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Sabal Pumos

NCpalmqueen

By NCpalmqueen
in DISCUSSING PALM TREES WORLDWIDE

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

Posted
Posted

Not much info on the web about this palm other than it is from Mexico.  Anyone growing it?  Photos? Cold tolerance?  Should I plant it or keep it in its pot?  I'm in z8 most of the time    :D

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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edbrown_III Grand Master

edbrown_III

Posted
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I ahve 2 plants from a seed collection trip to Mexico in 1994. They are nt real big but will send photos.---as I forgot about them. S. mexacanas and S. maritimas are growing faster . I think Merrill may have a few also as we split them up.

I will try to scan a few photos (them in habitat)but have to look through the archives.  

Mine havent been tested to the teens only 21 F or so. But perhaps Merrills have seen 17F (if his survived)

Best regards,

Ed

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Ed

I would love to see your photos.   No hurry.   You must be the only person growing these!!   :laugh:

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

Posted
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Hi, Ed and Cindy:

I have a problem!  My Sabal pumos may have been mixed up with Sabal roseii.  It's a long story, but these are the only two possiblities for this palm of ca. 10 ft height..  I understand  S. roseii  comes from hill country much like where Ed and I collected pumos.  Can anyone diagnose a photo of one about ten feet tall?  Ed, how tall are your pumos?  Best wishes, merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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edbrown_III Grand Master

edbrown_III

Posted
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Merrill

go ahead and email the photo if you like.

I will post what I have here. These 2 photos are of palms that were planted about 10 years or so ago

I lost track and the canopy grew over them in the back forty  Buckets are around them as they had been attacked by rabbits. Thye would probably be 10 feet tall if out in open and got fert and sunlight.  I will keep looking for the native photos of pumos

Best wishes,

Ed

post-562-1181147660_thumb.jpg

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SubTropicRay Grand Master

SubTropicRay

Posted
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S. pumos is not widely grown.  It is one of the less imposing Sabal species.

Tampa, Interbay Peninsula, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10A

Bokeelia, Pine Island, Florida, USA

subtropical USDA Zone 10B

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merrill Mentor

merrill

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Hi, Ray:

May we assume Sabal roseii is just as unimposing as Sabal pumos?  They are both of some interest because they both grow in real hill country, unlike our Sabal.  Nowhere else have I stood near the top of a hill and looked at another Sabal halfway down a quite steep hill and another at the bottom of the hill, a difference of a few hundred feet [pumos].  Don't know that I've been to the S.  roseii range.

Hi, Ed:

Have you and I been to the native range of S. roseii?  If not w/ you. I haven't!  I'll try to post my pumos/roseii.  Best Wishes,  merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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Ken Johnson Grand Master

Ken Johnson

Posted
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I grew a roseii that I got from FTBG. It looked so much like palmettoe that it made no impression and I planted it at a friends house. It has some trunk and a cool look but not to exciting.

I always wondered if it was the real deal and what they looked like in the wild. Any pics from Mex?

I DIG PALMS

Call me anytime to chat about transplanting palms.

305-345-8918

https://www.facebook...KenJohnsonPalms

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Ken

Thanks for the posting the photos.  I have a S.rosei as well....I'll have to put them side-by-side to note differences.  

What does one mean when it is said that a palm is unimposing?  A boring palm?

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

Posted
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Hi, Cindy:

My apologies for describing any palm as "unimposing".  I meant that it seemed to have no advantage in appearance over our S. palmetto.  What are the sizes of your S. roseii and S. pumos?  Best Wishes, merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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edbrown_3 Collaborator

edbrown_3

Posted
Posted

Merrill,

we went all through S. rosei country south of where Felix lived.   If the palm ever floweres you will know as the S. rosei has a very intricate branched inflourescens

the rachillae curl  etc.

I will look at Zona's monograph to see how closely it is to S. rosei.   It may  not be the hyperbole of the genus like S. domingensis or maritima but hazy memories of looking for it in Morelos hills are very fond.

Best regards,

Ed

Edwin Brown III

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Merrill

I put the rosei in the ground in the Spring.  I'm debating on whether to plant out the pumos as well.   However, the pumos has a much smaller trunk base, so I may chicken out and let it grow on further before planting.  I'll get some photos this weekend of both and post.

BTW, I planted out one of my jubxbutia F2's last Spring...it barely had a trunk to speak of and no character leaves at that time.  I gave it no heat protection over the winter but a cover to keep it dry.   It pushed up one bad leaf this Spring but is now  pushing up some nice green new leaves.  I was surprised how hardy such a small plant was.

