lately, is this Dypsis sp. "Orange Crush".  Bo (BGL) has posted some beautiful specimens in his garden recently. Certainly, someone must know who gave this colorful name to this palm, not me. Does anyone have a name that they would like to start using?

    I guess I wish more palms that were all collecting and growing, had a common name, to make things easier.As I lay in bed tonight.........

[bgl]

Jeff,

Don Tollefson from SoCal was here with Pauleen Sullivan in March 2006, and when he saw my Dypsis sp. "Orange crush" I believe he came up with that name right at that time. This was about 10 days before I signed up on the Old forum, and as far as I know, that's how the name came into (more or less) common use (when I introduced it in various threads). I don't believe Don checks the IPS Forum.

Don has his issues with proper botanical names, so he likes to apply appropriate, common, names to palms. As far as I know, he is also the one who came up with the "Flamethrower" name some 8-10 years ago. Maybe someone in SoCal can confirm this?

Bo-Göran

[Walter John]

This is a topic I have covered enthusiastically before. It was not RLRs pet topics though. We disagreed over common name usage many times. He began calling me waldorf (like a common name). My views have been expressed before.

[BS Man about Palms]

If any names are bandied about, I would reforward the response someone else here gave....name the Dypsis fine leaf/fakey..whatever ...  the "Dypsis Riffliii"   :cool:

sounds good to me...we could say it "Riffles"!

[JD in the OC]

I grow Dypsis lanceolata and its hard to tell people you have an Ivovowo palm.  How boring!!!  So, I started calling it the Comoro Islands palm and now all my friends and family call it that.  (Plus some sellers on the web)

I have always liked talking palms with other "palm junkies" (term courtesy of Jeff Searle) and its funny whenever someone walks into my office or home and hears me say "I got 10 Snakeskin Fishtails from seed" or "My Foxy Ladies are shootin spears now" and they look at me like I'm from Sri Lanka.

JD

JD

[tikitiki]

Great topic jeff. Lets make a decision and go with BS and  call the dypsis fine leaf rifflii. That was my second on the motion. Now all we need is a third and get dave from so cal to put a legal stamp of approval on them and it is done.

[TooShort]

Here`s a couple more  

 

Acanthophoenix rubra

Palmiste rouge, Barbel palm, Red palm

Acoelorrhaphe wrightii

Silver Saw palm, Paurotis palm, Everglades palm

Acrocomia aculeata

Spiny royal, Macaw palm

Actinokentia divaricata

Miniature flame thrower

 

Actinorhytis calapparia

Calappa palm, Pinang Penawar

Aiphanes aculeata

Coyure palm, ruffle palm, chonta ruro

Allagoptera arenaria

Beach palm, Sand Palm

   

Archontophoenix  alexandrae

Alexandra palm, Alexander palm, King Palm, King Alexander palm

   

Archontophoenix cunninghamiana

Bangalow Palm, Piccabeen Palm

Archontophoenix purpurea

Mount Lewis King Palm, Purple Crown Shaft King

 

Areca catechu

Betel Nut Palm

   

Areca macrocalyx

Highland Betel Nut Palm

   

Areca triandra

Triandra palm

   

Areca vestiaria

Pinang merah, Orange crown shaft palm

   

Arenga engleri

Formosa Palm

Arenga microcarpa

Aren sagu

   

Arenga obtusfolia

Lang Kap

 

Arenga pinnata

Sugar palm, Gomuti Palm, Aren palm

   

Arenga wightii

Wight's sago palm

   

Bactris gasipaes

Peach palm, Pejibaye

   

Beccariophoenix madagascariensis

Manarano palm, Maruala palm

   

Bismarckia nobilis

Bismarck Palm

Brahea aculeata

Sinaloa hesper palm

Brahea decumbens

Sierra Madre Palm

Brahea dulcis

Rock palm, Sombrero palm

   

Brahea edulis

Guadalupe palm

   

Breahea elegans

Franceshi palm

 

Burretiokentia viellardii

Tiger palm

Butia capitata

Jelly palm, Pindo palm, Wine palm

   

Calamus caryotoides

Fishtail Lawyer Cane

Carpentaria acuminata

Carpentaria palm

Caryota gigas

Thai mountain giant

Caryota maxima

Giant mountain fishtail palm

Caryota mitis

Fishtail palm

Caryota no

Giant fishtail palm

Caryota obtusa

Indian fishtail palm

Caryota ophiopellis

Snake skin palm

   

