ID please!

[JLM]

I was weedeating this morning and came across these. I have no clue what they are, i dont own anything like this. Ill post some pics in a minute.

[JLM]

[Silas_Sancona]

24 minutes ago, JLM said:

Big thing looks like a Canna..  the native one, Canna flaccida. Green leafy stuff around it i believe is a type of Spurge but can't remember the exact Genus / Sp. off the top of my head.  Is not a Legume- family plant, despite the resemblance.

[JLM]

2 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Big thing looks like a Canna..  the native one, Canna flaccida. Green leafy stuff around it i believe is a type of Spurge but can't remember the exact Genus / Sp. off the top of my head.  Is not a Legume- family plant, despite the resemblance.

I guess if the canna is native then explains how it got there. I will gladly take some yellow flowers!

[amh]

It is most likely a canna, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were a turmeric.

Does the leaf have any odor?

[Manalto]

The weed is Phyllanthus urinaria AKA Chamberbitter (whatever that means). I hate it with a consuming passion. Here's the Wikipedia entry:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyllanthus_urinaria

[Merlyn]

2 minutes ago, Manalto said:

The weed is Phyllanthus urinaria AKA Chamberbitter (whatever that means). I hate it with a consuming passion. Here's the Wikipedia entry:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyllanthus_urinaria

Yes, I thoroughly hate that imported hardy perennial...aka weed.  It seeds rapidly and has a big, dense root system.  So if you pull up one next to a plant you like, it rips up half the dirt in the area and damages the roots of the plant you are trying to save.  It also seriously competes with every other plant for water and nutrients.  The only positive is that it dies fast from Glyphosate and 2,4-D. 

[Manalto]

6 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

Yes, I thoroughly hate that imported hardy perennial...aka weed.  

I thought it was an annual. Oh, good grief. All those seeds. I'm on the warpath.

Edited September 16, 2022 by Manalto

[Silas_Sancona]

13 minutes ago, Manalto said:

I thought it was an annual. Oh, good grief. All those seeds. I'm on the warpath.

Yes, it is a warm season annual..  Not sure which is worse though, it, Artillery plant,   ..or Nutsedge. Had to bite the bullet and bring in the big guns to ( hopefully ) wipe out #3. For the most part, too dry here for the first two.

[Merlyn]

@Manalto around here they are perennials, but get killed off if we have a bad frost.  I just call all of them perennials, though some are worse at certain times of the year than others.  @Silas_Sancona the artillery ferns are the fastest spreaders, but 2,4-D mixed with a bit of Dawn dish detergent kills them D-E-D in a couple of days.  My biggest problem is the small one with the red stems, Thyme-leaved Spurge – Euphorbia serpyllifolia and maculata, maybe.  If one of those goes to seed it has about a 50000% strike rate and 2 weeks later there is a carpet of the stuff in a 10 foot diameter.  I wish I were joking...

I also managed to import two types of Wood Sorrel, a big leaf one about 2" leaves and a tiny one with 0.25" leaves.  Those are a pain too because the seeding is prolific and they are sometimes difficult to pull by hand due to the hidden underground bulb.

[Silas_Sancona]

1 hour ago, Merlyn said:

@Manalto around here they are perennials, but get killed off if we have a bad frost.  I just call all of them perennials, though some are worse at certain times of the year than others.  @Silas_Sancona the artillery ferns are the fastest spreaders, but 2,4-D mixed with a bit of Dawn dish detergent kills them D-E-D in a couple of days.  My biggest problem is the small one with the red stems, Thyme-leaved Spurge – Euphorbia serpyllifolia and maculata, maybe.  If one of those goes to seed it has about a 50000% strike rate and 2 weeks later there is a carpet of the stuff in a 10 foot diameter.  I wish I were joking...

I also managed to import two types of Wood Sorrel, a big leaf one about 2" leaves and a tiny one with 0.25" leaves.  Those are a pain too because the seeding is prolific and they are sometimes difficult to pull by hand due to the hidden underground bulb.

