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Washingtonia hybrid after ~15f


SailorBold

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Just took a quick detour on my way home to see how the Washingtonias fared the winter.. There were a few storms where the temps dropped below 20f..  

Here are a few pics.. these saw around 15f... they might green up.. but dont look to be totally defoliated.  Saw another trachy too so snapped a pic of that one..

20230315_132632.jpg

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20230315_133945.jpg

20230315_133942.jpg

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No palm killing events this winter.  How are your jubuea cross palms leaf hardiness compared to you filifera 's? 

About a half zone higher than a zonal winter! 

Here's mine after that February 14/16f event.  Pic taken 2/19/23 (the small leaners are mostly drought damaged-roots).  

 

IMG_20230219_175956_HDR.jpg

Screenshot_20230315-172954.png

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2 hours ago, jwitt said:

No palm killing events this winter.  How are your jubuea cross palms leaf hardiness compared to you filifera 's? 

About a half zone higher than a zonal winter! 

Here's mine after that February 14/16f event.  Pic taken 2/19/23 (the small leaners are mostly drought damaged-roots).  

 

IMG_20230219_175956_HDR.jpg

Screenshot_20230315-172954.png

The south is not perfect, but there will be that one area palms will love to grow and thrive in

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On 3/15/2023 at 7:00 PM, ChicagoPalma said:

The south is not perfect, but there will be that one area palms will love to grow and thrive in

Today 

4000' difference

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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IMG_20230317_092403_HDR.jpg

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On 3/15/2023 at 4:04 PM, SailorBold said:

Just took a quick detour on my way home to see how the Washingtonias fared the winter.. There were a few storms where the temps dropped below 20f..  

Here are a few pics.. these saw around 15f... they might green up.. but dont look to be totally defoliated.  Saw another trachy too so snapped a pic of that one..

20230315_132632.jpg

20230315_134026.jpg

20230315_134013.jpg

20230315_134000.jpg

20230315_133945.jpg

20230315_133942.jpg

Thanks for the update on those beautiful palms, they look good, should make a speedy recovery this season.

On 3/15/2023 at 7:45 PM, jwitt said:

No palm killing events this winter.  How are your jubuea cross palms leaf hardiness compared to you filifera 's? 

About a half zone higher than a zonal winter! 

Here's mine after that February 14/16f event.  Pic taken 2/19/23 (the small leaners are mostly drought damaged-roots).  

 

IMG_20230219_175956_HDR.jpg

Screenshot_20230315-172954.png

Your palms look great and that sunset is perfect, thanks for sharing!

Did you guys see my Albuquerque area palm locations map? I posted it a week or so ago. I made a map of all the palm locations I know of in the Albuquerque area with Google Maps street view links to them. Let me know of any other palms around town to add to the map, there are definitely lots more around. Thanks and keep up the great work!

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=13GDxHuOpdXaDEDEGTOq_IEuvQ6HbUA8&ll=34.94215462524108%2C-106.63629619999999&z=10

 

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  • 2 months later...
On 3/15/2023 at 2:04 PM, SailorBold said:

Just took a quick detour on my way home to see how the Washingtonias fared the winter.. There were a few storms where the temps dropped below 20f..  

Here are a few pics.. these saw around 15f... they might green up.. but dont look to be totally defoliated.  Saw another trachy too so snapped a pic of that one..

20230315_132632.jpg

20230315_134026.jpg

20230315_134013.jpg

20230315_134000.jpg

20230315_133945.jpg

20230315_133942.jpg

I thought these were pure filiferas?

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5 hours ago, Ltapia said:

I thought these were pure filiferas?

These are most likely Robusta x Filifera hybrids.. (most of the time hybrids show dominant features from the 'mother'..ive found this to be true with washingtonias) the leaves are several degrees hardier than robusta to freeze damage...and the trunks are alot thicker.. but not as thick as pure filifera.. 

Some of the problem with leaf bronzing here is desication from wind.. my filiferas were slightly damaged from the winter.. but showed more damage after wind.. most of that damage recovered but there is a lull in soil temps going into spring where there may not be as much water movement in the trunks to replenish the moisture loss..

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On 3/17/2023 at 9:06 PM, Alex High said:

Thanks for the update on those beautiful palms, they look good, should make a speedy recovery this season.

Your palms look great and that sunset is perfect, thanks for sharing!

Did you guys see my Albuquerque area palm locations map? I posted it a week or so ago. I made a map of all the palm locations I know of in the Albuquerque area with Google Maps street view links to them. Let me know of any other palms around town to add to the map, there are definitely lots more around. Thanks and keep up the great work!

