Copernicia hospita or Bismarckia nobilis 'Silver' ?

[meridannight]

Looking to add a silver palm to my collection. It's either going to be a Copernicia hospita or Bismarckia nobilis 'Silver. I've had my eye on the Bismarckia for a long time, but now I discovered the Copernicia and I find the latter's form truly elegant and beautiful, so I'm inclining toward the Copernicia for now. Bismarckia looks more raw and robust to me, not that that is a bad thing.

Thought I'd ask what growers' experience with these two is over here. Pros and cons? Copernicia is probably slow as can be, I take it? 

I'll be growing these up from seed, so that's also a consideration. My growth environment is good for full tropical palms (lowest temps 23-25C/74-77F, mostly around 30-35C/86-95F during the summer, RH 50-90%, lower values during the winter).

 

[Fishinsteeg234]

Grow them both. You won’t regret it. 

[meridannight]

Just now, Fishinsteeg234 said:

Grow them both. You won’t regret it. 

Great answer!

[sonoranfans]

1 hour ago, meridannight said:

Looking to add a silver palm to my collection. It's either going to be a Copernicia hospita or Bismarckia nobilis 'Silver. I've had my eye on the Bismarckia for a long time, but now I discovered the Copernicia and I find the latter's form truly elegant and beautiful, so I'm inclining toward the Copernicia for now. Bismarckia looks more raw and robust to me, not that that is a bad thing.

Thought I'd ask what growers' experience with these two is over here. Pros and cons? Copernicia is probably slow as can be, I take it? 

I'll be growing these up from seed, so that's also a consideration. My growth environment is good for full tropical palms (lowest temps 23-25C/74-77F, mostly around 30-35C/86-95F during the summer, RH 50-90%, lower values during the winter).

 

 The bismarckia is a notably larger palm (2x the crown size in width), and will tolerate poor soils much better than a cuban copernicia like hospita..  A silver/blue hospita will be much harder to find even here in florida.  I planted out 3 small hospitas recently and have a 30'+ bismarckia.  The hospitas are sensitive to nutrient deficiencies as all cuban copernicias are so consider that will never change. but drought resistance improves as roots grow in.  I would get both and plan to baby the hospita till it gets some good roots.  The bismarckia should be easy with your warm weather, just add water when needed and occasional handful of fertilizer.  The hospitas are worth the effort/care but they should be kept moist in addition to being well fertilized when small or juvenile.  I have always found small cuban copernicias to be finicky.  They want lots of sun but need to be kept moist and well fertilized.  I put mine int he ground at 10-15 gallon size.  Here is one of my hospitas planted out a few months ago  I find hospitas to be more powder blue than the silver/grey/white of bismarckia.

[sonoranfans]

I put that one in the ground at an angle unintentionally.  These things have very sensitive roots, I dared not try to readjust the palm as it risks root damage.  With these copernicias root damage can cause a setback where it just doesn't grow for a year.  I decided to just let it straighten itself out by growing.  I place these carefully and generally plant in the container with bottom removed then I slit and slide out the pot after packing the soil in around it to minimize root disturbance.  If you do want a blue/silver hospita, you may have to plant out a dozen or more seeds to get one as many are green.  WHen they are strap leaf stage look for blue hues in the green.  Nyt hospitas all came with blue hues as strap leafers but the real blue came on as they got older and larger.  None were close to the blue above as strap leafers or even early palmate leafers.

[SeanK]

What are your January minimums? I don't think either is well suited to Milan. Perhaps B.armata better?

[aztropic]

Under my desert growing conditions,the speed of growth from seed is immensely different between the two species. Both this Bismarck and Copernicia are approximately 11 years old from seed, each. Have to ask yourself - do you want a tree in the garden or just a tree in a pot ready to plant out in the garden after 11 years?