Caryota urens

Jaggery palm, Toddy palm, Wine palm, Toddy fishtail palm, Solitary fishtail palm

   

Ceroxylon alpinum

Andean wax palm, South American mountain palm

Chamaedorea cataractarum

Cat palm

Chamaedorea costaricana

Costa Rica bamboo palm

   

Chamaedorea elegans

Good Luck Palm, Love Palm, Neanthe Bella Palm, Parlor Palm

   

Chamaedorea ernesti-augustii

Ernest's August palm

   

Chamaedorea glaucifolia

Frosty Palm

   

Chamaedorea hooperiana

Hooper's Palm

   

Chamaedorea metallica

Metallic palm

   

Chamaedorea microspadix

Hardy bamboo palm

Chamaedorea seifrizii

Bamboo palm

 

Chamaedorea sullivaniorum

The Sullivan palm

Chamaedorea tepejilote

Tepejilote palm

 

Chamaedorea tuerckheimii

Potato chip palm, Ruffles palm

Chamaerops humilis

European fan palm, Mediterranean fan palm

   

Chamaerops humilis var. cerifera

Blue Mediterranean fan palm

Chambeyronia hookeri

Blond flame thrower

Chambeyronia macrocarpa

Blushing palm, Red leaf palm

Chuniophoenix humilis

Chinese star palm

Clinostigma savoryanum

Pacific beauty palm

 

   

Coccothrinax alta

Puerto Rican thatch palm, Tyre palm, Silver thatch palm

 

   

Coccothrinax crinita

Old man palm, mat palm

   

Coccothrinax miraguama

Miraguama palm

   

Cocos nucifera

Coconut palm

   

Copernicia baileyana

Cuban paddle palm, Bailey copernicia, Yarey palm

   

Copernicia cowellii

Cabbage palm

   

Copernicia gigas

Giant wax palm

   

Cryosophila warscewiczii  

(also known Cryosophila albida)

Rootspine Palm, Star Palm

   

Cycas revoluta

Sago palm

   

Cyphophoenix elegans

Elegant Palm

   

Cyrtostachys renda

Lipstick palm, Sealing wax palm, Pinang raja

Dictyosperma album

Princess palm, hurricane palm

   

Dypsis cabadae

Cabada palm

   

Dypsis decaryi

Triangle palm

   

Dypsis decipiens

 Manambe palm

   

Dypsis florencei

Candy cane palm

Dypsis leptocheilos

Dypsis dariani, Teddy bear palm, Redneck palm

Dypsis lutescens

Butterfly palm

Elaies guineenis

African oil palm

Gaussia maya

 Maya palm

   

Hedyscepe canterburyana

Umbrella palm, Big mountain palm

   

Howea forsteriana Kentia palm, Thatch palm, Sentry palm

Hyophorbe lagenicaulis

Bottle palm

 

   

Hyophorbe verschaffeltii

Spindle palm

 

Johannesteijsmannia altifrons

Joey palm, Diamond joey palm

Johannesteijsmannia magnifica

Silver joey palm

   

Jubaea chilensis

Chilean wine palm, coquito palm

   

Kerriodoxa elegans

White elephant palm

   

Laccospadix australsica

Atherton palm

Latania lontaroides

Red Latan palm

 Licuala ramsayi

Australian Fan palm

Licuala spinosa

Spiny Licuala palm

Linospadix monostachya

Walking-Stick Palm

Livistona australis

Australian fan palm

Livistona chinensis

Chinese fan palm

   

Livistona decipiens

Ribbon fan palm, Weeping cabbage palm

   

Livistona muelleri

Dwarf fan palm

Livistona saribus

Taraw palm

Marojejya darianii

Darian palm

Metroxylon sagu

Sago palm

Nannorrhops ritchiana

Mazari palm

Normanbya normanbyi

Queensland black palm

   

Parajubaea cocoides

Quito coconut palm

Parajubaea torallyi

Bolivian Mountain Coconut Palm

Phoenix canariensis

Canary Island date palm

Phoenix dactylifera

Date palm

   

Phoenix reclinata

Senegal date palm

   

Phoenix roebelenii

Pygmy date palm

   