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=13GDxHuOpdXaDEDEGTOq_IEuvQ6HbUA8&ll=34.94215462524108%2C-106.63629619999999&z=10

 

Really dig what you did here.. I dont know where to Start to add.. there's alot more.. I can't remember half of the streets I was on!

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On 3/15/2023 at 5:45 PM, jwitt said:

No palm killing events this winter.  How are your jubuea cross palms leaf hardiness compared to you filifera 's? 

About a half zone higher than a zonal winter! 

Here's mine after that February 14/16f event.  Pic taken 2/19/23 (the small leaners are mostly drought damaged-roots).  

 

IMG_20230219_175956_HDR.jpg

Screenshot_20230315-172954.png

Way more leaf hardy.. id guess 3-4 degrees to show damage over filifera.. the jxb f3 spear is where I'd see it first..  bxjxb is hardier too.. by 1-2f..  with a hardy spear.. roughly same in older leaves..  

Please don't take offense if I don't respond right away..!

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3 hours ago, SailorBold said:

Way more leaf hardy.. id guess 3-4 degrees to show damage over filifera.. the jxb f3 spear is where I'd see it first..  bxjxb is hardier too.. by 1-2f..  with a hardy spear.. roughly same in older leaves..  

Please don't take offense if I don't respond right away..!

That is so cool! 

No offense at all.  Heck, it's a short hop to satisfy the "disease"! 

Was your seed viable?

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On 3/15/2023 at 3:04 PM, SailorBold said:

20230315_134026.jpg

I'm guessing lawn sprinklers aren't a thing in a yard full of rocks. Do palms in areas like this get watered in until establishment? Do they require supplemental watering at this size?

I did an experiment last year with 10 various 1-5gal palms, straight into the ground on a property that I wasn't living on. No water but the rain, not even at the time of planting! 4 of them from the most open, full sun area made it Aug-May (when I retrieved them) while the ones with some shade... got flattened by a construction crew.  Plants that don't need to be pampered when in-ground hold so much more interest for me than the rest.

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4 hours ago, SailorBold said:

These are most likely Robusta x Filifera hybrids.. (most of the time hybrids show dominant features from the 'mother'..ive found this to be true with washingtonias) the leaves are several degrees hardier than robusta to freeze damage...and the trunks are alot thicker.. but not as thick as pure filifera.. 

Some of the problem with leaf bronzing here is desication from wind.. my filiferas were slightly damaged from the winter.. but showed more damage after wind.. most of that damage recovered but there is a lull in soil temps going into spring where there may not be as much water movement in the trunks to replenish the moisture loss..

Thanks for the information …

Do you know a reliable source for some pure filfiera seeds ?

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 5/26/2023 at 3:08 AM, SailorBold said:

Really dig what you did here.. I dont know where to Start to add.. there's alot more.. I can't remember half of the streets I was on!

Thank you very much! Do you know where any of these ones are? I couldn't find the ones you said were off Griegos. I'd love to know of any others, thanks!

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/uploads/monthly_2023_03/image.png.d5ed8d408a39f4ad676657fad48b9ef7.png

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/uploads/monthly_2023_03/image.png.be94c40f3c995579deb6b1fdc0d13f22.png

image.thumb.png.f6a50eb35d6bb726cbf052bc79c21da5.png

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On 5/26/2023 at 8:03 AM, Ltapia said:

Thanks for the information …

Do you know a reliable source for some pure filfiera seeds ?

I was just wondering, do you have the locations of any of these palms? I'd love to add them to my Albuquerque palms map, thanks!

 

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1 hour ago, Alex High said:

I was just wondering, do you have the locations of any of these palms? I'd love to add them to my Albuquerque palms map, thanks!

 

This one is in corrales I forgot the road I’ve seen the same palm here in palm talk with an address this Palm is 20 years old the owner said . I’ll try to get the address .

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10 hours ago, Ltapia said:

This one is in corrales I forgot the road I’ve seen the same palm here in palm talk with an address this Palm is 20 years old the owner said . I’ll try to get the address .

Looking at my Albuquerque palms map I do have that palm! Sorry about that! If you know of the locations of any of the other palms I would love to know, thanks!

