The trunking Jubaea of Roseburg Oregon

[Cody Salem]

I was digging through my phone and found this pics that I took around thanksgiving last year.  They have probably been in the ground for 15-20yrs.  They took a pretty good hit in the 09-10 winter and lost some big washies next to them.   These photos don't really do justice to just how massive those trucks are.  They must be almost 3 feet in diameter.

 

 

 

[Trustandi]

Wow... Such a beautiful jubaea. Thank you for the pic. 

[Banana Belt]

6 hours ago, Cody Salem said:

I was digging through my phone and found this pics that I took around thanksgiving last year.  They have probably been in the ground for 15-20yrs.  They took a pretty good hit in the 09-10 winter and lost some big washies next to them.   These photos don't really do justice to just how massive those trucks are.  They must be almost 3 feet in diameter.

 

 

 

The trunking Jubaea looks to be about 35 or so years old.  Check this link for graph and example.

 

[Cody Salem]

18 hours ago, Banana Belt said:

The trunking Jubaea looks to be about 35 or so years old.  Check this link for graph and example.

 

That seems about right, they were already pretty big when they were planted.   I wouldn't have thought that the growth rate would be so similar between roseburg and brookings

[Cody Salem]

I found a good shot on google street view.  First one is 2012, the second is 2021.

 

[Chester B]

I’ve heard about these palms.  Thank you for posting these pictures. It’s nice to finally see them. 

[Zach K]

Where exactly in Roseburg?

[Jesse PNW]

On 11/12/2022 at 12:15 PM, Cody Salem said:

 These photos don't really do justice to just how massive those trucks are.  They must be almost 3 feet in diameter.

 

 

In my brief experience, pictures never do a palm justice.  Seeing some random thing on the internet is never the same as standing there in person.  

[Banana Belt]

11 hours ago, Jesse PNW said:

In my brief experience, pictures never do a palm justice.  Seeing some random thing on the internet is never the same as standing there in person.  

Your right.  When looking at mature Jubaea in a picture or from a distance it appears like I could walk up to the palm and put my arms around it or mostly so, but when actually trying to wrap arms around it, my arms won't even go half way around.

[RJ]

The other two are still there correct? Wonder why they’re so much smaller given identical growing conditions ?

[Fusca]

2 hours ago, RJ said:

The other two are still there correct? Wonder why they’re so much smaller given identical growing conditions ?

If I were to guess the two smaller ones look to be competing for water/nutrients from the huge tree (conifer?) to the left which is noticeable in the shot from 2012.  The Jubaea get larger/thicker from left to right moving away from that tree.  Even back in 2012 the one in the middle looks to be larger and thicker than the one closest to the tree so they might have been different sizes when planted or had already been there in competition quite a while.  Don't know what happened to that tree but looks like something new was planted in its place.  I kinda like the stair-step look.

[Cody Salem]

On 11/14/2022 at 12:08 PM, Zach K said:

Where exactly in Roseburg?

A few miles south

2321 Roberts Creek Rd, Roseburg, OR 97470

In another 10 years you should be able to see them from I-5

 

 

 

 

[Cody Salem]

2 hours ago, Fusca said:

If I were to guess the two smaller ones look to be competing for water/nutrients from the huge tree (conifer?) to the left which is noticeable in the shot from 2012.  The Jubaea get larger/thicker from left to right moving away from that tree.  Even back in 2012 the one in the middle looks to be larger and thicker than the one closest to the tree so they might have been different sizes when planted or had already been there in competition quite a while.  Don't know what happened to that tree but looks like something new was planted in its place.  I kinda like the stair-step look.

I would guess they were just a little younger when planted.   There is actually a 4th tree, which is now the 2nd largest.   It took the most winter damage,  I think it is still recovering from the 09-10 winter in the 2012 photo.

 

[Fusca]

1 hour ago, Cody Salem said:

I would guess they were just a little younger when planted.   There is actually a 4th tree, which is now the 2nd largest.   It took the most winter damage,  I think it is still recovering from the 09-10 winter in the 2012 photo.