Phoenix rupicola

Cliff date palm

   

Phoenix sylvestris

Silver date palm

   

Phoneix theophrasti

Cretan date palm

   

Pinanga coronata

Ivory cane palm, Coronata Palm

   

Pinanga gracilis

Himalayan Pinanga

   

Pinanga kuhlii

Ivory Cane Palm

   

Polyandrococos caudescens

Buri Palm

   

Pritchardia beccariana

Loulu palm

 

Pritchardia hillebrandii

Hillebrand palm

Pritchardia martii

Koolau range pritchardia, Lo'ulu hiwa

Ptychosperma elegans

Solitaire palm

   

Ptychosperma macarthurii

Macarthur Palm

   

Ravenea hildebrandtii

Dwarf majesty palm

   

Ravenea rivularis

Majesty palm

   

Reinhardtia gracilis

Window palm

Rhapidophyllum hystrix

Needle palm, porcupine palm, hedgehog palm, blue palmetto

Rhapis excelsa

Lady palm

   

Rhapis humilis

Slender lady palm

Rhapis multifida

Finger palm

   

Rhopalostylis baueri

Norfolk Island palm

Rhopalostylis sapida

Nikau palm, Shaving brush palm

   

Roystonea oleracea

South American, Venezuelan Royal Palm

   

Roystonea regia

Cuban, Florida royal palm

   

Sabal causiarum

Puerto Rican hat palm

   

Sabal minor

dwarf palmetto

   

Sabal palmetto

Cabbage palm, Cabbage palmetto,  Carolina palmetto

   

Sabal  "Riverside"

   

Sabal  uresana

Savannah Palmetto

   

Serenoa repens

Saw palmetto

   

Syagrus amara

Overtop palm

Syagrus coronata

Licury palm

Syagrus romanzoffiana

Queen palm

   

Syagrus schizophylla

Aricury Palm

Synecanthus fibrosus Jellybean palm

 

Thrinax radiata Florida Thatch Palm

 

Trachycarpus fortunei

Chinese fan palm, Chinese windmill palm, Chusan palm, windmill palm

   

Trithrinax acanthocoma

Spiny fiber palm

   

Veitchia merrillii

Manila palm

   

Washingtonia filifera

California fan palm, petticoat palm

   

Washingtonia robusta

Mexican fan palm, Washington Palm

   

Wodyetia bifurcata

Foxtail Palm

   

Zombia antillarum

Zombie palm

[BobbyinNY]

WOW.. this is a very informative thread.... Excellent Job, Joe with the list of the true botanical names..... I'm kinda mixed on this subject... While I think that the "common" name is obviously easier to use with everyday people, I still think the Botanical name is very important because it's the only name that doesn't change... The problem I have with common names is that there are too many of them for the same palm. If there was only one, than I think it would probably be used more frequently....

Perfect example is:  

Archontophoenix  alexandrae

Alexandra palm, Alexander palm, King Palm, King Alexander palm

[TooShort]

I think the common names are good because there easier to pronounce. Latin is not the language we speak around the house. Tomato/Tamato, Potato/Patato

[DoomsDave]

I agree that using the latin names give the user that scholarly gloss.  Note, by the way, that they do change, sometimes quite often.  (Archontophoenix used to be called "Seaforthia" . . . )

I like the idea of ID'ing the Madagascar palms by place names.  Ivovowo palm sounds totally cool!  I tell people it's named for the place it's found on the Big M.  

On the other hand, names like Teddy Bear and Red Neck get to be misleading when they are equally applicable to two distinct and different species.

Hmm.

Gotta think more about this.

dave

[Kim]

The problem with the common names becomes obvious when you look at the above list:  many have more than one common name and the names aren't universal; they tend to be regional.  Learn the latin name; use the common name with your buddies if you want, but learn the latin name.

Customer calling a palm dealer:  "Do you have any Hyophorbe verschaffeltiis in stock?"

Palm dealer:  "We only sell palm trees."

True story.

[TooShort]

(Kim @ Sep. 06 2006,13:03)

QUOTE

Customer calling a palm dealer:  "Do you have any Hyophorbe verschaffeltiis in stock?"

Palm dealer:  "We only sell palm trees."

True story.