At what size do you think a jxbxsyagrus could be planted out?

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

Posted
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Hi, Cindy:

I went to NC State, and remember snow in Raleigh.  Are there surviving Butia there?  What are the lowest temperatures in Raleigh?  According to my son's steel trap memory, my ([JXB]XB)XQueen has survived 10F when fairly small w/ no protection.

Hi, Ed:

My roseii/pumos is only about 8 feet tall.  Could I get you to post three photos, Please?  Best Wishes, merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Merrill

How neat that you went to school here.  Raleigh has grown tremendously (like other cities) since then, and sprawl is now out of control.   The heat island is growing with it as well.  I really don't know about old butias (say planted in the 1970's?) still being around.  We do have some old (maybe not 70's old) trachys and needles.  The 80's freezes here probably did most palms in....I don't know as I wasn't living here then.

We can drop down into the single digits here, but I haven't seen that for quite some time.  Since I've been growing palms (6+ yrs) my lowest low has been 11F.  Of course, I do protect any pseudo tender palms with covers, heat, or whatever it needs.   We can get snow here (usually a couple of inches/yr...last few winters hardly a trace)...ice storms are more of my nemesis!

That's great news that your jxbxbxqueen survived 10F!  I think I'll wait until mine gets stockier before planting.

I'd be glad to host any photos you need posting.

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Merrill

I went to the National Weather Service and got these stats for the record cold for Raleigh.  Records go back at least 60 yrs....

Lowest Lows for RDU:

October     10/27/62      19F

November  11/25/70      11

December   12/25/83      4

January       1/21/59       -9    brrrrrrr

February     2/5/96         0

March          3/1/80         11

And now you know why I protect my palms Dec/Jan/Feb each yr.

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

Posted
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Hi, Cindy:

QUOTING YOU:  January       1/21/59       -9    brrrrrrr.  END QUOTE

Think I was in Raleigh that day!  VERY small chance I was in Maryland, but that was well past Christmas Holiday.  merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Think I was in Raleigh that day!  VERY small chance I was in Maryland, but that was well past Christmas Holiday.  merrill

Merrill---That is funny!!!! :D The all time low and you were possibly here!

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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edbrown_III Grand Master

edbrown_III

Posted
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Merrill ,  send photos and I willpost

edbrown_3@bellsouth.net

I have to dig for my old mexican photos .   A teenager lives in the room now so it is pretty dirty even by my standards.  Tonite I will have a few drinks to get courage to sort through the debris clutter etc that used to be an old store room.

Best regards

Ed

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Here are Merrill's photos. He will post and describe.

161032585-L.jpg

161032591-L.jpg

161032594-L.jpg

161032599-L.jpg

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

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Hi, Cindy:

Thank you very much for posting those photos of S. roseii/pumos.  The first photo is in an area that had grown wild behind the much larger S. uresana, which is the same age.  The dead leaves were left on to give a better idea of the size.  S. uresana is not known as a fast grower; but it outgrew this S. r/p considerably..   This area containing S. roseii/pumos can be improved growth-wise; all the tall trees are to the North.

The second and third photos show the top of the trunk and the petiole bases of the S. roseii/pumos The surfaces near the cut petioles are covered with blackened fallen leaves of a citrus relative.

The fourth photo shows the emerging leaf.

Thanks to Ed's observations, perhaps we can identify this sabal when it blooms.   Many Thanks to Cindy.  merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Merrill

I gather then that pumos or rosei are very slow growers in your climate---in mine I can't even imagine.  I'll get a shot tonight of both side-by-side even though they are both small.  It may help you ID yours.

What do you know about butia eriospatha?  Temps? Soil?  Growth speed?  I plopped a small one in today but have no idea about its growing conditions.

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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merrill Mentor

merrill

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Hi, Cindy:

I have heard that B. eriospathe is cold-hardier than B. capitata etc., but B. yatay may also be a good candidate for cold-hardiness

This area containing S. roseii/pumos can perhaps be improved growth-wise; all the tall trees [except the S. uresana] are to the North.

Best Wishes, merrill

merrill, North Central Florida

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NCpalmqueen Rising Star

NCpalmqueen

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Merrill

Both of these are really small so I doubt you can distinguish anything from them.....

Sabal rosei

161520280-M.jpg

Sabal pumos in pot

161520380-L.jpg

161520320-L.jpg

C from NC

:)

Bone dry summers, wet winters, 2-3 days ea. winter in low teens.

Siler City, NC

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