Syagrus botryophora on Pico island in the Azores archipelago

[SoulofthePlace]

Received a ~15cm tall seedling from Spain and planted into a pot with good soil. Over a month later and no signs of any growth nor decline. Our summers are 25-27C every day (77-80F) and nights are around 70F. This is Pico island, in the Azores archipelago, with the warmest nights year round in Europe. I wonder if it takes a long time to establish its roots? Most other palms, including slow growers planted on the same day, already showing signs of growth. Even the slow Copernicias are showing signs of growth.

[Pal Meir]

What do you mean with "good soil"? Lorenzi et al. (2004: 209): "… em solos argilosos lateríticos."

And one ore more photos would also be helpful!

[SoulofthePlace]

Good soil means I made it by hand, a mix of clean compost, a little perlite, very rich soil from nature, sand, peat from bags I grow subtropical palms for almost 10 years now. Just the tropical palms are new to me. By "good soil" I meant that I did not use potting soil or some substrate preloaded with fertilizer since I am not novice. Thank you for your input.

I am not attaching a photo as it is a regular (rather boring) seedling, nothing special, no browning and no new growth. No.. I am wrong, it has two green leaves and two completely browned ones, but it arrived that way and is not declining any further.

Edited August 30, 2015 by SoulofthePlace

[Pal Meir]

Photos would be helpful, as we can see e.g. if the size of the pot is adequate, the palm was planted too deep, etc. And also the colour of the leaves might be of interest. And if you post photos the feedback will certainly increase.

[Kai]

It depends on how much the roots suffered from transplanting. When the plant turns into "shock" it can take up to many months of no above ground growth. I once had to divide a rootball of 2 phoenix seedlings and one Syagrus schizophylla. This damaged the roots a lot and I didn't think the Syagrus would survive. For 6 months there was no change above ground. After these 6 months growth started again which confirmed me that its roots are healthy again. Patience is the key here.

[SoulofthePlace]

Photos attached for Syagrus. Also will attach photos for the other threads I posted. I hope the photos will show up as it is complicated to upload photos on this website:

http://postimg.org/image/ak9e14ffx/

http://postimg.org/image/huiggm7c3/

http://postimg.org/image/d5rswphez/

http://postimg.org/image/knuq6im4h/

"You are not allowed to use that image extension on this community."

"Sorry, but you have posted more images than you are allowed to"

Hmmm, not an easy forum to post images to... :-))

UPDATE: I tried all kinds of "allowed" methods, but... I hope these images are fine to view? I am used to forums where you simply attach an image in one step :-)

It's too hard to find out a method how to post a thumbnail. I just don't have enough time. But I hipe all will be fine and I won't be banned for posting win a wrong format.

Hopefully they will make it easier in the future, to post images.

If it was easy to upload images I think these forums would benefit with more images and discussion. And I am a webmaster. Imagine how PC novice users are struggling...

OK, these are photos of SYB marked palm seedling as per above.

Thanks for your advise, comments, opinions, inputs etc.

Edited August 30, 2015 by SoulofthePlace

[SoulofthePlace]

Let's try this method also, as a test :-)

">http://http://postimg.org/image/ak9e14ffx/'>

[SoulofthePlace]

Testing this: http://s16.postimg.org/7wgk00ccl/DSC04234.jpg

[SoulofthePlace]

It depends on how much the roots suffered from transplanting. When the plant turns into "shock" it can take up to many months of no above ground growth. I once had to divide a rootball of 2 phoenix seedlings and one Syagrus schizophylla. This damaged the roots a lot and I didn't think the Syagrus would survive. For 6 months there was no change above ground. After these 6 months growth started again which confirmed me that its roots are healthy again. Patience is the key here.

That's what I thought also, patience. I will now know, to stay cooll for 6 months, or more :-) Baie dankie. :-)

[Jim in Los Altos]

Please also note that S. botryophora need considerable warmth to grow much. In the tropics they grow very fast. Mine only adds one or two leaves per year in my climate. It's pinnate and about three feet tall. It also yellows out by the end of winter. These palms like constant warmth.

[Pal Meir]

Go to
(1) "More Reply Options"
(2) "Choose Files" (make them smaller by reducing the jpg quality to 30% or so)
(3) "Add to Post"
(4) "Preview Post"
(5) "Add Reply"

[Pal Meir]

I think the pots you chose are a too big. – Cut off the dried leaves. Mark the spear with a felt-tip. – As I can see the newest leaf/spear has a longer brown stain. This may be due to the transport. I would not wait 6 months with replanting.

[Kai]

Pots are quite large for such small seedlings. The plants will be investing all their energy to the roots because of all the space. Above ground growth can take longer that way, no harm done though...if you have time...

[Pal Meir]

I would recommend you the size of the pots I used e.g. for Syagrus insignis (here with an 1 year old seedling): 8×8×9 cm.