Thats to funny

[bgl]

One of the more annoying common names must surely be 'Areca', used for Dypsis lutescens. This always leads to the automatic question (from me) "do you REALLY mean Areca, or are you referring to Dypsis lutescens?". (And then, if necessary, an explanation). An excellent case why common names should be avoided whenever possible. I can certainly understand that common names will always have their place, but it would seem to me that anyone who is serious about palms should also be interested in educating themselves about the "real" names. It's like a toddler, who may be using his or her own words for all sorts of stuff. After a couple of years, with more of a vocabulary, no need to use babytalk anymore!

[doubravsky]

Does Dypsis Baronii or Onilahensis have any common names yet? I like to tell those who could care less about Latin names the common ones, but i've never heard one for either.

[Jeff Searle]

(bgl @ Sep. 06 2006,15:06)

QUOTE

One of the more annoying common names must surely be 'Areca', used for Dypsis lutescens. This always leads to the automatic question (from me) "do you REALLY mean Areca, or are you referring to Dypsis lutescens?". (And then, if necessary, an explanation). An excellent case why common names should be avoided whenever possible. I can certainly understand that common names will always have their place, but it would seem to me that anyone who is serious about palms should also be interested in educating themselves about the "real" names. It's like a toddler, who may be using his or her own words for all sorts of stuff. After a couple of years, with more of a vocabulary, no need to use babytalk anymore!

I personally feel that common names have their place. Like Kim just stated, a common name might be used in one area, and then differently in another area. But...botanical names are a must if your in the trade, or you love to collect a few palms for your enjoyment, and just for the fact, to be able to "talk palms" with others.

   And Bo, I have met alot of "toddlers" that have come into my nursery over the years. if you know what I mean!

[TooShort]

(bgl @ Sep. 06 2006,15:06)

QUOTE

One of the more annoying common names must surely be 'Areca', used for Dypsis lutescens. This always leads to the automatic question (from me) "do you REALLY mean Areca, or are you referring to Dypsis lutescens?". (And then, if necessary, an explanation). An excellent case why common names should be avoided whenever possible. I can certainly understand that common names will always have their place, but it would seem to me that anyone who is serious about palms should also be interested in educating themselves about the "real" names. It's like a toddler, who may be using his or her own words for all sorts of stuff. After a couple of years, with more of a vocabulary, no need to use babytalk anymore!

Bottom line is, at the end of the day its still a palm whatever you call it. Latin or English and that goes for Tropicals also, why limit yourself :cool:

[tikitiki]

Most of the nurseries that sell palms around here have no idea about the common name, place of origin, cultral requirements, etc. It is safe to say if there is anything different showing up around here I know more about it than the nursery does. This is not a knock, I believe they just pickup different palms they think looks good to see if it will sell. Most of which is new to them but not to us. Lets face it, the people on this board  are the die hard palm nuts and may prefer the genus and the species but  the majority of the time its comes off as pompus and showing off. Then there are the new species that are to be discovered waiting for a proper name. Who names those. Then who renames them when they are discovered to be a hybrid/ variation. you must have common names for the masses. They have as much a place in taxon as the Genus and species        (case sensitive).

[Alan_Tampa]

If the common name is unique to a particular plant, fine.  If a name is used for a dozen palms, and those concerned with making sure the person asking clearly understands that this is Areca and not Areca, and since we cannot talk in italics the logical solution is to refer to the appropriate moniker.

At the end of the day, and early morning too, a mini van is not a truck.

and a Traveler's Palm is in the Strelitziaceae.

Alan

[Walter John]

I can't believe this topic is here so soon after mine. RLR will haunt me for sure.

[TooShort]

(Alan_Tampa @ Sep. 06 2006,17:53)

QUOTE

If the common name is unique to a particular plant, fine.  If a name is used for a dozen palms, and those concerned with making sure the person asking clearly understands that this is Areca and not Areca, and since we cannot talk in italics the logical solution is to refer to the appropriate moniker.

At the end of the day, and early morning too, a mini van is not a truck.

and a Traveler's Palm is in the Strelitziaceae.

Alan

There are more homeowners and landscapers than there are palm collectors. Your argument dosen`t  hold water, therefore common names takes precedence

Vans are a whole different plant than a truck

[tikitiki]

Alan,

Is this what you were talking about? Or where you refering to Ravenala madagascariensis? I'm not sure. Maybe if you would have refered to the Genus, species or the common name we would have a better understanding. Maybe a picture. Maybe we could all use the family name to rid ourselves of confusion. So lets refer only to Arecaceae (palm family) when asking about a perticular plant.