With the exception of O. pes-caprae, i don't mind Oxalis.. Not that they're much of an issue here anyway.. The first one is next to impossible to completely eradicate, though there is some insect that feeds on it they're trying to use as a bio control. 

Spurge? 🤷‍♂️ eh, there's so many types that colonize recently disturbed soil / seeds are easily blown / carried around by animals that you'll never completely get rid of it.. Better to plant things that will eventually out compete it than have to spray dangerous chemicals that the plants can become tolerant to..  I've done ok with pulling it at certain times here, but let it fill in gaps in the lawn there. Bermuda ..or whatever other perennial ground cover-y things crept in eventually ousted it.

 

[Merlyn]

@Silas_Sancona the small flat-growing spurge is no problem, the horrible stuff grows 1-2ft tall and grows rapidly through 2 inches of mulch like isn't even there.  Pulling them just spreads the seeds further, because they go from nothing to 1ft tall and seeding in a couple of days.  I spent a solid two weeks 2 years ago pulling weeds in the entire yard.  After days of hurting my knees, hands and back and courting heatstroke...it looked about the same as when I started.  Most of them had grown back through new seeds, because I disturbed the soil and sprouted more, or because I didn't get 100% of the weed's roots when I pulled them.  I would literally have to spend every day pulling weeds to keep ahead of them.  Nope, weeds just grow too fast in Florida for hand weeding big areas to be effective or feasible.

[Silas_Sancona]

23 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

@Silas_Sancona the small flat-growing spurge is no problem, the horrible stuff grows 1-2ft tall and grows rapidly through 2 inches of mulch like isn't even there.  Pulling them just spreads the seeds further, because they go from nothing to 1ft tall and seeding in a couple of days.  I spent a solid two weeks 2 years ago pulling weeds in the entire yard.  After days of hurting my knees, hands and back and courting heatstroke...it looked about the same as when I started.  Most of them had grown back through new seeds, because I disturbed the soil and sprouted more, or because I didn't get 100% of the weed's roots when I pulled them.  I would literally have to spend every day pulling weeds to keep ahead of them.  Nope, weeds just grow too fast in Florida for hand weeding big areas to be effective or feasible.

This part is truth.. And the more you disturb the soil, the more the weedy stuff fights back ...Which was why i gave up fighting it when in Bradenton, lol.. Know exactly which Spurge you're talking about.. It was 2nd only to Artillery Plant and Chamberbitter to take over every single plant in the nursery i worked at in Sarasota.. Pull it, hit it w/ X chemical? ..might knock the tops down long enough to pull out of the pots. Within a week or two?  full, to the brim ( and often taller than the desired plant itself, haha ).  In that sense, thankful for a thirstier climate.

If i'd stayed there, esp. if had a bigger slice of land to play with, i'd plant ground covers and native perennial stuff to fight back the weedy things..  Sunshine Mimosa, Ruellia humilis / carolinensis,  Peperomia obtusifolia ( locally sourced, vs. clones from warmer areas. hardy to 9B );  LyreLeaf Sage / Tropical Sage, Lemon Bacopa, etc.. Forget wasting a day / weekend, etc weeding.

Not sure if it will survive up there but Crosspetalum ilicifolium ( Quailberry / Holly Leaf Quailberry ) makes a nice ground cover / low mound also.

[Silas_Sancona]

5 hours ago, Merlyn said:

@Manalto around here they are perennials, but get killed off if we have a bad frost.  I just call all of them perennials, though some are worse at certain times of the year than others.  @Silas_Sancona the artillery ferns are the fastest spreaders, but 2,4-D mixed with a bit of Dawn dish detergent kills them D-E-D in a couple of days.  My biggest problem is the small one with the red stems, Thyme-leaved Spurge – Euphorbia serpyllifolia and maculata, maybe.  If one of those goes to seed it has about a 50000% strike rate and 2 weeks later there is a carpet of the stuff in a 10 foot diameter.  I wish I were joking...

I also managed to import two types of Wood Sorrel, a big leaf one about 2" leaves and a tiny one with 0.25" leaves.  Those are a pain too because the seeding is prolific and they are sometimes difficult to pull by hand due to the hidden underground bulb.

