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25G Foxtails at Palm Plantation


Breaktheory
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I came across some nice Foxtails at Palm Plantation…I’m going for one of these three but how much trunk do I really want while still in pot? 

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Hmmm... I would be wary of those as far as survivability. While they all look good right now from a growth standpoint,it appears that they were field grown,and just too recently potted up. ie -Dirt filled to the brim of the pot. Lower fronds just trimmed off. Parked in the shade... When you bring one home,plant it in full sun,and all the fronds burn up same as your royal,are you going to be happy? As a minimum,I would want to slide the pot off the rootball,take a look, and at least make sure the tree has lots of healthy roots visible at the outside edges of the rootball. If not... pass at any price.

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

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Mesa, Arizona

 

Temps between 29F and 115F each year

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2 hours ago, aztropic said:

Hmmm... I would be wary of those as far as survivability. While they all look good right now from a growth standpoint,it appears that they were field grown,and just too recently potted up. ie -Dirt filled to the brim of the pot. Lower fronds just trimmed off. Parked in the shade... When you bring one home,plant it in full sun,and all the fronds burn up same as your royal,are you going to be happy? As a minimum,I would want to slide the pot off the rootball,take a look, and at least make sure the tree has lots of healthy roots visible at the outside edges of the rootball. If not... pass at any price.

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

The woman seemed honest but who knows - when I asked about the shade she told me they’d just been moved over because of high winds and had been sitting in the sun before…the ones that are in the sun right now are much smaller but they do also have that large dirt mound - how do these look instead?

 

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I spend so much time using the "search" capability of this forum in the upper right to educate myself.  Then our members have so much knowledge you can rely on making choices, improving our palm successes and reducing expenses.  On this post, @aztropic for me, duplicates my climate as seen in his "signature" (29 to 115 deg. F), but his knowledge is priceless.

My first photo was a couple of months (9-21-2021) after purchasing this from a PT member here in So. Cal in July 2021 and I believe germinated in 2017.  Notice the spear that will be the same in photo #2 that has been opening up during the last 2+ months.  There are minimal burnt leaves seen as this has been outside under the canopy of a large California Pepper Tree 30+ ft. tall.   The oldest, lowest frond coming towards us off to the left was removed recently after becoming total brown.  In December when the temp's got to the lower 30's, all seedlings and marginal palms were moved into the garage or race car trailer with 200 watt drop light to raise the temp's by 10 deg. F.  I lost nothing this season due to low temp's but was ignorant by moving all of them each day out into the high 60's to low 70's day temps in full sun from 9 am to 3 pm.  The intense concentration of sun energy took about 3 weeks for me to see "SUNBURNING".  It will take somewhere between 1 and 2 years to go through growth cycles to get them back to green.

Photo #2 was taken today 5-8-2022.

In the original post, "I'm going for 1 of these 3", then new ones are posted for consideration.  When I "pot-up" palms as they get larger, I notice roots making it to the perimeter of the plastic container, so I would expect the most water intake to be along the inside of the container.  The nursery has created a "mud mound" above the container to trap the water at the trunk/dirt line/ roots and nothing to drain along the inside of the container.

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Survived Feb. 9, 1971 & Jan. 17, 1994 earthquakes   Before Palms, there was a special airplane

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Again...I would pick out the one you want and do a root check to be sure it wasn't just dug out of the field. Anytime I up pot my palms for sale from community pots,or community in the ground growing,I let them grow a full year in the new pot to be absolutely certain that they are fully rooted with roots growing out of the pot. That's what you want to see. Without a good root system to begin with,there's too much chance of failure when an average person plants it and gives it minimal care.

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

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Mesa, Arizona

 

Temps between 29F and 115F each year

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I think you should buy a couple of those a Encephalartos Lehmanii. Those are perfect size. They take awhile to get there then start to take off. 
 

-dale

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29 minutes ago, Billeb said:

I think you should buy a couple of those a Encephalartos Lehmanii. Those are perfect size. They take awhile to get there then start to take off. 
 

-dale

Agree.  They will be much more tolerant of your climate zone and can survive on less water during our drought years.   Drip water it once a week and an Encephalartos lehmannii will be happy.  On whether to get one of the foxtail, our friend from Arizona has already provided you the advice on how to assess the specimens you like.