Strelitziaceae (K. Schum.) Hutch.

Habit and leaf form. Medium sized to giant herbs, or trees (then unbranched, palmlike). Rhizomatous. Leaves medium-sized to very large; alternate; distichous; petiolate; sheathing. Leaf sheaths tubular to not tubular; with free margins. Leaves simple. Lamina entire (but often tearing or fragmenting along the veins); pinnately veined (pinnate-parallel).

General anatomy. Plants with silica bodies (spherical in the hypodermis, and as druses adjacent to the vascular bundles).

Leaf anatomy. Epidermis without silica bodies. Stomata present; weakly cyclocytic. Hairs absent.

The mesophyll containing mucilage cells (with raphides); containing calcium oxalate crystals. The mesophyll crystals raphides. Minor leaf veins without phloem transfer cells (Strelitzia). Vessels absent.

Stem anatomy. Secondary thickening absent. Xylem with vessels, or without vessels. Vessel end-walls scalariform.

Root anatomy. Root xylem with vessels; vessel end-walls scalariform, or scalariform and simple (then mainly scalariform).

Reproductive type, pollination. Unisexual flowers absent. Plants hermaphrodite. Floral nectaries present. Nectar secretion from the gynoecium (via septal nectaries). Pollination entomophilous (?), or ornithophilous, or cheiropterophilous.

Inflorescence, floral, fruit and seed morphology. Flowers aggregated in ‘inflorescences’; in panicles. The terminal inflorescence unit cymose. Inflorescences scapiflorous; terminal, or axillary; thyrses, with one to several lateral, distichously arranged cincinni, each (or only one) of these subtended by a large, stiff, lanceolate or boat-shaped and usually brightly coloured bract; spatheate. Flowers bracteate; very irregular; zygomorphic (with the inner tepals variously specialized); cyclic; pentacyclic. Perigone tube absent.

Perianth of ‘tepals’; 6; joined (the outer members free, the inner joined, the laterals to each other and the median either joined to them basally only, or free); 2 whorled (the median member of the outer whorl abaxial (anterior)); anisomerous; petaloid; different in the two whorls (the members of the inner whorl free or more or less adnate to those of the inner whorl; the two laterals of the inner whorl larger than the median (adaxial, posterior) one, and in Strelitzia these two inner laterals strongly asymmetrical and connivent, forming a large, bilaterally symmetrical arrow-shaped organ that enfolds the filaments and style).

Androecium (5–)6. Androecial members free of the perianth; free of one another; 2 whorled (3+3 or 3+2). Androecium exclusively of fertile stamens, or including staminodes. Staminodes usually 1 (representing the median member of the inner whorl, adjacent to the adaxial ‘petal’); in the same series as the fertile stamens and internal to the fertile stamens. Stamens 6 (Ravenala), or 5; diplostemonous; alterniperianthial; filantherous (the filaments filiform, long). Anthers basifixed (?); dehiscing via longitudinal slits. Microsporogenesis successive. Pollen grains nonaperturate (‘omniaperturate’, almost lacking exine but with a thick intine); 2-celled.

Gynoecium 3 carpelled. Carpels isomerous with the perianth. The pistil 3 celled. Gynoecium syncarpous; synstylovarious, or eu-syncarpous; inferior. Ovary 3 locular. Gynoecium stylate. Styles 1; apical; much longer than the ovary (filiform). Stigmas 1, or 3 (the style terminating in three linear, stigmatic lobes). Placentation axile. Ovules 20–50 per locule (‘many’); arillate; anatropous; bitegmic; crassinucellate. Outer integument contributing to the micropyle. Embryo-sac development Polygonum-type. Polar nuclei fusing prior to fertilization. Antipodal cells formed; 3; not proliferating; ephemeral. Synergids pear-shaped. Endosperm formation nuclear.

Fruit non-fleshy; dehiscent; a capsule. Capsules loculicidal. Seeds endospermic. Perisperm present. Seeds conspicuously hairy (via the aril), or not conspicuously hairy; surrounded by a conspicuous, laciniate-lobed or densely hairy aril. Embryo well differentiated. Cotyledons 1 (massive). Embryo straight. Testa operculate; without phytomelan.