 

Yes I noticed that one from the 2021 Google Streetview shot.  It's the same one as the second photo in your original post, right?  They're awesome palms!

[Banana Belt]

In the very first picture at top of this page, I do believe a flower stalk can be seen on the left side just below the leaves.  This Palm is likely growing very fast at this age and if things permit it will be over 20 feet tall in 5 years.  This is the explosive growth phase of  a Jubaea.

Following graph shows the growth rates and stages of a Jubaea palm I planted in about 1989.   Flowers begin to bloom when the adult trunk starts vertical.  Jubaea Palms follow an exponential growth rate up to a certain point when the flowers begin to fruit, after that they grow at a slower more linear rate while the trunk tappers to a smaller diameter.  In most cases it is reported that Jubaea will not fruit until they are well over 40 years old, sometimes not until they are 60 years or more.  Regardless the exponential growth rate must end at some point.

[Cody Salem]

On 11/15/2022 at 8:31 PM, Banana Belt said:

In the very first picture at top of this page, I do believe a flower stalk can be seen on the left side just below the leaves.  This Palm is likely growing very fast at this age and if things permit it will be over 20 feet tall in 5 years.  This is the explosive growth phase of  a Jubaea.

Following graph shows the growth rates and stages of a Jubaea palm I planted in about 1989.   Flowers begin to bloom when the adult trunk starts vertical.  Jubaea Palms follow an exponential growth rate up to a certain point when the flowers begin to fruit, after that they grow at a slower more linear rate while the trunk tappers to a smaller diameter.  In most cases it is reported that Jubaea will not fruit until they are well over 40 years old, sometimes not until they are 60 years or more.  Regardless the exponential growth rate must end at some point.

 

 

 

Your right, I never noticed.  Here is a slightly different angle I didn't post before.

 

 

[Banana Belt]

Cody Salem

7 hours ago, Cody Salem said:

 

 

 

Your right, I never noticed.  Here is a slightly different angle I didn't post before.

 

Thanks for the picture.  No doubt about it from that picture.  Two Small flowers with many more hidden, but that's how it begins.  Every year the flowers will get bigger along with the leaf fronds and girth of the trunk.  At about 30 years plus it will accelerate again with the trunk swelling and going vertical even faster.

I have a 41 year old Jubaea with a 4 foot diameter 12 foot vertical trunk and sprawling canopy of leaves above and the flowers are 5 to 6 feet long, and the trunk is still swelling.  No fruit yet, any year now.

 

[Banana Belt]

The trunk of this Jubaea has not yet begun its expansion, which is probably why many of the older leaves are still attached.  It is the expansion or getting fat that a Jubaea turnk breaks the belts of the leaf bases, same thing occurs in a Queen Palm.  The leafs will eventually fall away even if the Jubaea does not get fat.

[Cody Salem]

5 hours ago, Banana Belt said:

The trunk of this Jubaea has not yet begun its expansion, which is probably why many of the older leaves are still attached.  It is the expansion or getting fat that a Jubaea turnk breaks the belts of the leaf bases, same thing occurs in a Queen Palm.  The leafs will eventually fall away even if the Jubaea does not get fat.

LOL, that is actually the same one.  I just did a poor job of cropping the photo when I was trying to enlarge the flower

[Cody Salem]

Update- new photos from Thanksgiving 2022

[Las Palmas Norte]

Those are some very nice Jubaea. Thanks for the update.

[Jesse PNW]

Looks like Jubaea fruit on the ground?

[Cody Salem]

Ya,  that palm had 3 sets of flowers.  The owner was kind enough to give me about a dozen fruits, but I'm not really sure what to do next.

[Cody Salem]

Finally stumbled across my old pics of these palms.

From Jan 2007 ,   Love the coat of frost

 

From Nov 2012

[Cody Salem]

Not a palm, but just found these photos that were taken at the same time.  