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=13GDxHuOpdXaDEDEGTOq_IEuvQ6HbUA8&ll=35.20574613944716%2C-106.64531504401133&z=11

Here it is:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2376652,-106.6356049,3a,15y,191.11h,92.36t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s6Q1ebCvHd5X8rPTyI-hfEA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

image.thumb.png.bc8f7ddc15f80bdf7161a4544258cad4.png

 

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13 hours ago, Alex High said:

Looking at my Albuquerque palms map I do have that palm! Sorry about that! If you know of the locations of any of the other palms I would love to know, thanks!

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=13GDxHuOpdXaDEDEGTOq_IEuvQ6HbUA8&ll=35.20574613944716%2C-106.64531504401133&z=11

Here it is:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2376652,-106.6356049,3a,15y,191.11h,92.36t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s6Q1ebCvHd5X8rPTyI-hfEA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

image.thumb.png.bc8f7ddc15f80bdf7161a4544258cad4.png

 

Ok I’ll send some addresses when I see some that are not on your list .0

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2 hours ago, Ltapia said:

Ok I’ll send some addresses when I see some that are not on your list .0

Thanks 🙂

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On 6/5/2023 at 7:27 PM, Alex High said:

I was just wondering, do you have the locations of any of these palms? I'd love to add them to my Albuquerque palms map, thanks!

 

I'll try.. I honestly don't pay attention as most of these I found were on the way to service jobs in those neighborhoods...

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On 5/26/2023 at 4:45 AM, jwitt said:

That is so cool! 

No offense at all.  Heck, it's a short hop to satisfy the "disease"! 

Was your seed viable?

Yes.. the seeds are viable..  !

What seeds did you plant down at the pit? Filifera?

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18 minutes ago, SailorBold said:

Yes.. the seeds are viable..  !

What seeds did you plant down at the pit? Filifera?

Seeds from the one's by Chalmers.  

Do you have too many? Or is it blooming again?  That is cool!

And amazing!

If you need a test ground....

Edited by jwitt
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4 minutes ago, jwitt said:

Seeds from the one's by Chalmers.  

Do you have too many? Or is it blooming again?  That is cool!

And amazing!

I have plenty.. im sending some more off to another PalmTalker who for sure tested them and has several growing already.. no blooms this year.. im not sure if it can bloom yearly?? 

It's a great tree for here.. as long as one is ok with complete defoliation once every 8-10 years..   not sure how it would do in a super freeze..  but.. so far so good. It just keeps getting bigger..!

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Any specific information on sprouting those seeds?

Sure would like to try a couple.

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1 hour ago, SailorBold said:

I'll try.. I honestly don't pay attention as most of these I found were on the way to service jobs in those neighborhoods...

Thanks, and no worries! I am just fascinated by Albuquerque's climate/microclimates and the palms that grow there. Such a beautiful and interesting area!

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On 5/26/2023 at 5:37 AM, 5am said:

I'm guessing lawn sprinklers aren't a thing in a yard full of rocks. Do palms in areas like this get watered in until establishment? Do they require supplemental watering at this size?

I did an experiment last year with 10 various 1-5gal palms, straight into the ground on a property that I wasn't living on. No water but the rain, not even at the time of planting! 4 of them from the most open, full sun area made it Aug-May (when I retrieved them) while the ones with some shade... got flattened by a construction crew.  Plants that don't need to be pampered when in-ground hold so much more interest for me than the rest.

There is virtually no rain here all year.. aside from the monsoonal months where those 3 months average over 1-1.5 " of rain each respectively..  it might cause someone to shut off their irrigation for a day or 2.

I don't think most palms here are watered enough.. tbh..let alone fertilized..

 

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14 hours ago, jwitt said:

Any specific information on sprouting those seeds?

Sure would like to try a couple.

No idea.. prolly soak for a week and put them in the ground..?

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13 hours ago, Alex High said:

Thanks, and no worries! I am just fascinated by Albuquerque's climate/microclimates and the palms that grow there. Such a beautiful and interesting area!

It's a gem.. while it may not check all the boxes for some.. its got a bit of everything for natural beauty..  has a huge mountain to the east..which influences weather.. fissure volcanoes and lava flows on the west.. which make an interesting view for those neighborhoods. sand dunes... red colored bluffs.. North finger of the chihuahuan desert.. meets juniper forests..  Cottonwood trees with cooler temps and a river runs through it..   I live on the westside and we can see everything from here.. overlooking abq.. you can see where it's raining.. who has fog atm.. and most of the time- sunshine..  its beautiful. Living on the westside is drier and warmer.. so different here too...  I like it here.. and seeing this area in person really touches the curiosity of ones soul..  we try to describe it but can't fully do so!  Has most everything all at the same time.