Seedling. Hypocotyl internode absent. Mesocotyl absent. Seedling collar conspicuous. Cotyledon hyperphyll compact; non-assimilatory. Coleoptile present. Seedling cataphylls present. First leaf dorsiventral. Primary root persistent.

Physiology, biochemistry. Not cyanogenic. Proanthocyanidins present, or absent (Ravenala); in Strelitzia, cyanidin. Flavonols present (Strelitzia), or absent (Ravenala); when present, kaempferol and quercetin. Ellagic acid absent.

Geography, cytology. Paleotropical, Neotropical, and Cape. Sub-tropical to tropical. Central and tropical South America, West Indies, South Africa, Madagascar. X = 7, 8, 11.

Taxonomy. Subclass Monocotyledonae. Superorder Zingiberiflorae; Zingiberales. APG (1998) Monocot; Commelinoid group; Zingiberales. Species 7. Genera 3; Phenakospermum, Ravenala, Strelitzia.

[palmazon]

Washingtonia = tiki

[deezpalms]

(Kim @ Sep. 06 2006,10:03)

QUOTE

The problem with the common names becomes obvious when you look at the above list:  many have more than one common name and the names aren't universal; they tend to be regional.  Learn the latin name; use the common name with your buddies if you want, but learn the latin name.

Customer calling a palm dealer:  "Do you have any Hyophorbe verschaffeltiis in stock?"

Palm dealer:  "We only sell palm trees."

True story.

How sad!!! A palm dealer that doesn't know that latin names?? DUH!!  

[deezpalms]

(palmazon @ Sep. 07 2006,10:32)

QUOTE

Washingtonia = tiki

hahahahahahaaaaaaa!!! So true!! I sell palms for a living and I get calls EVERYDAY from people wanting to sell their mexi-fans!

I tell them all the same thing. " The cost to remove the tree out weighs the value of the tree. Try calling some local tiki makers. At least all you'll have at that point is a stump!! "

[doubravsky]

When I was in high school 20 some yrs. ago my dad suggested I begin pulling and potting some of the bazillion mexi-fan (tiki) seedlings that appeared all over our orange groves to sell to local nurseries.

I couldn't give them away.

Now I carve 'em up and get more free trunks than I know what to do with.

[Alan_Tampa]

That is the whole idea, without the the required specificity the common name can be misleading and create misunderstanding, thus this is where therein the problem  lies.  That was the whole idea. Geez.

Also, the common name was right there otherwise how could you respond thus. Geez x 2!

Alan

[TooShort]

Again to the average homeowner who wants to add some palms to there landscape only know palms by there common name. The nursery owner knows both and most of the landscapers know the common. So with this in mine common names of palms and plants far outway the latin names. Knowing the latin names is great, but having a conversation with your neighbor about palms and telling him this is a $#&^ and he knows it as a foxtail is just confusion. Almost every nursery I have visited all go by common names because that what sells. Like I said before there are more people out there that don`t know the latin names of palms, and to be honest they don`t care to know. There is no way this will ever change, this is a isolated topic between the palm tree huggers

[chris78]

Common name for palm, for the ave person is PALM. The real smart ave joe knows a fan palm or feather palm.  Then there are the real smart joe who uses names like Queen palm or date palm or California palm...

For that matter the ave person is only interested in growing what he see's his neighbor growing. So there is not that many common names to remember since most areas only have a handfull of common palms that are generally planted.

Common names are great for someone not into plants. Like auto machanic, for the common guy all I need to tell them is that they need a water pump replaced, but when I go to buy one I better have more info than "I need a water pump"

Common names have little use for anyone into plants or science, they are as usefull as any nicknames or slang would be. I would be like giving my nickname to a policeman for him to ID me. And I have many nicknames, it all depends on which one of my friends you talk too.

While I may talk slang to friends, my boss would not be amused if I started writing business letters full of slang. Slang like common names change and mean different things depending where in the world you are.... and DO NOT HAVE UNIVERSAL AGREEDED MEANINGS. That why we have scientific names...its like standard english. Slang english may have local meaning but take it to another part of the country or world and they may not have a clue what I am tryng to say.

Thats were standard english helps

An areca palm to someone in India may be different than an areca palm to someone in Florida, but if they use the standard scientific name like Areca catechu or Dypsis lutescens there is less confession on what plant they are talking about.