 

aztropic 

Mesa, Arizona 

[meridannight]

1 hour ago, sonoranfans said:

 The bismarckia is a notably larger palm (2x the crown size in width), and will tolerate poor soils much better than a cuban copernicia like hospita..  A silver/blue hospita will be much harder to find even here in florida.  I planted out 3 small hospitas recently and have a 30'+ bismarckia.  The hospitas are sensitive to nutrient deficiencies as all cuban copernicias are so consider that will never change. but drought resistance improves as roots grow in.  I would get both and plan to baby the hospita till it gets some good roots.  The bismarckia should be easy with your warm weather, just add water when needed and occasional handful of fertilizer.  The hospitas are worth the effort/care but they should be kept moist in addition to being well fertilized when small or juvenile.  I have always found small cuban copernicias to be finicky.  They want lots of sun but need to be kept moist and well fertilized.  I put mine int he ground at 10-15 gallon size.  Here is one of my hospitas planted out a few months ago  I find hospitas to be more powder blue than the silver/grey/white of bismarckia.

 

It looks like the consensus is that I gotta get both! I agree, I think the hospita will be worth the effort, even if it takes a lot more attention and energy. I'm not looking for 'easy' palms anyway. I only have experience with Copernicia berteroana so far, in that genus, and I find those very slow growing. 

Thanks for the tips on the blueness of the hospita seedlings. I'll keep that in mind. 



 

[meridannight]

1 hour ago, SeanK said:

What are your January minimums? I don't think either is well suited to Milan. Perhaps B.armata better?

I will be growing these in a much warmer climate than Milan. January has the minimums of the ranges I quoted above (23-25C, 74-77F; 50-60% RH). In the same environment I am successfully growing Verschaffeltia splendida and Licuala mattanensis 'Mapu', for example. The Copernicia/Bismarckia will be in containers for the first years from seed.
 

[meridannight]

1 hour ago, aztropic said:

Under my desert growing conditions,the speed of growth from seed is immensely different between the two species. Both this Bismarck and Copernicia are approximately 11 years old from seed, each. Have to ask yourself - do you want a tree in the garden or just a tree in a pot ready to plant out in the garden after 11 years?

 

aztropic 

Mesa, Arizona 

Yeah, the difference in their growth rate is considerable, your images really make that clear.

To answer your question -- I am not in a rush. I am not picking species according to how easy they are to grow, or how fast they will turn into adult trees. I care about growing plants I love and find attractive. If it takes 20-30 years, it will take 20-30 years and by the time they're large it will be that much special. Palms are also attractive in their juvenile forms, and I don't mind having a container garden to take care of. 

 

[sonoranfans]

12 hours ago, meridannight said:

It looks like the consensus is that I gotta get both! I agree, I think the hospita will be worth the effort, even if it takes a lot more attention and energy. I'm not looking for 'easy' palms anyway. I only have experience with Copernicia berteroana so far, in that genus, and I find those very slow growing. 

Thanks for the tips on the blueness of the hospita seedlings. I'll keep that in mind. 



 

Hospita seedlings showing some blue but plenty of light green too.  Today these are powder blue.

[sonoranfans]

16 hours ago, SeanK said:

What are your January minimums? I don't think either is well suited to Milan. Perhaps B.armata better?

Good point here. the hospita can take -3C and the bismarckia can take -4C.  The brahea armata can TAKE -10-11 C.  Armatas ar similar to hospitas in that they show that powder blue color and are easier to find.

Here are some armatas that I grew in my past place.  These palms hate the florida constant humidity and dew.

[meridannight]

Update: I took the advice and ordered seeds for both. And both have already germinated as well. Didn't even take a month. 

Now to see how fast they grow up. The Cuban is probably slower...

[Fusca]

10 minutes ago, meridannight said:

Update: I took the advice and ordered seeds for both. And both have already germinated as well. Didn't even take a month. 

Now to see how fast they grow up. The Cuban is probably slower...

Copericia hospita seeds are eager germinators.  Here's a batch from earlier this year that I put in warm water to soak for 2 days and they started that quickly!  ☺️  They're growing well but Bismarckias do grow faster even as seedlings.