Just saw this online.. Not sure whether to laugh or curse the screen, hahaha🤣

[Merlyn]

8 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

This part is truth.. And the more you disturb the soil, the more the weedy stuff fights back ...Which was why i gave up fighting it when in Bradenton, lol.. Know exactly which Spurge you're talking about.. It was 2nd only to Artillery Plant and Chamberbitter to take over every single plant in the nursery i worked at in Sarasota.. Pull it, hit it w/ X chemical? ..might knock the tops down long enough to pull out of the pots. Within a week or two?  full, to the brim ( and often taller than the desired plant itself, haha ).  In that sense, thankful for a thirstier climate.

If i'd stayed there, esp. if had a bigger slice of land to play with, i'd plant ground covers and native perennial stuff to fight back the weedy things..  Sunshine Mimosa, Ruellia humilis / carolinensis,  Peperomia obtusifolia ( locally sourced, vs. clones from warmer areas. hardy to 9B );  LyreLeaf Sage / Tropical Sage, Lemon Bacopa, etc.. Forget wasting a day / weekend, etc weeding.

Not sure if it will survive up there but Crosspetalum ilicifolium ( Quailberry / Holly Leaf Quailberry ) makes a nice ground cover / low mound also.

Hah, Chamberbitter was the other one that I couldn't remember the name.  It isn't quite as bad here because it dies off in the winter.  If I spot it popping up around May then I can keep it from going wild.  The seeds also don't seem to fling off and float large distances if I pull it.

I like the looks of Peperomia, thanks for the suggestion!  I have neighbors who planted Ruellia in a corner bed.  Initially it looked like they had just planted weeds, but it does a good job of filling in their corner bed with nice flowers.  And it grows back when idiots turn the corner and drive over them...   

One that I've been trying is a purple/white Tradescantia zebrina, I found some growing in a veritable field along a bike trail.  In that area there were zero weeds, not even wavy-leafed basketgrass.  I grabbed a few pieces and planted it in my nursery area, since it didn't seem to be a "climber."  Other than pulling a few random pieces that try to get up and into pots, it has been very effective at cutting back weeds in the nursery area.  I'm reluctant to let it loose in the other shady spots, but I might pull a bunch and drop it in a shady corner and see what happens.

[JLM]

20 hours ago, amh said:

It is most likely a canna, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were a turmeric.

Does the leaf have any odor?

Not that i could tell, ill go check soon.

[JLM]

It smells like nothingness lol

[Manalto]

22 hours ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Yes, it is a warm season annual..  Not sure which is worse though, it, Artillery plant,   ..or Nutsedge. 

There's no love lost between Stachys floridana and me either. Around here (where it's known as rattlesnake weed) it's a contender for the top spot because of the structure of its underground tuber and how the threadlike roots break off from it when you try to pull the plant. I spent two days painstakingly lifting the soil to try to remove the root systems in my small front bed. A friend innocently asked if I thought I got them all. Some people know how to hurt a guy.

 

[amh]

4 hours ago, JLM said:

It smells like nothingness lol

Then it is a canna. 

Let the plant flower and save the seeds if you want.

[Silas_Sancona]

35 minutes ago, Manalto said:

There's no love lost between Stachys floridana and me either. Around here (where it's known as rattlesnake weed) it's a contender for the top spot because of the structure of its underground tuber and how the threadlike roots break off from it when you try to pull the plant. I spent two days painstakingly lifting the soil to try to remove the root systems in my small front bed. A friend innocently asked if I thought I got them all. Some people know how to hurt a guy.

 

Kind of torn with that one, lol.. Can see what you mean, but the flowers are ok.. and it's native.

As far as Nutsedge, don't ever try and pull it.. 1 plant suddenly becomes half a dozen when you do, and those tubers can form up to a foot below the surface. 

[D Palm]

Chamberbitter isn’t terribly hard to control. Johnson grass, crab grass, carpet grass, torpedo grass…I hate so much. The nearby cow pastures make it an everlasting problem.