[SoulofthePlace]

Please also note that S. botryophora need considerable warmth to grow much. In the tropics they grow very fast. Mine only adds one or two leaves per year in my climate. It's pinnate and about three feet tall. It also yellows out by the end of winter. These palms like constant warmth.

Very good advise, our climates are somehow similar. Not enough heat. Must choose palms accordingly to the amount of heat as well. Not just absence of frost... I must remember that, but it still good to test them in our climate. To expect no positive surprises though. Thanks.

[SoulofthePlace]

I would recommend you the size of the pots I used e.g. for Syagrus insignis (here with an 1 year old seedling): 8×8×9 cm.

Syagrus insignis 1 year 2015-02-13.jpg

Yes, the pot size. So many factors as heat, cold, pot size, and I never paid attention to soil acidity yet.... this is why I like easy to grows plants that grow reasonably fa(s)t. :-)

Edited August 30, 2015 by SoulofthePlace

[SoulofthePlace]

Go to

(1) "More Reply Options"

(2) "Choose Files" (make them smaller by reducing the jpg quality to 30% or so)

(3) "Add to Post"

(4) "Preview Post"

(5) "Add Reply"

DSC04232.jpg

DSC04233.jpg

DSC04234.jpg

Oh wow, there IS an attachment option, I just never noticed the very light "More Reply Options" button. :-)

[Pal Meir]

I would recommend you the size of the pots I used e.g. for Syagrus insignis (here with an 1 year old seedling): 8×8×9 cm.

Syagrus insignis 1 year 2015-02-13.jpg

Yes, the pot size. So many factors as heat, cold, pot size, and I never paid attention to soil acidity yet.... this is why I like easy to grows plants that grow reasonably fa(s)t. :-)

In case you have problems to get such small 8x8x9cm pots on your island I have still a couple of used ones that I can send you by mail:

[SoulofthePlace]

I would recommend you the size of the pots I used e.g. for Syagrus insignis (here with an 1 year old seedling): 8×8×9 cm.

Syagrus insignis 1 year 2015-02-13.jpg

Yes, the pot size. So many factors as heat, cold, pot size, and I never paid attention to soil acidity yet.... this is why I like easy to grows plants that grow reasonably fa(s)t. :-)

In case you have problems to get such small 8x8x9cm pots on your island I have still a couple of used ones that I can send you by mail:

Teku 8x8x9cm.jpg

Thank you for your kindness, I will see what we got available on the island. I brought all my pots even huge containers in a sea container. I have some tiny pots as well. Am waiting for seeds from Germany for almost a month now and I am afraid the PT Customs may have confiscated them again, which may happen to used pots as well. Hard to get full answers from the Customs as well. I'll keep in mind if they allow me to import pots, then later I'll ask you. Thanks.

[Pal Meir]

Of course I would wash and clean the pots before sending.

[SoulofthePlace]

Of course I would wash and clean the pots before sending.

I did not mean that :-) I have about 20-30 small ones for now and that is good for now as I am a collector. I appreciate your offer to help and I will keep in mind. I don't want you to incur shipping charges, I would pay the shipping if I need more pots. Thanks.

Have you tried growing Needle palm in Germany? Those are hardy to zone 6. Also Jubaea chilensis, Trachycarpus wagnerianus outside in the ground? Heidelberg is it 7A or 7B? I mean lowest temps -18C or -15C. The it depends also on how hot the days get and how long the freeze lasts. I used to live in zone 8A very close to 7B and was struggling growing anything but maybe 4 varieties of palms and that was 33 degrees from Equator.

[SoulofthePlace]

I am attaching a photo of an Azorean Native. There are literally hundreds or even thousands of them living around. No wonder, no mosquitoes.

[Pal Meir]

Of course I would wash and clean the pots before sending.

I did not mean that :-) I have about 20-30 small ones for now and that is good for now as I am a collector. I appreciate your offer to help and I will keep in mind. I don't want you to incur shipping charges, I would pay the shipping if I need more pots. Thanks.

Have you tried growing Needle palm in Germany? Those are hardy to zone 6. Also Jubaea chilensis, Trachycarpus wagnerianus outside in the ground? Heidelberg is it 7A or 7B? I mean lowest temps -18C or -15C. The it depends also on how hot the days get and how long the freeze lasts. I used to live in zone 8A very close to 7B and was struggling growing anything but maybe 4 varieties of palms and that was 33 degrees from Equator.

I have tried Rhapidophyllum, but also only in pots; here a plant 3 years 9 months since germination:

Our climate is not good for Rhapidophyllum and also Sabal. The problem is that we have very inconsistent weather here, e.g. this summer we had some days with almost 40°C, but a couple of days later only highs (!) of 13°C. And during the end of January 2012 the temps rose over +20°C and fall down in February to almost -20°C with freezes lasting until April. The only palms which can suffer this climate seem to be Trachycarpus fortunei and T. wagnerianus, on some places also Chamaerops humilis, which has the stronger roots but the weaker leaves and meristem. Here a pic of a young T. wagnerianus, since April 2007 outdoors in Heidelberg: