Sick Dioon edule

[Kailua_Krish]

Hi guys,

This has shown up on two of my Dioon edules, one I thought it was just because of the shade but this one is in full sun. Is this a problem? The both have sent up new healthy flushes of leaves.

View of the entire plant

View of the damaged area

Thanks for the help guys!

-Krishna

[tropicalb]

Looks to me as if those sections of leaves got mangled somehow when they originally flushed.

The great thing about cycads is:

No matter how bad they look at any given time, after one new flush, you can cut off the unsightly old leaves and the plant will look GREAT again!

[Kailua_Krish]

They actually looked completely perfect until this month on this plant. It seems to be something that starts on the oldest leaves as observed on the other plant which I cut all the leaves off. Im wondering if its because we have had a very wet June here (it has rained almost every day) as thats when this showed up but I knoticed this damage pattern on my other edule in early April and on the other plant it had spread to all but 2 leaves.

Krishna

[Kailua_Krish]

One more thing is that the leaves show damage in a spreading sort of way, like if an area is in close proximity with the damaged leaf it is more likely to show the damage. Should I cut all the old leaves off in case this is a disease?

[Kailua_Krish]

Today I found my Dioon spinulosum with these same marks and it was perfectly fine 3-4 days ago. One thing I noticed this time is that there were a bunch of small brown inscets, some with wings and some without that looked somewhat like small ants, right on the damaged part, looking as if they were eating it. I sprayed with some insecticidal soap. Does anyone know of something that attacks only Dioon cycads as my Cycas are ok?

[cycadjungle]

I can't tell you exactly what that is, but it is some sort of weird fungus that I would not normally see. I do know a local landscape person who is dealing with a fusarium on a Dioon edule after it was planted in a spot where another plant from another plant group died. You can see from the pattern and the spotting, that it isn't mechanical damage. I would hit the whole area with some general use fungicides or maybe something like ZeroTol to sterilize the material. If you have a lot of cycads and you continue to have a problem, I'd bring some leaves to the extension people so they can send them to Gainesville to see exactly what it is.

[Kailua_Krish]

Would daconyl work? Thanks so much for your help!

[cycadjungle]

Daconil is my favorite general purpose fungicide, so that is what I would use first. So, you are just north of me a bit more than an hour. What other kinds of cycads are you trying up there?

[Kailua_Krish]

I dont have many... yet, but what I do have currently is Dioon edule, Dioon spinulosum, the native zamia (whatever its current species name is), the cardboard zamia, and King sago. I have some hybrid king sago x multipinnate sago but the seeds havent germinated yet after about a month although they still look healthy. My next planned aquisitions are E. ferox, Macrozamia johnsonii, M. communus, and a couple of others through chumley cycads. I have some very good microclimates (a couple areas it doesnt even go below freezing) so I wanted to try some interesting ones although it is much too wet here for most of the Encephalartos from what Ive heard. Any suggestions? My yards coldest is 22 degrees I think in the very coldest party (absolute coldest, in most of my yard Robellinis dont get burned). Thanks!

Krishna

[cycadjungle]

You may have explained a lot in your message. If you got those from the same place, you have just learned your first lesson on the hidden costs of cheap plants. You are the 5th person in 6 months that I have seen, that has complained about an unknown pathogen or an insect infestation that needed help to remedy the situation. I know cheap plants are hard to pass up, but there is someting to buying plants from nurseries that are certified and registered and get inspected on a regular basis, even if they cost a bit more.

If all you get is 22F, that means you can grow just about every cycad there is outside, except for the central and Sotuh American zamias, and if your furfuracea will live in your area, then many of those can be tried too. There are so many species you can try that they are too many to list. As a start, with a little tree cover, you can grow any of the dioons, macrozamias, encephalartos, etc. You should come down some time. I have almost 200 species and 30,000 cycads to go through.

[Kailua_Krish]

I got them all at really different places. I got my first D. edule almost 4 years ago from our master gardeners spring plant sale. My second D. edule I bought early last year online and never had any problems. The D. spinulosum I bought this year from HD. The Zamias I germinated and the Cycas I got from HD. The only new plant I can think of is the D. spinulosum and that was the last one to show the problem. On the other hand our neighbors just put in lots of landscpaing across the street. My main limitation on getting more cycads now is money, we just had extensive repairs from termite damage on my house so cash is a bit short.

Krishna

[cycadjungle]

My mistake on what your post appeared to say, but I have fielded so many questions recently along the same lines. You do need to keep up on that fungus though. If money is the problem and you have more time than money, you should think about getting seeds from The Cycad Society seed bank. Nick offers about 40 species each year, on average and it is a great way to get a good sized collection without going broke. My offer still stands to come down sometime, even if you aren't coming to spend a bunch of money. I have more large cycads than any public botanical garden in the US to look at, so I think you would enjoy the outting. Tom

[Kris]

Dear Tom

i live in south india,its a piety that we don't have cycas jungles as you have...i meant your farm.since touring the one you have,would certainly be a feast to ones eyes...And certainly one would have variety in pricing & sizes they want..

I request you to participate in our cycas related discussion often,it will certainly help novice like me to learn few tricks from you all...

thanks & love,

Kris

[Kailua_Krish]

Thanks for the offer. I would love to come down sometime. I have almost all the time in the world as Im a college student currently so while Im busy all the time with school and stuff the plants can grow without my help. By the time Im 40 or 50 I should have large specimens of palms and cycads!

Krishna

P.S. A quick question, do you have any suggestions for getting the hybrid cycas seeds to germinate that I mentioned? I have used the baggie method with them but after a month, nothing. At least no fungus though. Do they just need more time?

Edited July 7, 2008 by krishnaraoji88

[cycadjungle]

Thanks for the offer. I would love to come down sometime. I have almost all the time in the world as Im a college student currently so while Im busy all the time with school and stuff the plants can grow without my help. By the time Im 40 or 50 I should have large specimens of palms and cycads!

You have plenty of time if you are in your early 20s. For that matter, if you buy 20 seeds of every species that easily produces seeds here in Florida, you should be able to retire from hard work by the time you are getting close to 40 and just sell seeds to others. The big problem I see as a nursery owner is that you grow your cycads for 10 or more years and then you have to sell them to someone. As a friend just told me a couple of days ago, which really hit home, if you sell the seeds that come from your large plants, you can make a living and you don't have to sell any of your big, favorite plants that you have taken so much time to cultivate. Its pretty good for business too. As an example, I just bought a female ceratozamia for $300 a few months ago and just set $1100 worth of seeds on that plant. Now that is a decent return on investment and it will, on average, produce that many seeds every other year for the rest of my life. ( and 10 generations to come for that matter) Anyway, I always want to encourage young people to propagate cycads, there has to be new people all the time willing to do this when the old guys kick off, and hopefully, before I go, I will have encouraged several people to do this over my lifetime.

Krishna

P.S. A quick question, do you have any suggestions for getting the hybrid cycas seeds to germinate that I mentioned? I have used the baggie method with them but after a month, nothing. At least no fungus though. Do they just need more time?

Most revoluta seeds don't even start sprouting till July around here, so I wouldn't even have planted it until about now. In fact, I have about 200 of the revoluta x debaoensis seeds (is that what you have?)that I am just now cleaning and sowing this month. BTW, did you get your seeds from someone in Louisiana? If it was the same cross, that was my pollen that made those seeds. The crosses will have a lower viability than regular revoluta seeds, so hopefully you got enough to get a decent batch of plants. The crosses will vary in looks, so the more you get, the better the chance of getting something that looks like what you want it to look like.

Oh, and Kris, as long as the people on this forum want me to be here, I will try to stick around more. I have my own cycad forum where all I do is answer cycad questions, but I do check a few of the other ones, like this one for people who have questions, but I stay pretty busy, where I don't take a lot of time just talking back and forth with people. There was a time where everyone's questions were being answered by others, so if these people come back and get active, I will go back to occational lurking. I am though, a life member of the IPS so I will hopefully be around for a long time to come. Kris, also, if you are interested, and I can load pictures directly from my computer, I will try and send over a few pictures of certain areas of my jungle just to show you the mass of plants.

I'm not sure how some of this got put in the quote section and the other got here below, but please take note where I just answered your questions in the quote area. Tom

[freakypalmguy]

Tom,

I read all of your posts and website with great interest. You have been a valuable source of info for me. I too have some of your rev X debao seeds and my first one has just split open and looks to be about ready to germinate. I look forward to seeing how this cross turns out.

Thank you for being so generous with your knowledge.

Matt

[Kailua_Krish]

I did obtain the seeds from Louisiana but the seller said they were Cycas bifida X revoluta, not that I really care, I would be happy with any hybrids as I think most of the Cycas sp. are very beautiful. DO you suggest keeping them in the baggies or should I place them in pots outdoors? Also where is the cycad forum you mentioned, I would like to visit it. As far as the growing lots of cycads for a retirement business I have considered that. I am planning on doing this with hybrid palms but cycads would be a nice addition. Thanks again!

[Kailua_Krish]

I found the forum and your article on germination, both are great and answered a lot of questions!

Krishna