Terminalia species for SoCal, Arizona?

[fastfeat]

Does anyone have any experience growing any Terminalia species in SoCal, Arizona or other Mediterranean, desert climates? There are four listed in Mathias as Zone 9 trees (T. arenicola, T. ferdinandiana, T. sericea, T. sericocarpa); there may well be others in the 150 spp. genus. I've never seen any used in CA, but think some could make good candidates.

What is the farthest north anyone has had success with any species?

[chris78]

The only Terminalia sps I have gotten to grow in Arizona is Terminalia arjuna but I have only tried Terminalia arjuna and Terminalia catappa (tropical almond)...

Terminalia catappa (tropical almond) proved to be to tropical in its requirements.

Terminalia arjuna on the other hand is quite cold hardy, mine has taken 18F and was damage by 1/3 and they recovered quickly. Its fast growing and drought tolerent and is everygreen unless it get too cold and it will drop most or all it leaves. They tolerate full sun and part shade. I got 3 trees the largest is about 30 feet. I was interested in growing it because it develops a buttress trunk wanted that rainforest look

Also this last year I notice my largest one had seeds

Edited January 10, 2012 by chris78

[ariscott]

Where is arjuna from? Indonesia? Or india?

[fastfeat]

The only Terminalia sps I have gotten to grow in Arizona is Terminalia arjuna but I have only tried Terminalia arjuna and Terminalia catappa (tropical almond)...

Terminalia catappa (tropical almond) proved to be to tropical in its requirements.

Terminalia arjuna on the other hand is quite cold hardy, mine has taken 18F and was damage by 1/3 and they recovered quickly. Its fast growing and drought tolerent and is everygreen unless it get too cold and it will drop most or all it leaves. They tolerate full sun and part shade. I got 3 trees the largest is about 30 feet. I was interested in growing it because it develops a buttress trunk wanted that rainforest look

Also this last year I notice my largest one had seeds

Thanks Chris. Does it pretty much sit during the winter and race along in the heat of summer?

[fastfeat]

Where is arjuna from? Indonesia? Or india?

Ari--

It's Indian.

Can become massive in SoFla.

[ariscott]

Thanks Ken. Pity there is no photo of the whole tree... I might google later on when I have more time... I like terminalia. I only have 2, catappa and the native macrocarpa. I wish I could find more... I got a seed before given to me (one seed), but it died for no reason at all. How disappointing...

Regards, Ari

[tropicbreeze]

T. ferdinandiana and T. sericocarpa are native here so they're monsoonal climate plants, heavy rain and waterlogging in summer, very dry in winter.

[bahia]

Ken, no direct experience with growing Terminalia catappa here in California, but I can tell you that it might just be doable in the low deserts of California except in a colder winter. I saw this planted out fairly frequently in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, where it can get down to the low 40'sF daytime in cold spells, and dip down to a short freeze at night in winter. Admittedly, they didn't like it, and it very seldom froze there, but they'd bounce back and regrow from damaged tips. They would also tend to defoliate with prolonged cold in Riyadh, which was an infrequent occurrence. The key thing was that they really responded to the desert heat as long as they got water, and of course grew so much better along the coasts there, where it never got as cold. T. catappa is such a beautiful tree, I loved seeing very large old trees right along the coast in Salvador, Brazil, especially when they did the red foliage thing. I seem to recall that Riyadh is about the same latitude as Miami...

Edited January 11, 2012 by bahia

[ariscott]

Zig, i thought they rename sericocarpa to mcrocarpa? And where can i get ferdinandiana from?

[fastfeat]

Ken, no direct experience with growing Terminalia catappa here in California, but I can tell you that it might just be doable in the low deserts of California except in a colder winter. I saw this planted out fairly frequently in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, where it can get down to the low 40'sF daytime in cold spells, and dip down to a short freeze at night in winter. Admittedly, they didn't like it, and it very seldom froze there, but they'd bounce back and regrow from damaged tips. They would also tend to defoliate with prolonged cold in Riyadh, which was an infrequent occurrence. The key thing was that they really responded to the desert heat as long as they got water, and of course grew so much better along the coasts there, where it never got as cold. T. catappa is such a beautiful tree, I loved seeing very large old trees right along the coast in Salvador, Brazil, especially when they did the red foliage thing. I seem to recall that Riyadh is about the same latitude as Miami...