And yes, this is in Roseburg too.

April 2007

 

and Nov 2012

 

 

 

 

[Zach K]

Incredible. Does Agave americana 'Variegata' grow successfully in Portland/Seattle?

[Cody Salem]

No, that's why this one seemed so unique.   Roseburg is a little warmer and drier, but still technically the same zone.   I would have to assume it was potted until it was to big to move around, then planted out.  Between the dates the 2 photos were taken, it did see a low of 12 deg in 2009.  That's probably why it looks like all of the tips were frozen off.

[Axel Amsterdam]

The variegata is wonderful, can you share the streetname? I like to check how it (or the pups) developed over the years.

Edited January 11 by Axel Amsterdam

[Banana Belt]

Strange, how a Palm will grow in two different climates.   The above pictures of Roseburg Oregon Jubaea palms and Jubaea grown in Brookings, Or., are very different.   The Roseburg and Brookings Palms are close to same age judging by the 2007 and 2006 pictures respectfully and look similar, but the 2022 pictures are very different.   Main climate difference is as far as I can tell is that Roseburg has hot summers while Brookings has mostly cool summers.  Also the Roseburg Jubaea are producing fruit, whereas the Brookings Jubaea are not.

Roseburg Oregon Jubaea 2007 and 2022

Brookings Oregon Jubaea 2006 and 2022

Edited January 11 by Banana Belt

[Zach K]

6 hours ago, Axel Amsterdam said:

The variegata is wonderful, can you share the streetname? I like to check how it (or the pups) developed over the years.

I second this. If there is an address it would be cool to see the different stages of growth on streetview.

[palmnut-fry]

Jubaea is my fav big chunky! Wow these last thread pics are wonderful! I am so envious. 

We finally lost ( was removed) the big one trucked in from Cali years ago in downtown Dallas Aquarium.

It was sad indeed to see it struggle the last few wet, cold years! But, they love yall's climate, fer sure.

Look at those beauties. I always got a stone in my gut when I read the quote in one of my many palm books that it is to say 

like "It is the grandkids to the planter of Jubaea that is the enjoyer of the ultimate dramatic beauty of these magnificent palms, 

they grow so slow". I wonder if the old codger in the one shot is the planter? LOL, at any rate cheers! 

[ryjohn]

WOW!  This achievement in the rogue river valley is so much harder in the Willamette River river valley (Eugene-Corvallis-Salem-Portland).  I can say in no uncertain terms it is not possible to grow a variegated agave Americana to flowering age in the open there or here in Northeast Louisiana for that matter. I had a nice-size Jubaea going in Corvallis that was killed by single digits not long after I left in the late 2000’s, and I never dreamed Roseburg was so much more favorable given weather reports on the local news.  

Edited January 12 by ryjohn

[Chester B]

I've seen recent pictures of large variegated Agave americana in Salem.  Multiple specimens.

[Las Palmas Norte]

I agreed with the statements make on A. americana variegata hardiness. I grew one for 10 years only to eventually succumb once temperatures dropped below 14°F / -10°C.

[ryjohn]

I’d like to see those pictures because they melt back strongly even in low 20’s.  Dicksonia Antarctica is far hardier.

[Ryland]

I must have missed these posts earlier.  Really pleased to see these thriving Jubaea in Roseburg.  We planted a few on my mother's property in the Rogue Valley about ten years ago and they are still tiny compared to these.

[Cody Salem]

On 1/11/2023 at 1:38 AM, Axel Amsterdam said:

The variegata is wonderful, can you share the streetname? I like to check how it (or the pups) developed over the years.

You can see it on the 2012 image, but there is nothing there anymore.  Still some nice trachys off on the side.  I think the owner is a bit elderly, the lawn care has been slowly slipping over the years.