Edited by SailorBold
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3 hours ago, SailorBold said:

It's a gem.. while it may not check all the boxes for some.. its got a bit of everything for natural beauty..  has a huge mountain to the east..which influences weather.. fissure volcanoes and lava flows on the west.. which make an interesting view for those neighborhoods. sand dunes... red colored bluffs.. North finger of the chihuahuan desert.. meets juniper forests..  Cottonwood trees with cooler temps and a river runs through it..   I live on the westside and we can see everything from here.. overlooking abq.. you can see where it's raining.. who has fog atm.. and most of the time- sunshine..  its beautiful. Living on the westside is drier and warmer.. so different here too...  I like it here.. and seeing this area in person really touches the curiosity of ones soul..  we try to describe it but can't fully do so!  Has most everything all at the same time.

Summer has started in front of the "influencer" under the controller.

YEP!

20230608140827.jpg

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On 6/6/2023 at 10:21 PM, Ltapia said:

Ok I’ll send some addresses when I see some that are not on your list .0

I've located two of the other ones posted in that thread, YouTuber El Beanster just posted a great Albuquerque palm vlog on YouTube showing these ones. There seem to be quite a few palms in the Seven Bar area.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2135699,-106.6706986,3a,26.1y,114.69h,80.29t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1svgAMQEvNw7o2-BVpmg4GHw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

image.thumb.png.46d290cc02ffe6e1c1fba6e8fe8e3c86.png

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2157239,-106.6742816,3a,38.1y,258.8h,87.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scfWT0ztFPDqX9Iiy4nBdDg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

image.thumb.png.5be5bb181fb933b12a03d260ccf5c317.png

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.215906,-106.6742785,3a,15y,109.53h,83.05t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXtTKkBmxy8s_o53AtPw7jw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

image.thumb.png.8a01b1443219765d24f4ec01b95925db.png

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On 6/8/2023 at 2:09 PM, jwitt said:

Summer has started in front of the "influencer" under the controller.

YEP!

20230608140827.jpg

Beautiful shot.. one of my favorite parts of the mountain.. especially when a thunderstorm sits right on it all day..

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@Alex High

As someone who would walk across the runway at 7bar airport back in the day(1970's), I can attest to the palmzone of this westside neighborhood.  

I measured 116f here in the 1980's,  using a sling psychrometer. I don't remember the wetbulb, but sure it was very low(dry). 

That area of the escarpment west of the river, north of about Montano upto just south of Bernalillo are what I consider the area palmzone.  Much not known about it as it has really only been settled in the last 30 years or so. 

A little known fact is this area did not see single digit highs in 2011(ABQ did). This area and surrounds saw teens. 

This area supports multiple long-term filifera.  Warmer zones located in Albuquerque have a couple(San Mateo filifera being one). 

There is a reason. 

The westside is the area to watch reguarding ABQ palmage in my opinion.

Especially longer term. 

 

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9 hours ago, jwitt said:

@Alex High

As someone who would walk across the runway at 7bar airport back in the day(1970's), I can attest to the palmzone of this westside neighborhood.  

I measured 116f here in the 1980's,  using a sling psychrometer. I don't remember the wetbulb, but sure it was very low(dry). 

That area of the escarpment west of the river, north of about Montano upto just south of Bernalillo are what I consider the area palmzone.  Much not known about it as it has really only been settled in the last 30 years or so. 

A little known fact is this area did not see single digit highs in 2011(ABQ did). This area and surrounds saw teens. 

This area supports multiple long-term filifera.  Warmer zones located in Albuquerque have a couple(San Mateo filifera being one). 

There is a reason. 

The westside is the area to watch reguarding ABQ palmage in my opinion.

Especially longer term. 

 

Very interesting! As just as a casual observer myself but someone who has read and searched a ton about Albuquerque palms, the Westside definitely seems to be the rising palm region of ABQ, and with all the new developments there, there will no doubt be many more in the coming years. Where is the San Mateo filifera? Is it on a street called San Mateo? I may have it on my map but not sure. On the Westside, Washys seem more the palm of choice, while Trachys seem much more widely planted on the Eastside/Northeast Heights. This makes sense given that the Westide is drier and hotter, although of course there are still beautiful Trachys there. The palm map I made illustrates this:

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=13GDxHuOpdXaDEDEGTOq_IEuvQ6HbUA8&ll=35.009502874449936%2C-106.62630314952902&z=10

image.thumb.png.6419e3ed4c91870625bf347a23c6122f.png

image.png.cd2b6773a0657d299f5a2fbb7d335d82.png

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There are no long-term unprotected long-term  Washingtonia outside the westside save the San Mateo filifera. Seed grown on the westside of a building.  Spent early life protected from those palm killing winds. Not a factor on portions of the westside. 