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33.0782 North -117.305 West  at 72 feet elevation

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I personally don’t buy anything much bigger than a 3 gallon pot. I’ve always found that the palms I bought smaller end up winning in the end. Perhaps there are hormonal differences when they are younger and smaller when it comes to establishing a root system. I certainly do not know the answer to that but I bet there are people on here than do. Most of the common box store palms around here (foxtails being one of them) are fast growers and go from small to trunking in a few years. 

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Parrish, FL

Zone 9B

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4 hours ago, Billy said:

Roots sticking out the bottom is an indicator to me that she's a good palm who's ready to find a home. I try to buy my palms no bigger than 20g size (lots of ringed trunk in the pot is almost always a red flag to me) as they can be stunted, plus the smaller sized palms that I acquire always grow to be gorgeous specimens in our coastal climate. As for the foxtails, I'd say try to find a nice sun grown one, not necessarily a bomber and just watch her grow. 

Thanks for the tip which makes sense if too much trunk in a pot means it’s been sitting there getting pot bound and stunted….

The advice I hear without fail in regards to palm size is that the small ones always grow up to look the best - this does of course require a bit of patience and hard to resist large trunking specimens if they fit in a truck

 

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5 hours ago, Billeb said:

I think you should buy a couple of those a Encephalartos Lehmanii. Those are perfect size. They take awhile to get there then start to take off. 
 

-dale

Those Encephalartos are nice and they have some big ones too - Riverside is a hike but they do have some unusual stuff that seems well taken care of.

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5 hours ago, aztropic said:

Again...I would pick out the one you want and do a root check to be sure it wasn't just dug out of the field. Anytime I up pot my palms for sale from community pots,or community in the ground growing,I let them grow a full year in the new pot to be absolutely certain that they are fully rooted with roots growing out of the pot. That's what you want to see. Without a good root system to begin with,there's too much chance of failure when an average person plants it and gives it minimal care.

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

Great advice thank you - I’m heading back next week armed with some knowledge now…not too many rings on the trunk, roots coming out the bottom. Seems unlikely they would be willing to pull it out of the container but I can stick my fingers in and do my best to have a look around the sides as well

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4 minutes ago, Breaktheory said:

Thanks for the tip which makes sense if too much trunk in a pot means it’s been sitting there getting pot bound and stunted.

 

Too much trunk for the pot size, without stunting, is usually a sign of a  recently potted field grown palm. Nothing wrong with that, as long as the seller has taken the time to regenerate an adequate root system. In the CA desert,you shouldn't start out with a compromised root system. Burned and dried fronds, due to lack of water, will be the result...

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

Mesa, Arizona

 

Temps between 29F and 115F each year

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@TheMadScientist

When you said “.The intense concentration of sun energy took about 3 weeks for me to see "SUNBURNING".  It will take somewhere between 1 and 2 years to go through growth cycles to get them back to green.”

Does this mean that future frond growth will have been affected to emerge and burn for 1-2 years or just that the leaves that burned will take 1-2 years of growth to be replaced by new green?

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22 minutes ago, Breaktheory said:

Great advice thank you - I’m heading back next week armed with some knowledge now…not too many rings on the trunk, roots coming out the bottom. Seems unlikely they would be willing to pull it out of the container but I can stick my fingers in and do my best to have a look around the sides as well

Not unreasonable at all to take a look at the roots on the palm you are seriously ready to buy. On a well rooted palm,the rootball will pull out of the pot without damaging anything.Don't even have to pull it completely out of the pot. Lay the tree on its side and just pull it out 6 inches. You will be able to tell if it's well rooted,although on a 25 gallon pot,it's probably a 2 man operation... One person holds the pot from moving,while the other gives a tug on the trunk to get the rootball to slide out a bit. If palm trunk starts to pull out and surrounding soil just crumbles,it is not a palm you want to buy anyways,and would be your justification for wanting a look at the roots in the first place.

 

aztropic

Mesa,Arizona

Edited by aztropic
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Mesa, Arizona

 

Temps between 29F and 115F each year

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Honestly even if those foxtails were pot grown it's typical that they'll have a thinner trunk. I like to start palms small most of the time since they have time to grow to their full potential. Palm Plantation is a great nursery to me. Especially since they're close to me and most of the palms already handle the same climate as mine.

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