With some plant, there common names are more universal,  like apple tree, mango tree, rose, cotton etc etc etc but with others it's not. Last year I was chatting with someone about bombax trees on line, we soon learn that we were talking about two very different trees....THE PROBLEM, WELL THERE ARE SOME MANY TREES THAT ARE CALLED BOMBAX. It took us a whole month to ID his tree because the person who sold him the tree only told him it was a bombax tree without the science name....and yeh it was not the bombax he wanted!!!!! OH WELL.....

Science names are very importent when dealing with palms, unlike an apple tree which almost everyone knows what it is. An majesty palm or buccaneer palm is not know to the ave gardner, no less the ave joe. And like I said to the ave joe a palm is a palm and thats is it...

Like one ave joe said "I HATE PALMS, NEVER WILL I EVER PLANT ONE IN MY YARD"

well sir, what kind of tree you want? "WELL I LOVE DATES, I WANT A DATE TREE"

[Dave Butler]

I also noticed that common names of palms are used more. Botanical names have there place in books and with the Palm enthusiasts.

I think we are all off the subject of this topic

[Walter John]

(Wal @ Sep. 07 2006,08:04)

QUOTE

I can't believe this topic is here so soon after mine. RLR will haunt me for sure.

Time to play "Fanfare for the common name" by Emerson Lake and Palmer.

[cfkingfish]

I will say for the most part, I am not a fan of common names, except for when palms have not been scientifically named in the first place. Common names are used in large nurseries and big box stores. If you want to purchase seed of any palm, it is best to know the scientific name.

Inasmuch, knowing the scientific name will help someone understand its "place" within the realm of palms. If a palm planter knows that the Bottle and Spindle are both in the Hyophorbe genus, not only would he know that the seeds are pig food, but that the palms were related. Another common palm, Ravenea rivularis, begs for attention. "Rivularis" in Latin is the genitive form for river. Genitive declension in Latin is the possesive form of the noun, meaning "of the". Hence, rivularis means "of the river". Unfortunatlely, we see Majesty palms, Ravenea rivularis, that are planted in raised beds with no understanding that they belong drenched in water almost continuously if they are to look well at all outside of habitat. Hence, knowing the Latin/Greek name for the palm can help greatly in care for it.

[aussiearoids]

Woody is sometimes used as a common name for Wodyetia bifurcata , suppose its quicker to say than 'Foxtail'

[BobbyinNY]

  Quote

Again to the average homeowner who wants to add some palms to there landscape only know palms by there common name. The nursery owner knows both and most of the landscapers know the common. So with this in mine common names of palms and plants far outway the latin names. Knowing the latin names is great, but having a conversation with your neighbor about palms and telling him this is a $#&^ and he knows it as a foxtail is just confusion. Almost every nursery I have visited all go by common names because that what sells. Like I said before there are more people out there that don`t know the latin names of palms, and to be honest they don`t care to know. There is no way this will ever change, this is a isolated topic between the palm tree huggers

Joe,

I think you've got a point - being very regional...  If everyone was located in the same area than the common name wouldn't be a problem. Like if everyone in Florida were talking amongst themselves, than the common name would be the same. However, on this board, the common name can become almost meaningless due to the fact that there are people all over the world with different names for the same plant.   I vote for the botanical name....

  Quote

I will say for the most part, I am not a fan of common names, except for when palms have not been scientifically named in the first place. Common names are used in large nurseries and big box stores. If you want to purchase seed of any palm, it is best to know the scientific name

Christian,

I don't even give the big box stores THAT much credit... Heck... HD over here just calls them all: "Tropical Foliage".. what a joke...    I can just hear the customer now... "How do I take care of my  Tropical foliage plant?? hahahhahahhaha.. Actually it's really not funny.

[Alan_Tampa]

As long as you are willing to further clarify which species of "palm" you are referring to common names are just ducky.  Wal in Australia (refers to Latin for "south" "south of" or something like that) is a common name user careful enough to use such names admirably, also as he is otherwise sane and also rather kind even when at odds with someone , for me, at least his use of common names is acceptable.  I may be pandering to Wal  because I appreciate his pictures and comments and presence here on the forum.  You can say whatever you want about it, but I am sincere.

