Cassias, and other tropical tress

[LJG]

I think I know the answer I will get but I will try here to see if there are any updates as most online data is old. Also, webjungles is down to go ask.

Is anyone in SoCal attempting these:

Cassia bakeriana - Dwarf Apple Blossom Tree,

Cassia grandis - Coral Shower

Cassia marginata - Red Shower Tree

Cassia roxburghii - Red Cassia

I am trying other tropical trees (Cassia and others) that are suppose to not survive here, yet I have seen full grown, flower trees here. So I figured if they could make it, why not these?

With my other borderline tropical trees, I will be investing time into the growth before planting out. I figure it will take 3 - 5 years to get a nice size trunk to plant out. So during Dec - Feb, I will greenhouse them.

Anyone try these or some others that are borderline? Any tips?

Ken, I know you will read this. I saw Gary and LHN. He said you sent him some seed he forgot the name of. he would not sell the trees yet. He said the genus started with  a "P" and he thinks it was a "Yellow Jacaranda". Looking online, the two hints do not link up.

[fastfeat]

Hey Len--

Glad you made it up to Laguna Hills to meet Gary. Did you pick up your Delonix and Cassia fistula? Did he have any Bulnesias going yet?

I think the seed he's referring to is Peltophorum. It's sometimes called "Yellow Poinciana", though that name is better used to describe the yellow form of Delonix regia. I sent him seed of both Peltophorum dubium and P. pterocarpum, both of which are vastly under-utilized in SoCal. There are large, spectacular P. dubium in Balboa Park and a smaller one at Quail. There's also a large (50'+) P. pterocarpum at LA Arboretum. I have seeds of both I can send you if you don't want to wait for Gary's (though he's probably a year ahead of you).

Peltophorum dubium in Largo, FL (a little washed out here--really as yellow as McDonald's arches...:

As for the Cassias, I don't know of anyone except probably Leon at XOTC-Tropico in West Hollywood who grows the species you mention. (He doesn't have a website, but you can Google his nursery for his #) He grows mostly small stuff and is pricey, but he has the rarest stuff in SoCal.

I haven't seen any of those species of any size in SoCal except C. grandis at Fullerton Arboretum. I'd imagine the others are probably similar in their needs and hardiness (lots of heat, little frost, dislike of cold, wet soil).

If I hadn't seen the C. grandis at Fullerton, I wouldn't think it would have a chance in CA; maybe the others would make it under similar conditions.

Cassia grandis at Fullerton:

I sent a small C. bakeriana to a buddy in Monrovia, where it survived last Winter in the low 20s with a little protection, so maybe...

[LJG]

Thanks Ken. Yes, it was Peltophorum dubium. He will have some available next spring. From what I read, it is a good grower here.

[Fouquieria]

Hi Len,

I have tried some of the trees you mention.  I have a small Peltophorum pterocarpum in the ground.  It has survived the past few winters in the ground.  Same goes for a Peltophorum africanum.  If I watered them more in summer they would have probably put on more growth.  I've also had a Cassia fistula in a large pot for a number of years.  I'll probably put that out this coming spring.  I had two very small seedlings each of Cassia grandis, Cassia javanica, and Cassia nodosa that I thought had expired this winter but one of them is coming back from the roots (don't know which one).  I also have a Cassia moschata (my favorite) that has come back from the roots.  I have two Caesalpinia peltophoroides that I grew from seed.  The one I planted out last year (which was the largest seedling) hasn't really done much at all, but it hasn't died either.  The other one grew really well in the heat of summer...however this is the one I gave a lot of water and feeding to.

One of these days I would like to try the Cassia angolensis that Ken posted pics of from Fullerton.

Besides those, I'm trying some Tabebuias that I've started from seed.  This last Spring I finally planted out a T. roseo-alba.  It kept wilting in the heat of summer but seems to be doing ok.  It's about two feet tall.  Same for a Deplanchea.  I planted one of those nearby and it's about two feet tall.  I've been real frugal with the water this past Summer but think I'll be more generous next year.  I don't think my Delonix elata made it.  Last year it was growing like crazy and didn't leaf out this year.  Sometimes I think you have to dig the holes big enough, and amend the soil so that it's friable enough.  I have a tendency to get lazy and take things for granted.

One last note--two trees that come back reliably every year and seem to be very drought tolerant (because I water them minimally) are the Fernandoa (not certain exactly which species yet) and the Bolusanthus (although it's slow growing).

-Ron-

[LJG]

Hi Ron, thanks for replying. I think you are a few years ahead of me. When I do research online on tropicals, I always see your name come up.

Ron, were your Cassia seedlings left outside? They went below freezing in Jan? Have you ever winterized them to try and get them

I have 4 seed grown Bolusanthus speciosus that I germinated this spring. They are slow. So slow I decided to buy 2 15s.

[Peter]

Ron, don't forget your Stemmadenia littoralis...  I've also got Caesalpinia peltophoroides(thanks Ron!) and it saw 20d last year with no problems. It's still small and pretty slow, but when it grows up I think it will be a real winner-I know several nursery owners in South Florida who are growing it with the idea that it will be a great tree down there.   I've found it responds to lots of water and as much heat as it can get(same as my C. ferrea).   I'm also growing Dillenia indica; this one has surprised me as I've had it in the ground for 3 winters now.  No damage until last year when I had a few inches of the tip die back and it defoliated; it's come back fine this summer.  Nice big, serrated leaves, but again, it's been a slow grower and I don't really think it will be a tree here, but who knows.

[fastfeat]

Peter--

Surprised to hear about Dillenia doing well in SoCal! That's pretty amazing, esp. with all the cold last winter. Any pics you can post?

[Peter]

Here it is last summer before the freeze:

And this summer-the leaves are smaller and it's now branched after defoliating and some tip die-off:

I got it on a whim from Pacific Tropical Gardens in Hawaii for $8, thinking that it would probably last for one summer.

[fastfeat]

Cool. How low a temp did it see last Winter?

[Peter]

20d, under the eaves.  I should point out that I'm also on a steep hill and seem to be able to tolerate colder temps than most due to excellent air and soil drainage.

[LJG]

Ron, can I ask where you bought your T. roseo-alba?

[Fouquieria]

Len, I grew it from seed that I got from a lady in Australia.

-Ron-

[jenks]

I had Cassia roxburghii I grew from seed. It handled last winter (in a pot) but died this summer after a mite attack. After reading that some of Ron's came back from the roots, I am kicking myself for yanking  my roxburghii without giving it a chance to come back:(