Thanks for that info. I really don't think there's much chance of T. catappa succeeding anywhere in coastal CA, but perhaps near Salton Sea or even down say, in extreme South Texas maybe?

I'd also think that some of the African species would hold some promise in CA. Haven't been able to find any evidence of any attempted introductions though.

[bahia]

Ken, so many of the South African trees that might sound interesting in concept, look a lot alike and typically don't "stand out" as prime ornamentals. At least that was my impression of seeing the few native tree species from the Mediterranean Climate zones of the Western Cape. Having said that, things like Widdringtonia(sp), Cussonias, Cunnonia, Calodendron, Podocarpus species, etc are all sought after here in northern California, even if I have never seen a blooming Calodendron here in the SF Bay Area. I've got several reference books on South African trees, and maybe they look better in person, or just crappy photos, but most just don't appeal on an aesthetic basis. Always exceptions to the generalization, such as Bolusanthus and Erythrinas, but those that don't have showy flowers or distinctive foliage/bark are often just "background screen trees" or native wildlife habitat value.

[tropicbreeze]

Zig, i thought they rename sericocarpa to mcrocarpa? And where can i get ferdinandiana from?

Ari, I have to admit I haven't kept up with any name changes in Terminalia. There should be fruit/seed of ferdinandiana (Billy Goat Plum) all over the place now. It's an early wet season flowerer with some fruit still around late in the wet. But the seeds do tend to be hard to germinate, unlike the Indian Almond (T. catappa) which grows like a weed on my place. The T. microcarpa comes up all over the place, probably from birds. So it must be easy for germinating. I'll see if I can pick up a stack of ferdinandiana seed for you. (By the way, not sure which sprouted seed you meant on the NAC site.)

[chris78]

The only Terminalia sps I have gotten to grow in Arizona is Terminalia arjuna but I have only tried Terminalia arjuna and Terminalia catappa (tropical almond)...

Terminalia catappa (tropical almond) proved to be to tropical in its requirements.

Terminalia arjuna on the other hand is quite cold hardy, mine has taken 18F and was damage by 1/3 and they recovered quickly. Its fast growing and drought tolerent and is everygreen unless it get too cold and it will drop most or all it leaves. They tolerate full sun and part shade. I got 3 trees the largest is about 30 feet. I was interested in growing it because it develops a buttress trunk wanted that rainforest look

Also this last year I notice my largest one had seeds

Thanks Chris. Does it pretty much sit during the winter and race along in the heat of summer?

Yes it does not grow in the winter at all and grows like a weed in the summer heat.... It can grow 3 to 4 feet plus in a season. responds well to water and feeding. Its loves the heat, not sure how fast growing it would be in the coolish climate of S California...

[ariscott]

Zig, i thought they rename sericocarpa to mcrocarpa? And where can i get ferdinandiana from?

Ari, I have to admit I haven't kept up with any name changes in Terminalia. There should be fruit/seed of ferdinandiana (Billy Goat Plum) all over the place now. It's an early wet season flowerer with some fruit still around late in the wet. But the seeds do tend to be hard to germinate, unlike the Indian Almond (T. catappa) which grows like a weed on my place. The T. microcarpa comes up all over the place, probably from birds. So it must be easy for germinating. I'll see if I can pick up a stack of ferdinandiana seed for you. (By the way, not sure which sprouted seed you meant on the NAC site.)

Thanks Zig.... the seeds were Cycas you know what.... They are tough!!!

Regards, Ari

[tropicbreeze]

Thanks Zig.... the seeds were Cycas you know what.... They are tough!!!

Regards, Ari

I remember those now. I was going to give you some of my single leaf seedlings but yours should be okay. Checked the ferdinandiana, the fruits are still a bit immature. Might be this funny season is delaying them.