Jerks, on the other hand, need to get some facts and use some logic (instead of opinion and half-ass logic) to present an argument with merit to convince chronic binomial users to change to common name references, otherwise you're just a pundit parrot.

Some common names are fun, and easier to spell and may even be worldwide in use.  The appropriate nomenclature is the cipher needed when a universal common name is not known.  

That being said it should be clear that a neighbor will get the common name and the Latin name whether he wants it or not. They either come back for more, or don't.

Alan

[TooShort]

(Alan_Tampa @ Sep. 08 2006,15:03)

QUOTE

Jerks, on the other hand, need to get some facts and use some logic (instead of opinion and half-ass logic) to present an argument with merit to convince chronic binomial users to change to common name references, otherwise you're just a pundit parrot.

Them some hard words are you having a bad day. Listen take it easy, sit down take a deep breath its only a forum.

Sounds like someone stole the prize out of your cracker jack box.

[Alan_Tampa]

Joe, You might be right, but it was not the cracker jack prize which was stolen, it was my Happy Meal surprise!

Was trying to get the idea across that a good idea in order to be acknowledged by others has to be presented in such a way so as to eclipse the older paradigm; without a valid and logical argument, it is an effort in futility.  The neighbor with the palm inquiry in this case, without a clue at all, would benefit no less by having the Latin name and the common name for said fictitious planting.  Also irksome was the idea that only 'palm huggers' use the appropriate nomenclature for organisms; this is not true at all and I find it rather odd such an idea exists.

The only downfall of using a common name is as I said, sometimes requiring clarification that the Latin would preclude.  Christian's comment on understanding the root of the  Latin name and how it further elucidates the character of a species beyond what many common names can.  I assume that anyone who frequents this board would at least have some interest in the proper name for a given species; this does not mean every person would use that name even if known but would not be confused by it either.

So this jerk has made an ass of himself, not the first time nor the last I fear, but I cannot contain myself at times.

Alan

[STEVE IN SO CAL]

I prefer botanical names when yapping with plant nuts like myself, but admit to "dumbing down" when talking to novices. I remember telling my wife that botanical names were "for snobs", and I wasn't going to use them as I started getting into palms. Now I use them all the time(even though I can't spell most of them right). No flash cards or sleep learning tapes...just absorbed them like a palm takes up NPK.

[Rusty on Pine Is.]

I think every post here has cogent points to be made, all of the imminently correct…..hmmmm, how can that be???

    Maybe there is some middle ground here, somewhere between the plethora of common names, and the equally confusing Latin nomenclature, that really isn’t allot better than common names (sometimes), especially when the taxonomists can’t seem to decide from one year to the next where a plant belongs…….

  ….like with Dypsis lutescens, which once was Chrysalidocarpus, or Dypsis decaryi which was once Neodypsis.

    But oh, that journey to the middle……when I was an arborist I felt it was my duty to make sure my clients knew the proper names for trees….and then I learned to keep my yap buttoned once I took notice of all the glazed over expressions…that deer in the headlights look that means “…shut up, we don’t really need this info…”

   I remember when an ex GF was walking around the gardens, and said, “Wow, look how big your banana palms are!!!”

    And then I remembered one of my favorite sayings:

“Never try to teach a pig to sing….it wastes your time and annoys the heck out of the pig”

    So in the end, I use both common names and bi-nomial nomenclature depending who I talk to…..as long as I know what the palm is, it doesn’t really matter what someone else calls it, does it?

[bgl]

This has been a real interesting topic, but reading Jeff's initial post (#1) it seems to me that not too many actually responded to the question that Jeff brought up (who came up with what common names)...!

[ghar41]

(bgl @ Sep. 09 2006,19:29)

QUOTE

This has been a real interesting topic, but reading Jeff's initial post (#1) it seems to me that not too many actually responded to the question that Jeff brought up (who came up with what common names)...!

I absolutely prefer botanical names because they are obviously more specific, therefor much more useful when discussing palms at the interest level we are at.  

The only exception I have is that I often refer to Kings and Queens because I hate writing out Syagrus

romanzoffiana and Archontophoenix cunninghamiana!  

Problem is:  the "real" common name for a "King" palm is the "Bangalow" or is it the "Piccabeen"....

How about the Sago Palm?  Metroxylon?  Cycas Revoluta?

Would the real Sago Palm please stand up!