 

The San Mateo filifera actually resides on La Veta. It is on your map.   

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17 hours ago, jwitt said:

There are no long-term unprotected long-term  Washingtonia outside the westside save the San Mateo filifera. Seed grown on the westside of a building.  Spent early life protected from those palm killing winds. Not a factor on portions of the westside. 

 

The San Mateo filifera actually resides on La Veta. It is on your map.   

Ah yes I know that palm, thanks! These three are located on the Eastside and none appear to have been protected. All 3 have been there since before the first streetview of the area in 2007, and all of the recent streetivew images of them were taken midwinter with no protection. I would be curious how many have died since 2007 during the deep freezes on the Eastside, though.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1060022,-106.5444002,3a,47y,74.39h,91.92t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s-54uyVB99HRf-BkN_XuWSQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

October 2007:

image.thumb.png.e84331c4053b5599f78e05663b51c447.png

February 2022:

image.thumb.png.26676ee8883c5452af66c53696fcc77b.png

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.0978289,-106.5797806,3a,29.8y,12.43h,92.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ss7ztgso-pWlIHZ2POTwpWQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

October 2007:

image.thumb.png.6dd4c9c3fe29e4c215bb1f897de51d67.png

January 2022:

image.thumb.png.f411fc003d9bfa5a51a458e76e0b18d5.png

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1386646,-106.6275727,3a,15y,310.95h,88.86t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_g7izkUvxvp_K5_kRJ2gyw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&entry=ttu

November 2007:

image.png.b152a73fda76684ab6e03e144a656352.png

February 2023:

image.thumb.png.dcee3217db3e94cfb54932cae89596c5.png

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6 hours ago, Alex High said:

Ah yes I know that palm, thanks! These three are located on the Eastside and none appear to have been protected. All 3 have been there since before the first streetview of the area in 2007, and all of the recent streetivew images of them were taken midwinter with no protection. I would be curious how many have died since 2007 during the deep freezes on the Eastside, though.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1060022,-106.5444002,3a,47y,74.39h,91.92t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s-54uyVB99HRf-BkN_XuWSQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

October 2007:

image.thumb.png.e84331c4053b5599f78e05663b51c447.png

February 2022:

image.thumb.png.26676ee8883c5452af66c53696fcc77b.png

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.0978289,-106.5797806,3a,29.8y,12.43h,92.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ss7ztgso-pWlIHZ2POTwpWQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

October 2007:

image.thumb.png.6dd4c9c3fe29e4c215bb1f897de51d67.png

January 2022:

image.thumb.png.f411fc003d9bfa5a51a458e76e0b18d5.png

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1386646,-106.6275727,3a,15y,310.95h,88.86t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_g7izkUvxvp_K5_kRJ2gyw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&entry=ttu

November 2007:

image.png.b152a73fda76684ab6e03e144a656352.png

February 2023:

image.thumb.png.dcee3217db3e94cfb54932cae89596c5.png

The last palm, on Edith Blvd, is in what is considered the north valley.  Interstate 25 is a better local way of dividing(climatically) the area between eastside/westside.  Although, now the river is probably more accurate dividing line and more commonly used.  In my mind, I am stuck back fifty years where nothing much existed west of the river.  

The address dividing line for east/west is the railroad tracks which sit directly behind the Edith location.  

Basically, as one ventures east(closer to the Sandia mountains), the east wind becomes a factor, moreso as you get closer.  During the arctic storm, one would notice the strength of wind increase as one headed east.  So during the same storm, the Edith palm may see 0f with(a day of) 25mph east winds, whereas the Princess Jeanne palm is probably seeing (days of)65+mph./0f. .  

Convection(wind) is a great way to heat or cool mass.  So basically, more convection east, more radiationial heading west. 

Here is a view of the Edith palm looking at it from where the wind would blow towards the palm.  A good microclimate, with some protection from lessened east wind at this location. 

Screenshot_20230616-165927.thumb.png.9d70df1c9e621c9e89663743962989c5.png

 

The other 2 are also sheltered from the wind as the mountains(direction of wind) are behind the houses(somewhat).  As they continue to grow, they will be more exposed.  You can kind of see the mountains behind the houses. 