Link:

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.2192049,-123.3189867,3a,75y,17.09h,74.83t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1ssZ2yFmq5u_f9ywUQEAN_XA!2e0!5s20120701T000000!7i13312!8i6656

Or if it doesn't work:

898 NE Rifle Range st

Roseburg, Oregon

 

[Cody Salem]

On 1/11/2023 at 5:29 AM, Banana Belt said:

Strange, how a Palm will grow in two different climates.   The above pictures of Roseburg Oregon Jubaea palms and Jubaea grown in Brookings, Or., are very different.   The Roseburg and Brookings Palms are close to same age judging by the 2007 and 2006 pictures respectfully and look similar, but the 2022 pictures are very different.   Main climate difference is as far as I can tell is that Roseburg has hot summers while Brookings has mostly cool summers.  Also the Roseburg Jubaea are producing fruit, whereas the Brookings Jubaea are not.

Roseburg Oregon Jubaea 2007 and 2022

Brookings Oregon Jubaea 2006 and 2022

The owner actually had to point out two other Jubaeas I hadn't even noticed.   They were all planted at the same time but these two were still not trunking, and barely 5 feet tall.  They were kinda out in the lawn with poor drainage and a little shade.  

I notice your palms are right next to a ditch too, maybe the good drainage has something to do with quicker growth in our area.

[Cody Salem]

On 1/11/2023 at 8:56 PM, ryjohn said:

WOW!  This achievement in the rogue river valley is so much harder in the Willamette River river valley (Eugene-Corvallis-Salem-Portland).  I can say in no uncertain terms it is not possible to grow a variegated agave Americana to flowering age in the open there or here in Northeast Louisiana for that matter. I had a nice-size Jubaea going in Corvallis that was killed by single digits not long after I left in the late 2000’s, and I never dreamed Roseburg was so much more favorable given weather reports on the local news.  

Were you in Philomath? I think I remember you from the old cloudforest messageboard.  Roseburg is actually in the Umpqua valley, not the rouge valley so they get a lot more winter time marine influence than medford does.  There is also a small mountain range separating them from the willamette valley, so they seem to dodge the worst of the arctic fronts too.  This December they only got down to 30 when rest of the state was in the lower 20's.   Then add the summer heat,  I would vote "best climate in Oregon"   I sure miss it.

I'm kind of a weather nerd too, so I did the math myself.   Since the year 2000 their average annual low is 23 which is a pretty solid 9a

[Banana Belt]

11 hours ago, Cody Salem said:

I notice your palms are right next to a ditch too, maybe the good drainage has something to do with quicker growth in our area.

Yes, the palms have some drainage but considering the feet of torrential rain in last several months even the hills are turning into wetlands.   Joke aside, I believe the main reason is soils and location.  The soils we have on the Harbor Bench just south of Brookings are very deep organic rich loam's averaging between 3 and 4 feet of topsoil.  That was the reason I purchased the property last century because of the Black Rich soil, it grows anything.   The Jubaea shown in Roseburg are not growing in ideal locations, surrounded by asphalt and gravel.  

Also Brookings climate is considerably more sub-tropical than Roseburg.  Rarely are temperatures below 30F even now with sunny skies and clear nights of Jan., as the Marine air moderates and keeps temperatures low during hot summer and warmer in winter during cold arctic drainage.  Additionally the extreme southwest coast off Oregon has a northwest-southeast orientation with southwest facing hills and mountains.  In winter when the sun is low in the sky, the land and hills above the ocean get a double exposure from the reflection of the sun off the ocean.  People get some bad sunburns when outside for several hours even in Dec. Jan, from the reflection just like when being on a boat.  This double exposure heats the air around Brookings during winter giving us a Winter Summer.  But we also have a Summer Winter during June to Sept. from the dense fog. 

Following picture of my Tangerine Tree that is 45 years old with Queen Palm behind taken last summer.  We are now eating Tangerines which will continue fruiting to March.  I also have a couple Persian Limes which produce limes.  Limes are very sensitive to frosts and will die at 28F.