Zone wise and most years, the Eastside is milder concerning extreme annual minimum's.  It is those 5/ 15 year events where the North pole enters over and thru the Sandia mountains.  That is where this region's extreme palm killing comes from.  The east, slightly northeast. 

All that being said, I know of no clear trunk filifera/hybrid dying in 2011(a dozen or so).  Not the case with Trachy, many old timers east of interstate 25 were lost. 

Screenshot_20230616-165511.thumb.png.16e670a19278e2ab07e35e5569fe313f.pngScreenshot_20230616-165612.thumb.png.a1d284c0aa044c10854c5a3683760782.png

Edited by jwitt
Wind clarification
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4 hours ago, jwitt said:

The last palm, on Edith Blvd, is in what is considered the north valley.  Interstate 25 is a better local way of dividing(climatically) the area between eastside/westside.  Although, now the river is probably more accurate dividing line and more commonly used.  In my mind, I am stuck back fifty years where nothing much existed west of the river.  

The address dividing line for east/west is the railroad tracks which sit directly behind the Edith location.  

Basically, as one ventures east(closer to the Sandia mountains), the east wind becomes a factor, moreso as you get closer.  During the arctic storm, one would notice the strength of wind increase as one headed east.  So during the same storm, the Edith palm may see 0f with(a day of) 25mph east winds, whereas the Princess Jeanne palm is probably seeing (days of)65+mph./0f. .  

Convection(wind) is a great way to heat or cool mass.  So basically, more convection east, more radiationial heading west. 

Here is a view of the Edith palm looking at it from where the wind would blow towards the palm.  A good microclimate, with some protection from lessened east wind at this location. 

Screenshot_20230616-165927.thumb.png.9d70df1c9e621c9e89663743962989c5.png

 

The other 2 are also sheltered from the wind as the mountains(direction of wind) are behind the houses(somewhat).  As they continue to grow, they will be more exposed.  You can kind of see the mountains behind the houses. 

Zone wise and most years, the Eastside is milder concerning extreme annual minimum's.  It is those 5/ 15 year events where the North pole enters over and thru the Sandia mountains.  That is where this region's extreme palm killing comes from.  The east, slightly northeast. 

All that being said, I know of no clear trunk filifera/hybrid dying in 2011(a dozen or so).  Not the case with Trachy, many old timers east of interstate 25 were lost. 

Screenshot_20230616-165511.thumb.png.16e670a19278e2ab07e35e5569fe313f.pngScreenshot_20230616-165612.thumb.png.a1d284c0aa044c10854c5a3683760782.png

Got it, thanks for the great info! Very interesting, I find the microclimates and different climate zones of the Albuquerque area fascinating. Was the last one of those 5/15 year events you described 2011?

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Yes 2011.  

We have had smaller versions since, but the cold was not as deep. It's an absolute timing thing with a pacific storm from the west and arctic air on the plains. 

It is what causes blizzard warnings within the city of Albuquerque.

This was last year. The snowhole they talk about is where the high east winds exist.  The "palm zone" I refer to lies just outside of this snowhole and is influenced(protected) by the shape of the foothill range(Rincon) just in front(west) of Sandia peak. 

https://www.krqe.com/weather/video-forecast/snow-possible-in-the-albuquerque-metro-wednesday/

 

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26 minutes ago, jwitt said:

Yes 2011.  

We have had smaller versions since, but the cold was not as deep. It's an absolute timing thing with a pacific storm from the west and arctic air on the plains. 

It is what causes blizzard warnings within the city of Albuquerque.

This was last year. The snowhole they talk about is where the high east winds exist.  The "palm zone" I refer to lies just outside of this snowhole and is influenced(protected) by the shape of the foothill range(Rincon) just in front(west) of Sandia peak. 

https://www.krqe.com/weather/video-forecast/snow-possible-in-the-albuquerque-metro-wednesday/

 

Interesting! Here in the Washington, D.C. area the deep freezes hit us pretty hardy every 10-15 years as there's very little keeping the cold out like mountain ranges, etc. The Appalachians probably moderate it a bit but not much. We do have the Chesapeake Bay just to our east which moderates temps on the Eastern Shore, and we don't get the apocalyptic freezes like Texas and the Great Plains states get. Our last palm-killing deep freeze was in 2014. It wiped out ~2/3 of the Trachys in the area, including many that were long established. The survivors all have a common factor - a south-facing wall which shelters from the brutal winds like you mentioned, and most are within the city's urban heat island:

 

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8100' peak in front of the 10600' peak.  Creates a venturi effect. 

121016.jpeg

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